Yet another YAWT thread

[kidchino05]

First off, allow me to say that I have no idea whether it's protien, or protein. I'm guessing the latter? Former? Whatever.

My question is, how much to take? The side of my big jug of Opt. Nutrition Whey (I'm almost out...yeaup, I'm the ONE dude who bought 5 pounds of cookies and cream) says a gram for every pound of body weight, but it's gonna be damn hard for me to eat about 200 grams a day (for the record, I'm 6'4", about 194, I work out 3 to 4 times a week, doing a back/bi's, chest/tri's, legs/shoulders split, doing abs every day). I'm naturally a skinny guy (ectomorph) but I've seen nice gains in my chest and shoulders. I feel like my arms are a bit behind, but that's probably because I started with practically zero muscle and you can't build much mass if you can't lift heavy and eat heavy.

At any rate, as far as goals are concenred (forgive me if you don't need/want this info, I'm just trying to be complete) I'd like to get bigger. I'll work on cutting later (if needed). Soooo, I'm really wondering if i have to take 4 of these damn shakes a day. I'm guessing it behooves the makers to sell as much as possible, so I don't know if I trust the jug.

Cliffs: How much protien a day for an active 6'4", 200 pound, in shape guy who wants to get bigger?

 

[Pepsi90919]

protein

 

[EyeMNathan]

Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

 

[shortspanishguy]

I have always followed 1.5 grams of protein per lb. of weight. I have friends in the BB industry who intake 2 grams per lb. Anyways, make sure you have dextrose/maltodextrin in your post workout shake.

 

[kidchino05]

Originally posted by: shortspanishguy
I have always followed 1.5 grams of protein per lb. of weight. I have friends in the BB industry who intake 2 grams per lb. Anyways, make sure you have dextrose/maltodextrin in your post workout shake.

There is no way in hell I could eat 300 grams of protein in a day. I'd have to probably take four or five shakes. Besides the inconviance, I don't even know if I could afford that!

 

[jiggahertz]

1 gr/lb of bodyweight is a minimum if you're bulking. You shouldn't rely on shakes as your main source of protein. Eat whole foods like tuna, chicken breast, steak, cottage cheese, etc for your main souces of protein.

 

[shortspanishguy]

Oh yeah... dont do abs everyday. It is just like any other muscle.

 

[jiggahertz]

Originally posted by: shortspanishguy
I have always followed 1.5 grams of protein per lb. of weight. I have friends in the BB industry who intake 2 grams per lb. Anyways, make sure you have dextrose/maltodextrin in your post workout shake.

Good advice, and you'll want to have about 2x as many carbs as protein in your post work out shake.

 

[kidchino05]

Originally posted by: shortspanishguy
Oh yeah... dont do abs everyday. It is just like any other muscle.

I guess i should rephrase: I do abs every workout day. So that's 3 or 4 times a week, with a day in between.

Crap. Alright. Well, I guess I have to start eating chicken for breakfast.

 

[Yossarian]

6 meals a day, 30-35g protein at each meal. figure 2 of those are protein drinks.

 

[jiggahertz]

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Originally posted by: shortspanishguy
Oh yeah... dont do abs everyday. It is just like any other muscle.

I guess i should rephrase: I do abs every workout day. So that's 3 or 4 times a week, with a day in between.

That's still overkill. Would you do legs 4x a week?

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: EyeMNathan
Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

:thumbsup:

yup many people here have no idea what tey are talking about, or are n00bs to powerlifting)what i do) or body building

but to answer your question OP...2 shakes...one in the morning, one at night, your body will matabolize it best then...in the day eat high protein, high calorie healthy meals...and make sure to get complex carbs before and after a workout to transport all that protein...

btw 200gs a day is stupid to take in shake form..your body can only absord 2.25 grams of it at once (same as creatine in fact) and most would just pass through you and acutally make your kidney's work a lot harder...its one of those things that all companies do to make money...the quicker you use it the more you buy...

same as the creatine loading phase..its not needed...

 

[SVT Cobra]

bump...

 

[shortspanishguy]

Originally posted by: jiggahertz
1 gr/lb of bodyweight is a minimum if you're bulking. You shouldn't rely on shakes as your main source of protein. Eat whole foods like tuna, chicken breast, steak, cottage cheese, etc for your main souces of protein.

sound advice

 

[shortspanishguy]

Make sure you dont neglect your legs. Having a strong base is very important. Make sure that you are incorporating squats, deadlifts, etc. into your routine.

 

[aplefka]

If you're not big on meat, don't forget eggs. Have 4 or 5 for breakfast. I prefer hard-boiled, easier to eat fast. Also, don't be little poonjabber and eat just the yolks. The whites are what you need.

Son of a N00b, do you use Creatine? I've never seen any long-term results with it once people stopped using it, seems just like water-weight. What is your experience with it if you do use it?

