Your go to stains & varnishes for refinishing wood

[z1ggy]

Specifically inside the home, and for stairs.

Just ripped up some carpet off my stairs, pleasantly revealing some decent stairs under it. There's some old paint and what not left over on them, which I'll be sanding off tonight.

I'm wondering what the best quality stains and varnishes are, because I've never done stairs before. I've done furniture, but that's different because you're not walking on it.

 

[highland145]

Bona. Most of the house is done with it. Water based, fast drying, no smell. Can walk on in 4hrs, wearing socks.

 

[z1ggy]

Bona. Most of the house is done with it. Water based, fast drying, no smell. Can walk on in 4hrs, wearing socks.

Have any experience with Rust Oleum stains and varnishes? I believe they have some water based ones, too.

Also, I have a railing that seemed to be stained and varnished, but not in a color that would match what I do the stairs. How do I go about prepping it so it will be able to accept the stain I'm putting on the stairs? I assume I'd just sand it down with a larger grit sand paper until I get any current varnish/stain off?

Lastly, I've read that you need to do a very fine grit paper sand on the stained wood, prior to putting varnish down. Is this really needed? Does it apply to water based stains?

 

[highland145]

Have any experience with Rust Oleum stains and varnishes? I believe they have some water based ones, too.

Also, I have a railing that seemed to be stained and varnished, but not in a color that would match what I do the stairs. How do I go about prepping it so it will be able to accept the stain I'm putting on the stairs? I assume I'd just sand it down with a larger grit sand paper until I get any current varnish/stain off?

Lastly, I've read that you need to do a very fine grit paper sand on the stained wood, prior to putting varnish down. Is this really needed? Does it apply to water based stains?

Disclaimer: I paid to have my floors/stairs done. Pretty sure we have some pros here.

Have only used minwax stains for furniture. I would imagine rust oleum would be fine if it's for floors.

Assuming oak. Depending on the railings, it could be a PITA to get the old finish off/out of the wood grain. You would need to start with a heavy grit paper and work up to a 220 after the color is gone. Work with the grain. You will need to sand with the higher grit to get the scratches out of the wood. If you don't, they will be noticeable when you stain. Yes, you'll need to sand off all of the old finish.

Wood "feathers" when you sand it. So when you stain it (get it wet), you raise the grain and it feels rough. If it were a piece of furniture, I let the 1st coat of poly lock it in and lightly sand that down before the 2nd coat. Don't know if that's "appropriate" but it works. As far as floors, I doubt the pros are sanding after staining. Hopefully some will chime in.

If they are pine, it doesn't take the stain evenly. Some like the look. I don't so you would need a pre stain.

 

[z1ggy]

Disclaimer: I paid to have my floors/stairs done. Pretty sure we have some pros here.

Have only used minwax stains for furniture. I would imagine rust oleum would be fine if it's for floors.

Assuming oak. Depending on the railings, it could be a PITA to get the old finish off/out of the wood grain. You would need to start with a heavy grit paper and work up to a 220 after the color is gone. Work with the grain. You will need to sand with the higher grit to get the scratches out of the wood. If you don't, they will be noticeable when you stain. Yes, you'll need to sand off all of the old finish.

Wood "feathers" when you sand it. So when you stain it (get it wet), you raise the grain and it feels rough. If it were a piece of furniture, I let the 1st coat of poly lock it in and lightly sand that down before the 2nd coat. Don't know if that's "appropriate" but it works. As far as floors, I doubt the pros are sanding after staining. Hopefully some will chime in.

If they are pine, it doesn't take the stain evenly. Some like the look. I don't so you would need a pre stain.

Okay. Well it may be worth trying to get it all off, if not I may just see if I can buy an untreated railing and start from scratch.

I'll take a pic and post of what the stairs are. Hard to tell if it's pine or oak, but the natural color seems to be more of a redish tint, so I'm guessing it may not be oak.

