Your ideas for better entry level half height/low profile ready gamer video cards

[cbn]

I have noticed for at least 3 months now the the Nvidia GK 208 based GT 630 --> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gt-630/specifications is the most common low profile ready/half height card in the $35 sale price category.

I own an ASUS GT 630 2GB GDDR3 version myself and while it performs well at 1080p/low details in games like Team Fortress 2 (even with OPEN GL in Linux) I find myself thinking surely one of the OEMs can make something better for around the same amount of money.

Recently while perusing the Nvidia GT 720 specifications I noticed a GDDR5 version listed --> http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gt-720/specifications

So how about a low cost GT 720 based on 512 MB of GDDR5? Maybe even one based on some of the older slow GDDR5?

What ideas do you have for a cheaper higher performing half height/low profile casual gamer video card?

 

[Leyawiin]

Don't know what your definition of "cheaper" is but a $140 low profile GTX 750 Ti is about the only one that could remotely be classified as a gaming GPU.

 

[cbn]

Don't know what your definition of "cheaper" is but a $140 low profile GTX 750 Ti is about the only one that could remotely be classified as a gaming GPU.

$50 and under (ideally $35 or less on sale, including any rebates) for a half height ready/low profile video card that might be used in a living room SFF computer:

Most likely coupled to an older Core 2 SFF System (which don't have good iGPUs, but are very inexpensive): http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2404864

And possibly augmented with a cheap Xeon LGA 771 to LGA 775 quad core conversion, some details in this thread --> http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2408974

 

[cbn]

Any opinions on 512MB GDDR5 VRAM coupled to a GPU with 192 Kepler CUDA cores and 64 bit memory bus (aka GT 720)?

I figure such a video card is essentially half a GTX 650 or GT 740.....so half the VRAM of those cards (which typically come with 1GB) should be sufficient.

 

[toyota]

hmm never even heard of a modern card with 512mb vram. on Nvidias site the minimum ram listed for the GT 720 is 1gb.

 

[cbn]

Looking ahead, there is also the small die Maxwell desktop video cards to think about.

Looking at the specs for GM108 (Mobile Maxwell) --> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GeForce_800M_series#GeForce_800M_.288xxM.29_Series I'm thinking those might come with 256 and 384 Maxwell CUDA cores (coupled to the 64 bit memory bus).

Any ideas for memory specs or cooling for the processor?

Maybe a "fast" passively cooled Maxwell half height video card with a reasonable amount of GDDR5?

 

[NTMBK]

An APU with DDR4. Honestly, things like the GT 630 are utter rubbish, and only worth it if you are upgrading an existing PC to add e.g. HDMI output, or reduced power consumption. Just look at the memory specs on the Kepler model. It has a 64 bit DDR3 memory bus. That is equivalent to running an APU on single channel memory, i.e. an utter disaster. Even Intel integrated graphics probably perform better.

If you want a compact gaming PC, get an APU. If you are not bothered about gaming, then probably any of the existing modern cards will be fine. Just make sure it has hardware decoders for modern video formats. (e.g. the R7 240 and 250 do not, but the 250X does.)

 

[cbn]

Just look at the memory specs on the Kepler model. It has a 64 bit DDR3 memory bus. That is equivalent to running an APU on single channel memory, i.e. an utter disaster.

It is not quite the same because the APU does need to share memory bandwidth with the cpu and the GT 630 doesn't.

 

[toyota]

this has to be one of the most nonsensical threads I have ever seen.

 

[cbn]

hmm never even heard of a modern card with 512mb vram. on Nvidias site the minimum ram listed for the GT 720 is 1gb.

I brought this up because I often see these low end cards with relatively large amounts of very slow VRAM.

But if a person is running a game on 1366 x 768 low details or maybe 1080p low details (for more casual games like TF2) I don't think much VRAM would be needed, Faster VRAM would help though.

 

[HeXen]

I bought a Geforce 210 low profile card for my MAME cabinet and it's worse than IGPU.

 

[NTMBK]

It is not quite the same because the APU does need to share memory bandwidth with the cpu and the GT 630 doesn't.

Not quite the same, no, but not far off.

But yeah, if I had to design a half height "upgrade my old Dell" card, I would probably end up with something along the lines of the R7 250- 128-bit GDDR5, powered by the PCIe slot, low cost. Gives you slightly better GPU performance than a Kaveri APU with a low cost GPU, and would probably extend the life of a Core 2 Duo HTPC for a few more years.

 

[NTMBK]

I brought this up because I often see these low end cards with relatively large amounts of very slow VRAM.

But if a person is running a game on 1366 x 768 low details or maybe 1080p low details (for more casual games like TF2) I don't think much VRAM would be needed, Faster VRAM would help though.

Nah, no way I would ever go below 1GB on a modern card. Modern games just have too much data, even with low quality textures and models. Look at something like Assassin's Creed Unity, and the number of people in a crowd. 512MB is just going to choke on that.

1GB GDDR5 is probably the sweet spot, I reckon. Definitely avoid those 2GB DDR3 ones like the plague!

 

[cbn]

If you want a compact gaming PC, get an APU

A compact casual gaming system with an APU is going to be more expensive than the used or refurbed Core 2 based SFF systems I am thiking about.