 

[kidchino05]

Originally posted by: Son of a N00b

Originally posted by: EyeMNathan
Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

:thumbsup:

yup many people here have no idea what tey are talking about, or are n00bs to powerlifting)what i do) or body building

but to answer your question OP...2 shakes...one in the morning, one at night, your body will matabolize it best then...in the day eat high protein, high calorie healthy meals...and make sure to get complex carbs before and after a workout to transport all that protein...

btw 200gs a day is stupid to take in shake form..your body can only absord 2.25 grams of it at once (same as creatine in fact) and most would just pass through you and acutally make your kidney's work a lot harder...its one of those things that all companies do to make money...the quicker you use it the more you buy...

same as the creatine loading phase..its not needed...

Aite. Sounds good to me. I didn't mean I was going to take all the protein from shakes, I just meant that I might have to take 2-4 a day to get that much protein. I guess I just need to eat more. Hrmph.

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

3. So creatine loading is a hoax, eh? Just one teaspoon a day then, before the workout?

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

5. I don't have a problem with meat, it's just looking like volume, or more aptly, HEALTHY volume is going to be an issue. I could eat 3500 calories if I can eat whatever I want. To try and keep that at a reasonable fat level, while keeping protein high is going to be a trick. I do eat eggs for breakfast about once a week (usually 2 large eggs, 2 large egg whites, some veggies and a slice of whole wheat toast).

6. So just do abs once a week then?

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: aplefka
If you're not big on meat, don't forget eggs. Have 4 or 5 for breakfast. I prefer hard-boiled, easier to eat fast. Also, don't be little poonjabber and eat just the yolks. The whites are what you need.

Son of a N00b, do you use Creatine? I've never seen any long-term results with it once people stopped using it, seems just like water-weight. What is your experience with it if you do use it?

yes, I have uesed creatine quite a bit...I am a believer that it works...

Many people believe that they will just get stronger using it, but (as it does for me at least) it gives you more energy by increasing the diffusion of water and other biproducts of lifting(lactic acid etc) across the muscle membrane...which also increases ATP production...you can get in a better more efficient lift...

During my many cyclings of it I have noticed it has helped my bench at times, and it has been a god send during power cleans...but you still have to work hard as hell...if you do, the results will still be there after you stop using it

 

[shortspanishguy]

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Originally posted by: Son of a N00b

Originally posted by: EyeMNathan
Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

:thumbsup:

yup many people here have no idea what tey are talking about, or are n00bs to powerlifting)what i do) or body building

but to answer your question OP...2 shakes...one in the morning, one at night, your body will matabolize it best then...in the day eat high protein, high calorie healthy meals...and make sure to get complex carbs before and after a workout to transport all that protein...

btw 200gs a day is stupid to take in shake form..your body can only absord 2.25 grams of it at once (same as creatine in fact) and most would just pass through you and acutally make your kidney's work a lot harder...its one of those things that all companies do to make money...the quicker you use it the more you buy...

same as the creatine loading phase..its not needed...

Aite. Sounds good to me. I didn't mean I was going to take all the protein from shakes, I just meant that I might have to take 2-4 a day to get that much protein. I guess I just need to eat more. Hrmph.

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

3. So creatine loading is a hoax, eh? Just one teaspoon a day then, before the workout?

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

1. Do not buy the dextrose from GNC. Go to bodybuilding.com
2. Yes
3.Yes its not neccessary. Look into Creatine Ethyl Ester. It is superior.
4. Make sure you are doing sets that incorporate 4,6 reps also. GO HEAVY!!!!!!

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Originally posted by: Son of a N00b

Originally posted by: EyeMNathan
Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

:thumbsup:

yup many people here have no idea what tey are talking about, or are n00bs to powerlifting)what i do) or body building

but to answer your question OP...2 shakes...one in the morning, one at night, your body will matabolize it best then...in the day eat high protein, high calorie healthy meals...and make sure to get complex carbs before and after a workout to transport all that protein...

btw 200gs a day is stupid to take in shake form..your body can only absord 2.25 grams of it at once (same as creatine in fact) and most would just pass through you and acutally make your kidney's work a lot harder...its one of those things that all companies do to make money...the quicker you use it the more you buy...

same as the creatine loading phase..its not needed...

Aite. Sounds good to me. I didn't mean I was going to take all the protein from shakes, I just meant that I might have to take 2-4 a day to get that much protein. I guess I just need to eat more. Hrmph.

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

3. So creatine loading is a hoax, eh? Just one teaspoon a day then, before the workout?

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

5. I don't have a problem with meat, it's just looking like volume, or more aptly, HEALTHY volume is going to be an issue. I could eat 3500 calories if I can eat whatever I want. To try and keep that at a reasonable fat level, while keeping protein high is going to be a trick. I do eat eggs for breakfast about once a week (usually 2 large eggs, 2 large egg whites, some veggies and a slice of whole wheat toast).