 

[Anubis]

this IMO is the best prestain you can get
https://charlesneilwoodworking.3dca...e-Color-Conditioner--Blotch-Control_p_47.html

as for the wood on your stairs, depending on when it was built it may just be pine if it has always had carpet, if it at some point was not and they put carpet over it its prob oak, pine is soft and would not normally be used for a open stair

ive always used the minwax stains, I used a gel stain when I did my stairs

 

[z1ggy]

this IMO is the best prestain you can get
https://charlesneilwoodworking.3dca...e-Color-Conditioner--Blotch-Control_p_47.html

as for the wood on your stairs, depending on when it was built it may just be pine if it has always had carpet, if it at some point was not and they put carpet over it its prob oak, pine is soft and would not normally be used for a open stair

ive always used the minwax stains, I used a gel stain when I did my stairs

House was built 1961, hard to tell if it's always had carpet or not. If it is pine, will I need to condition the wood then? What will happen if I don't?

 

[RearAdmiral]

I did the same-ish thing to my stairs. I tore the carpet off and found filthy pine stairs. I sanded the heck out of them and used minwax pre stain conditioner since it is pine, then minwax english chestnut for 2 coats. Next up was 3 coats of water based Bona poly. This turned out awesome. I also did 2 coats of killz primer on the risers/stringers followed by 2 coats of paint. I also did the same with some quarter round for the stringers.

It was a decent amount of work, but it was very cheap and the results are fantastic.

You should do half the stairs at once or every 2 and skip one depending on if you can deal with that.

http://imgur.com/a/LZSqH

 

[highland145]

House was built 1961, hard to tell if it's always had carpet or not. If it is pine, will I need to condition the wood then? What will happen if I don't?

Splotchy.

If it is pine, you'll need to be careful with tracking dirt on it. It's softer than oak.

 

[z1ggy]

I did the same-ish thing to my stairs. I tore the carpet off and found filthy pine stairs. I sanded the heck out of them and used minwax pre stain conditioner since it is pine, then minwax english chestnut for 2 coats. Next up was 3 coats of water based Bona poly. This turned out awesome. I also did 2 coats of killz primer on the risers/stringers followed by 2 coats of paint. I also did the same with some quarter round for the stringers.

It was a decent amount of work, but it was very cheap and the results are fantastic.

You should do half the stairs at once or every 2 and skip one depending on if you can deal with that.

http://imgur.com/a/LZSqH

Yeah I'll have to do every other one, let those dry up over night, and finish the others the next day.

Did you use a semi or satin varnish? I don't want them too shiny, but I don't want a dull look either. I figure semi would be okay, especially because my cabinets down there have a semi on them.

Splotchy.


If it is pine, you'll need to be careful with tracking dirt on it. It's softer than oak.

Yeah, based on pictures I've looked up online, I'm inclined to think they are pine. I mean, if it happens to be red oak, conditioning can't hurt, right?

 

[jaedaliu]

like highland and anubis, I've only used minwax to stain. For varnish, I like to use minwax polyurethane to seal. A couple layers with light sanding in between should do the trick. Keeping people off the stairs for 2 - 3 days as you prep, stain, and seal 2x might be difficult if you only have 1 stairwell.

The difficulty with pine is that it's soft. I remember when we tore out the carpet in the downstairs of our frat house, and it exposed beautiful ash (also soft) boards. We had them stained and sealed, and they were all dented over the next couple years. (we didn't realize at the time that plywood wasn't used in floor structure at the time so we wasted money prettying dentable floors.) Your poly (or whatever you use) seal will protect the wood from scratches, but I don't know how well pine is going to stand up to stilettos up and down the stairs.

 

[highland145]

Yeah, based on pictures I've looked up online, I'm inclined to think they are pine. I mean, if it happens to be red oak, conditioning can't hurt, right?

No need. Oak stains well.

.....but I don't know how well pine is going to stand up to stilettos up and down the stairs.

Pics of z1ggy in said stilettos....

 

[Anubis]

all wood needs a prestain, ALL OF IT, everything will blotch. some worse then others


and yes the main issue with pine is that its soft, which is why its generally not used for exposed flooring

 

[z1ggy]

No need. Oak stains well.

Pics of z1ggy in said stilettos....

Ohhhhhh you know me, on Friday night's I really like to dress up sexy.

Okay, I will post some pics to see what you guys think once the job is done, hopefully by the end of the weekends. Going to take longer because it's the only stairwell to my basement, so I will have to do every other stair so I can still go do laundry and whatnot.