Example: Used SFF Dell or HP with Core 2 duo/2GB RAM/80 GB HDD is $50 shipped or less (from a reputable seller on ebay) without OS. Upgrade that to a E8400 for $12, E8500 for $15 or Xeon X3323 Quad core with LGA 771 to LGA 775 adapter for around $18. With a $30 or $35 card the total is only around $100.

In contrast, a Mini-ITX FM2+ board starts at $78.99 After rebate ---> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...ame=Mini%20ITX

And that is just for the motherboard alone. So you can see that the SFF living room PCs I am referring to in this thread are in two completely different price categories.

 

[cbn]

In a nutshell, considering the good value of a used or refurb Core 2 based SFF system (especially with an economical CPU upgrade I mentioned in post #14) I think there needs to be a good low cost half height video card to go along with that.

 

[Yuriman]

A Core2 system is cheaper, but also slower. You're paying less and getting less. Are the Core2 systems mini-ITX sized?

How well does a GT630 compare with what you'd find in a 6800K or 7600?

 

[f1sherman]

Those 771 -> 775 Xeons are super sweet.
I wish I heard about them before.

As for super-cheap discrete video card, I don't see such a great offer on that side.

GT 720 would be nice if it wasn't bw (DDR3) limited.
And yes, you would still need 1GB of VRAM. Low resolution or no. With DDR5 it should even run Far Cry 4 @720p. (minimum being GTX 650 @1080p)

 

[cbn]

A Core2 system is cheaper, but also slower. You're paying less and getting less.

Going by passmark scores a E8400 is slightly faster than a A6-5400K:


E8400: 2170 CPU marks --> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core2+Duo+E8400+@+3.00GHz&id=955

A6-5400K: 2146 CPU marks --> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+A6-5400K+APU


An E8500 is slightly slower than a A6-6400K:


E8500: 2313 CPU marks --> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core2+Duo+E8500+@+3.16GHz&id=5

A6-6400K: 2379 CPU marks --> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+A6-6400K+APU


So that is a really good value IMO for the Core 2 based dual cores.

 

[cbn]

Are the Core2 systems mini-ITX sized?

The Dell SFF pictured in post #3 is only 10 liters in displacement. (Not sure what motherboard form factor, probably proprietary)

And the Dell Optiplex 755 version of that has been sale as low as $68 shipped with Windows 7 --> http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=36876761&postcount=33 (But is typically $90 to $110 shipped on Newegg with Windows 7)

Like I mentioned before though, SFF Core 2 computers without OS are often $50 or less shipped on ebay.

 

[cbn]

How well does a GT630 compare with what you'd find in a 6800K or 7600?

It has 384 Kepler Cores @ 902 Mhz, but is limited by memory bandwidth. (The ASUS version that I bought for $30 AR has 64 bit GDDR3 1800).

In contrast, the top APUs can use up to 128 bit DDR3 2400/officially 2133 (but some of this is shared by the CPU).

In any event, I would like to see this category of low end video card improve since the cpu power to go along with it is so cheap and affordable. 2GB of VRAM on $30 (after rebate) card? For the same amount of money I would be happier with 1GB (or less) of some faster VRAM even if it only had 192 Kepler cores,

 

[superrockie]

Don't get a gt 720 it's pretty [crap]. I have a quadro k610m which is comparable in spec(192cores,64bit bus,1 gig gddr5) and it struggles to play games at 1080p at the lowest settings.


Please watch the profanity in the technical forums. It is not permitted here.

-Rvenger

 

[toyota]

gt 720 is pure garbage. even the old 9600 gt is faster for crying out loud.

 

[cbn]

Don't get a gt 720 it's pretty [crap]. I have a quadro k610m which is comparable in spec(192cores,64bit bus,1 gig gddr5) and it struggles to play games at 1080p at the lowest settings.

That GPU has its GDDR5 clocked at 2600- Mhz --> http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-Quadro-K610M.98902.0.html (That is basically slower than 128 bit card with DDR3 1334)

But even if a GT 720 came with GDDR5 @ 5 GHz, I would still only expect it to be a 720p " low details" for the more demanding games. However, that would be fine with me provided it is cheap enough.

 

[Blue_Max]

If you don't already have the Dell SFF rig, don't bother wasting your money on it.
Something like a Shuttle XPC barebone will allow a standard size cheapo video card, or you could get something like this tiny bad-boy: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856164009

 

[cbn]

or you could get something like this tiny bad-boy: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856164009

That is almost $250 for a barebones (that still needs memory, storage and OS) with a 1.7 Ghz/2.7 Ghz Richland AMD APU.

Totally different price category than a Core 2 based SFF box.

And far as that CPU goes, I'm surprised it actually scores worse than a Athlon 5350 in passmark (though the mobile A8 should do better in single thread due to the 2.7 Ghz turbo):

A8-5545M APU: 2532 CPU marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+A8-5545M+APU

Athlon 5350 APU: 2608 cpu marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+Athlon+5350+APU+with+Radeon+R3&id=2195

Xeon X3323 (a cheap little LGA 771 quad core that is compatible with almost any Core 2 based SFF pre-built by using $2 or $3 adapter accompanied by a minor socket modification): 3428 cpu marks http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Xeon+X3323+@+2.50GHz