Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)

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aigomorla

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First, Do you want to proof that Genoa is the world record breaker ?

id like to see some world records which Genoa has broken.
Because all i can find are these:

None of which are PCMark / Cinabench / PassMark / Timespy / GHZ world record.
They lost Cinabench recently and yes these are broken on super exotic cooling, but its not like you can't put a Genoa on LN2 either. ThreadRipper on Exotic cooling had the WR, but lost it reciently.

Id like to honestly see what world records Genoa has and actually been credited for.
 
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Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
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id like to see some world records which Genoa has broken.
Because all i can find are these:

None of which are PCMark / Cinabench / PassMark / Timespy / GHZ world record.
They lost Cinabench recently and yes these are broken on super exotic cooling, but its not like you can't put a Genoa on LN2 either. ThreadRipper on Exotic cooling had the WR, but lost it reciently.

Id like to honestly see what world records Genoa has and actually been credited for.
Here for one. Do I need to google for more ????

 

Exist50

Platinum Member
Aug 18, 2016
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In the first place, I have not been caught lying, except in your opinion.
Then might I refresh your memory:
The 12700F sucks the power of 2 5950x's and get creamed in total performance 4x by 2 5950x's, or 2x one on one.
And I called you out on that for trying to manipulate your own claims even a few comments later:
You've been consistently claiming your 12700f consumes 300W, and even directly comparing it to AMD's PPT or even TDP values. Now "whoops" maybe it was actually 180W...
Oh, or the time you were ranting because someone pointed out your source said the opposite of your claim.

So, you were saying something about denial?
And I don't hate Intel
You honestly think anyone believes that? Lol.
Oh, not to mention Intel laying people off due to losing income, especially in servers. I know you are trying to justify your employment, but please get real, and admit what is going on.
Hah, my employment is neither with Intel, or contingent on whatever they're doing. And I've been one of the loudest in calling out their boneheadedness. But to you, anyone not foaming at the mouth must be an Intel shill.
denial is a symptom of mental illness.
So what would you call insisting that Zen 4 is >25% IPC over Zen 3? Or are you going to finally post these elusive benchmarks you always claim to have, but can never produce...

Anyway, that's enough feeding the trolls from me. This was a waste of time proving what everyone already knows.
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
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Then might I refresh your memory:

And I called you out on that for trying to manipulate your own claims even a few comments later:

So, you were saying something about denial?

You honestly think anyone believes that? Lol.

Hah, my employment is neither with Intel, or contingent on whatever they're doing. And I've been one of the loudest in calling out their boneheadedness. But to you, anyone not foaming at the mouth must be an Intel shill.

So what would you call insisting that Zen 4 is >25% IPC over Zen 3? Or are you going to finally post these elusive benchmarks you always claim to have, but can never produce...

Anyway, that's enough feeding the trolls from me. This was a waste of time.
My last reply. I have kill-a-watt views of the useage. And I had log files proving why (using avx-512 which we know sucks power) but you denied all my proof.

In my opinion, you are the troll, as nothing you have said in this thread has been acknowledged my anybody else.

And an Intel employee debating AMD stats ? We are supposed to believe you ? Trolling is what I call it.
 

Exist50

Platinum Member
Aug 18, 2016
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And I had log files proving why (using avx-512 which we know sucks power) but you denied all my proof.
Yet you posted no such proof, nor was anyone ever able to reproduce it. This all being clearly documented in the thread I linked. The very chip you claimed to have used is power limited to half the number you gave.
And an Intel employee debating AMD stats ? We are supposed to believe you ?
So you're seriously insisting that Zen 4 is 25%, 30%, etc. IPC over Zen 3? You're so far beyond reason that you reject established facts. Hahahaha. You know what, I change my mind. It was worth the effort to see this spectacle. The stage is all yours.
 

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
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id like to see some world records which Genoa has broken.
Because all i can find are these:

None of which are PCMark / Cinabench / PassMark / Timespy / GHZ world record.
They lost Cinabench recently and yes these are broken on super exotic cooling, but its not like you can't put a Genoa on LN2 either. ThreadRipper on Exotic cooling had the WR, but lost it reciently.

Id like to honestly see what world records Genoa has and actually been credited for.

Genoa is the best performer in CB and all these benchmarks, only a fool can say otherwise, now found me a single user, pro or amateurish, that use LN2 with his set up, you wont find a single one in the whole earth, guess that you re just showing how rabidly you re some kind of Intel unconditional supporter.

So you're seriously insisting that Zen 4 is 25%, 30%, etc. IPC over Zen 3? You're so far beyond reason that you reject established facts. Hahahaha. You know what, I change my mind. It was worth the effort to see this spectacle. The stage is all yours.