 

[highland145]

all wood needs a prestain, ALL OF IT, everything will blotch. some worse then others

Oak splotchy, awesome. Pine splotchy, D:

Not the best example but part of our refinished floors (1937 house) and my Fokker project.

The cherry cabinets, no splotchy, look awesome too.

 

[RearAdmiral]

Yeah I'll have to do every other one, let those dry up over night, and finish the others the next day.

Did you use a semi or satin varnish? I don't want them too shiny, but I don't want a dull look either. I figure semi would be okay, especially because my cabinets down there have a semi on them.



Yeah, based on pictures I've looked up online, I'm inclined to think they are pine. I mean, if it happens to be red oak, conditioning can't hurt, right?

I think I used the satin. I didn't really want a glossy look at all. Scratches and junk will show up so much easier with more gloss. Even with satin it doesn't look dull by any means, it looks nice and natural to me. Especially with some of the "defects" in my pine stairs.

 

[z1ggy]

So I just got done sanding the stairs a bit. Couple issues. One, there looks like.. Stains on the wood. Almost like water marks?

Secondly, I am using this dremel tool with a sanding attachment on it. It sucks.

and leaves stairs with paint on them still like this:

Does HD or Lowe's rent quality sanders? What can I do get these sanded down nicely. For now the project is on hold until I can sand them.

Oh and I bought Minwax stain and poly, all in one. I figure it will save me some time, and it definitely saved me money.

 

[highland145]

Water stains? NO. There's a message in there...somewhere.
What are you going to use the basement for?
You need more sanding power. Woot, a new tool. Belt sander at a minimum.
You might be trying to make a silk purse....I see a lot of work there.
Looks like the drywall guy did a good job.

 

[z1ggy]

Water stains? NO. There's a message in there...somewhere.
What are you going to use the basement for?
You need more sanding power. Woot, a new tool. Belt sander at a minimum.
You might be trying to make a silk purse....I see a lot of work there.
Looks like the drywall guy did a good job.

Okay so that'll sand out? Yeah I figured as much. How many amps would I need to get the job done?

Do hardware stores rent these tools? I may need this again someday...But for $100 to use it once and maybe not again for like .. 4-5 years... ehhhhhh....

 

[highland145]

Belt sanders shouldn't trip your breakers. The question is is it worth the trouble? Ripping out and replacing is pretty easy....maybe more costly. Looks like they're nailed in.


And what are you going to use the basement for? Entertaining..make the effort. Laundry/gym/shop..I wouldn't even bother.

 

[highland145]

Or pull the treads them and flip them.

 

[UnklSnappy]

My honest opinion, not worth the time and effort.
They are pine and go to the basement. They were never intended to be finished and nice looking.
Epoxy paint and a runner and be done with it.

 

[z1ggy]

My honest opinion, not worth the time and effort.
They are pine and go to the basement. They were never intended to be finished and nice looking.
Epoxy paint and a runner and be done with it.

... The basement is finished. It has drywall/wood panel walls, drop ceiling with lights, and cabinets that run along the perimeter. It looks fairly nice down there IMO. I could just paint them and call it a day, but I want it to look nice. This isn't just your typical dingy basement.

I'm also about to put this house on the market, and having a nice looking basement will help it sell. Doing these stairs plus putting down a coat of epoxy paint on the floor will look nice, be pretty cheap, and be durable.

 

[herm0016]

1. poly shades is crap.

2. use conditioner, even if you think you don't need it.

I use what ever stain, usually Minwax helmsman. all oil based. I use satin spar varnish for most things, it is breathable and very hard.

if you are selling use something like this:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Stairtek...Retread-XBTRO113600250/202018676?N=5yc1vZbcrq

 

[z1ggy]

1. poly shades is crap.

2. use conditioner, even if you think you don't need it.

I use what ever stain, usually Minwax helmsman. all oil based. I use satin spar varnish for most things, it is breathable and very hard.

if you are selling use something like this:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Stairtek...Retread-XBTRO113600250/202018676?N=5yc1vZbcrq

1. Yep, another friend said the same. So I'm returning it. Damn Home Depot guy told me to use it. I swear.. Do these people who work there know anything?

2. Yup I got a prestain conditioner.

I'd rather spend the $60 or so on stains and finish the wood I have now, rather than buy 12 new treads for $50 a pop.