6. So just do abs once a week then?

abs twice a week is not overkill...I do them twice...even three times would not hurt as long as you vary the ab workout and sections of your abdominal area and back...

also yes creatine loading is not neccesary...just take it once before your workout and once after and then once only on your off days...eventually it will absorb into your muscles leaving you with the same results if you did do the loading phase..its a bit more complicated but the mainr eason is you will get the same absorbtion rate at a longer time...but the same results...

complex carbs...pasta..bread etc...examples of great meals to eat the night before lifting or after are something like pasta and chicken, a bagel with low fat cheese...that type of thing


most importantly, do your sets and push yourself...its not about the quanitity of your lifts its the quality...

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: shortspanishguy

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Originally posted by: Son of a N00b

Originally posted by: EyeMNathan
Most people here wouldn't know fitness if it came up and bit them on the ass. Might want to check a bodybuilding forum.

ATOT is generally a pretty bad place to ask any kind of specific question.

:thumbsup:

yup many people here have no idea what tey are talking about, or are n00bs to powerlifting)what i do) or body building

but to answer your question OP...2 shakes...one in the morning, one at night, your body will matabolize it best then...in the day eat high protein, high calorie healthy meals...and make sure to get complex carbs before and after a workout to transport all that protein...

btw 200gs a day is stupid to take in shake form..your body can only absord 2.25 grams of it at once (same as creatine in fact) and most would just pass through you and acutally make your kidney's work a lot harder...its one of those things that all companies do to make money...the quicker you use it the more you buy...

same as the creatine loading phase..its not needed...

Aite. Sounds good to me. I didn't mean I was going to take all the protein from shakes, I just meant that I might have to take 2-4 a day to get that much protein. I guess I just need to eat more. Hrmph.

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

3. So creatine loading is a hoax, eh? Just one teaspoon a day then, before the workout?

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

1. Do not buy the dextrose from GNC. Go to bodybuilding.com
2. Yes
3.Yes its not neccessary. Look into Creatine Ethyl Ester. It is superior.
4. Make sure you are doing sets that incorporate 4,6 reps also. GO HEAVY!!!!!!

actually dextrose is a waste IMO...just another useless supplement that is not neccesary..if you get it from your foods you do not need any more (unlike protein) plus many good qaulity, quality being the keyword, creatine and whey protein supplements already have argenine and dextrose in them...

and yes, try to keep your protein in take the same on your off days..your body is still recovering and building muscle then also

 

[jaedaliu]

you guys are recommending more than necessary. According to PW Lemon at Exercise Nutrition Research Laboratory, The University of Western Ontario, London, Canada active body-building individuals require 1.6 - 1.8 g of protein per kg (compared to 0.8 g/kg in normal, sedentary people)

so that's about 0.7 - 0.8 g protein / lb. You can probably get that eating a normal diet.

but if you like the taste of the shakes, go for it. (i like mine with bananas, and a little bit of yogurt)

 

[jiggahertz]

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

For a pwo shake you want it to be digested as quickly as possible, that's why dextrose is recommended. Gatorade powder is high in dextrose, and I believe smarties are almost entirely dextrose.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

Yes, your muscles grow while your resting not while in the gym.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

You'll see the best gains while you're new to lifting, you might as well do it right and maximize those gains. Plus it will take you a while to figure out what works for you.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

6. So just do abs once a week then?

Yes

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: jiggahertz

Originally posted by: kidchino05

Okay, more questions:

1. What's a good complex carb? I've heard dextrose, but short of going to GNC and buyng some, what's a good carb to take with the shakes? Fruit? Bread?

For a pwo shake you want it to be digested as quickly as possible, that's why dextrose is recommended. Gatorade powder is high in dextrose, and I believe smarties are almost entirely dextrose.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

2. Do you have to take that much protein in your off days?

Yes, your muscles grow while your resting not while in the gym.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

4. I fully realize that none of this is really super essential; i.e. I'm still not to the point where I have to optimize everything to see gains. I could likely roll into the gym for a good two more years and just do 10-12 reps of whatever I was doing and still see gains before I start to get "stuck", but it's more of a mental thing for me: I want to know that I'm using my gym/food time as well as possible.

You'll see the best gains while you're new to lifting, you might as well do it right and maximize those gains. Plus it will take you a while to figure out what works for you.

Originally posted by: kidchino05

6. So just do abs once a week then?

Yes

:thumbsdown:

I already mentioned dextrose and abs but here it is again...working your abs twice a week is good to do after squating...(which should also be done twice a week) it helps stretch so you do not cramp and also get your full back workout in so it can recover together...in other words you have to connect your bench to your squat

 

[shortspanishguy]

Originally posted by: jaedaliu
you guys are recommending more than necessary. According to PW Lemon at Exercise Nutrition Research Laboratory, The University of Western Ontario, London, Canada active body-building individuals require 1.6 - 1.8 g of protein per kg (compared to 0.8 g/kg in normal, sedentary people)

so that's about 0.7 - 0.8 g protein / lb. You can probably get that eating a normal diet.

but if you like the taste of the shakes, go for it. (i like mine with bananas, and a little bit of yogurt)

Tell this to Jay Cutler, Ronnie Coleman, etc. and see what they say. There are studies that support every end of the spectrum.