You are moving the goal posts here, we know what is the IPC improvements as well as frequency, i showed you that perfs expectations from the craziest speculator, MLID, were about fullfilled and that those from RGT were very accurate, i posted numbers of their expectations and the final numbers.

You re just living in denial, at the end i ll believe Mark when he said that you re not a regular forumer but rather some stealthy viral marketer...
 
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Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
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Yet you posted no such proof, nor was anyone ever able to reproduce it. This all being clearly documented in the thread I linked. The very chip you claimed to have used is power limited to half the number you gave.

So you're seriously insisting that Zen 4 is 25%, 30%, etc. IPC over Zen 3? You're so far beyond reason that you reject established facts. Hahahaha. You know what, I change my mind. It was worth the effort to see this spectacle. The stage is all yours.
The only reason that you believe that the chip in question is power limited is that Intel says so. No actual proof. That would be typical of an Intel employee. And I had proof, but it is only maintained on the web for a short time, and you refused to look at it.

as For Zen 4 IPC, I never claimed a number, just that its a LOT faster than Zen 3.
 

Exist50

Platinum Member
Aug 18, 2016
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You re just living in denial, at the end i ll believe Mark when he said that you re not a regular forumer but rather some stealthy viral marketer...
Yes, me and all the reviewers living in denial about what you could take 10 seconds to google and confirm. But I think that's enough feeding the trolls for one day. Just becomes sad at some point.
 

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
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Yes, me and all the reviewers living in denial about what you could take 10 seconds to google and confirm. But I think that's enough feeding the trolls for one day. Just becomes sad at some point.

But i googled, i provided the speculated numbers from both MLID and RGT, wich were the only speculation sources, about their perfs expectations, and i compared to tests at Computerbase.

So while i m using factual numbers you re left with hollow sentences to negate the obvious, that as wild as their expectation could be they still were in the ballpark, particularly RGT who predicted the perfs very accurately.

Look to me that Zen 4 perform much better than what you hoped for, that s the only way to explain your endless babbling.
 
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aigomorla

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Genoa is the best performer in CB and all these benchmarks, only a fool can say otherwise, now found me a single user, pro or amateurish, that use LN2 with his set up, you wont find a single one in the whole earth, guess that you re just showing how rabidly you re some kind of Intel unconditional supporter.

Sigh... can you please tell me what a World Record is and means?
To my understanding, it meant top record in the world regardless of what means you went to achieve it does it not?
And i am a intel supporter, im also a AMD supporter, and a Nvidia supporter, and heck i even support Apple at times too.
I don't take sides, and always keep that line of neutrality at all times.

So again id like to see some World Records being achieved under any methods used.
Because its not fair when ThreadRipper had it, and flaunted it, and now they lost it, people calling it foul.

Genoa is the best performer in CB and all these benchmarks

Really? until thee who shall not be named broke it on a LN2 bench to get World Record.
Again WORLD RECORD
Or are you denying it?

Please... or you gonna call the FOUL card like everyone has been doing lately...

Can we just accept it that AMD lost the R23 World Record and stop calling the other side FOUL or Cheating?
 
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Markfw

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Sigh... can you please tell me what a World Record is and means?
To my understanding, it meant top record in the world regardless of what means you went to achieve it does it not?
And i am a intel supporter, im also a AMD supporter, and a Nvidia supporter, and heck i even support Apple at times too.
I don't take sides, and always keep that line of neutrality at all times.

So again id like to see some World Records being achieved under any methods used.
Because its not fair when ThreadRipper had it, and flaunted it, and now they lost it, people calling it foul.



Really? until thee who shall not be named broke it on a LN2 bench to get World Record.
Again WORLD RECORD
Or are you denying it?
Please show me where it says on HWBOT : Cinabench R23 Genoa as first place...
Please...
In what universe does using LN2 constitute a REAL world record ? Especially when nobody has used LN2 on Genoa ? The only reason the Intel crowd is using LN2, was because that CPU is such a piece of crap.
 

soresu

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denial is a symptom of mental illness
Or bad information due to echo chamber effect caused by continuous exposure to a highly biased social structure.

Such as a competing corporate culture in this particular context 😎

Either way it aint a river in Egypt 😂🤣😆
 

aigomorla

CPU, Cases&Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
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REAL world record

Is asking for proof on world records not allowed?
Do we have a "Realistic World Record" or a "Weighted World Record" or a "politically correct world record"?

Id like to see a World Record.

In what universe does using LN2 constitute a REAL world record ?

When it attains what the definition describes.


Why do you guys need to be so stuck up to keep calling it foul when it did exactly what it did?
This is what aggravates me.
Just say YES, and we all can move along.
 

Thunder 57

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Aug 19, 2007
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Decode is the most irrelevant part ever for fat opcache cores and you know it.
Stop being so obnoxiously silly.

Once again, you don't have to be so obtuse.
Well, people working at DCAI are all like you but I digress.

Well tell us something dude. You keep saying Apple like. We all know Zen 5 will be wider. How much? 5 wide? 6? 8? Give us a hint of something and people might listen. Calling people obnoxious and obtuse when challenged doesn't give you credibility.
 

aigomorla

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Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
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Sigh... can you please tell me what a World Record is and means?
To my understanding, it meant top record in the world regardless of what means you went to achieve it does it not?
And i am a intel supporter, im also a AMD supporter, and a Nvidia supporter.
I don't take sides, and always keep that line of neutrality at all times.

96 cores against 60 cores and with comparable IPC, i think that the conclusion doesnt even need more than a fraction of a second to come to the 100% sure conclusion.

FI Mark posted a CB run of about 83 000 pts at stock 360W with a 96C CPU, can you tell us how much a STOCK 60C 8490H SPR does.?.

Here it is, 85 000 pts for 2 x 8490H, so how much for a single CPU..?..

Cinebench-R23-benchmark-chart-5.jpg




 

adroc_thurston

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Jul 2, 2023
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True, but you don't get dual socket Threadrippers so it might be difficult to match the MT performance of a 2S Genoa system.
Eh various XOC leaderboards usually have 1p divisions so it's all gucci still.
Well tell us something dude
Firestorm.png

It's literally this, that's how you build an ultrawide core.
Apple just arrived there first (and got stuck there, for obvious reasons).
 
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aigomorla

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96 cores against 60 cores and with comparable IPC, i think that the conclusion doesnt even need more than a fraction of a second to come to the 100% sure conclusion.

But is that a world record?
Does it claim world record?
Has it been recorded as the world record?


Does it satisfy the definition of World Record?
Your claiming "oh data shows..."

Data shows i'll never win the lottery either... but will i stop trying?

Can we just say OK... they don't have the world record, and move on.
This is honestly all i am asking for.

Your insulting the many hours these guys spend trying to get that crown.
I really do not appreciate that, especially when i used to be on that bench table.
This is why i am holding my ground firm on this.
If someone came to you and called your hobby junk / fake / so unrealistic and unproductive... how would you honestly reply?

And this whole rabbid intel supporter...
I really think SPR is a pile of dung... especially with a refresh coming out end of this year.
Im also holding out for Storm Peak, before i finalize my HEDT.
But will i give credit to where its due? Yes.
AMD lost its WR, which was held by 9474F, to SPR.
Can we stop pretending they still hold a WR, and just say its a better performer in general without the words WORLD RECORD.
 
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Markfw

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But is that a world record?
Does it claim world record?
Has it been recorded as the world record?


Does it satisfy the definition of World Record?
Your claiming "oh data shows..."

Data shows i'll never win the lottery either... but will i stop trying?

Can we just say OK... they don't have the world record, and move on.
This is honestly all i am asking for.

Your insulting the many hours these guys spend trying to get that crown.
I really do not appreciate that, especially when i used to be on that bench table.
This is why i am holding my ground firm on this.
Soo. I posted benchmarks and links to benchmarks that show that at STOCK it wins the world record and using LN2 there is no statististics. Thats not a fair comparison and you know it. And in the real world, it will never use LN2, its just a show that means nothing to 99% of everybody, but you defend it since you think Intel is king. THEY ARE NOT in the server world, get over it !
 

Abwx

Lifer
Apr 2, 2011
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But is that a world record?
Does it claim world record?
Has it been recorded as the world record?


Does it satisfy the definition of World Record?
Your claiming "oh data shows..."

Data shows i'll never win the lottery either... but will i stop trying?

Can we just say OK... they don't have the world record, and move on.
This is honestly all i am asking for.

Your insulting the many hours these guys spend trying to get that crown.
I really do not appreciate that, especially when i used to be on that bench table.
This is why i am holding my ground firm on this.

You know perfectly well that 2 x 96C Epyc should do around 160 000 pts at 720W CPU power, FTR a single 8490H use 530W on Cinebench, actually we dont even need a 2 x 96C screenshot, Mark provided the basis to iterate the expected score.

If you cant reach this basic conclusion then you have nothing to do in a technical forum, find a hobby that suit you better than CPU tech, sorry, but it cant be said otherwise when facing such a denial.