Years of Clinton era welfare reform looking to be reversed with the stimulus bill

SAWYER

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
16,745
42
91
Welfare reform from the 90's was a good thing, now these politicians looking to reverse it is unacceptable. This is reckless and foolish.

http://article.nationalreview....E4YmQ4MmU5MTk2YTIxNTQ=
Pres. Barack Obama vowed to correct the mistakes of the Bush administration but instead is determined to undo one of the great successes of the Clinton years: welfare reform. Democrats have inserted provisions into the catch-all stimulus bill that will reverse Clinton-era welfare reform, re-establishing the wasteful, incentive-killing system whose transformation was the bipartisan pride of the 1990s.

Prior to reform, the federal government simply gave the states more money for every family they added to the welfare rolls. The predictable result was that the states worked hard to maximize their welfare caseloads in order to maximize the amount of federal funding they could therefore claim. The system had zero incentive to help people make the transition from welfare to work and independence?in fact, the states were financially punished for doing so. The Clinton-Gingrich reforms replaced that bounty-hunter system with a flat rate for each state, based on population and other factors. That gave state-level welfare authorities a better set of incentives, encouraging them to use their resources in the most effective manner and to reserve them for the truly needy.

The results were successful?spectacularly so. The Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Act was followed by reductions in both the number of families on welfare and the rate of poverty. Single women entered the workforce in substantial numbers and the household incomes of former welfare recipients went up. In other words, the incentives to reduce welfare dependence and help people to find work, worked.

Obama, in what is plainly a sop to ACORN and the rest of the ?community organizing? gang, is overturning those reforms. Under the provisions in the stimulus bill, states will once again be paid a bounty for expanding their welfare rolls. As reported by Robert Rector of the Heritage Foundation, the federal government will now pay states 80 percent of the cost for each new family they sign up for welfare. That means that states will get $4 for every $1 they spend. This will leave the main welfare program, Temporary Assistance to Needy Families (TANF), with a funding mechanism similar to the one that supports Medicaid. As Brian Blase argues here, Medicaid?s funding ratio, which gives states $1 to $3 for every dollar they spend, has caused state Medicaid spending to skyrocket. If Medicaid?s dollar-for-dollar model has proved ruinous, Obama?s new $4-to-$1 ratio for welfare will prove, in all likelihood, four times so.

What can Republicans do about this? Not much. House Republicans hung tough against the stimulus only to have their position undermined by three of the usual suspects in the Senate: Senators Specter, Collins, and Snowe. Republicans were locked out of the process by which the differences in the House and Senate versions were resolved?their last (forlorn) shot at taming this beast of a bill.

Given that the states will receive $4 from the federal government for every $1 they add to their welfare budgets, even conservative governors will feel pressure to inflate their welfare rolls in order to wring every dollar they can out of Washington. And there are early rumblings about removing the already weak work requirements that rounded out the Clinton-era reforms.

The Democrats are stuffing years? worth of legislation into their ?stimulus? bill. They are operating in the legislative shadows, evading scrutiny and debate, while enacting an expansion of the welfare state that would never survive a more considered process. Obama?s right-hand man, Rahm Emanuel, put it bluntly if cynically: ?You never want a serious crisis to go to waste.? Obama obviously intends to make the most of this one as he proves that he is, after all, the Second Coming?of Lyndon Baines Johnson.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
I'm saying it here first: This recession and the government response to are going to combine to make a marked and long term drop in the US economy and its subsequent ability to grow. The effects of this will be felt for years. The best case at this point is that the government softens the blow now but the economy has an arm tied behind its back for many years to come. What we'd all like to see is the stimulus work, the government temporarily increase its debt, but in a year or two the economy rebound to a strong extent and then surplus budgets pay down what was borrowed now. It absolutely is not going to happen, no ifs ands or buts. Real GDP growth for the US will be depressed against levels in previous years for a loooong time.
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,696
1
0
WTF

Clinton's welfare reform is by far the best piece of legislation he's done in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
More of the usual wingnut lameness. Having a system that points people towards work is fine, when there are actually jobs at the end of the process. Right now, we have millions unemployed who've never received assistance in their lives, because there aren't enough jobs to go around, and likely won't be for some time to come.

Whining about the necessary adjustments to the social safety net system puts the lie to the whole concept of "compassionate conservatism" in a very unflattering way for those on the Right. But, go ahead, dare the electorate to kick your ass in 2010 and 2012, stand up for greed and smug self righteousness...
 

bobcpg

Senior member
Nov 14, 2001
951
0
0
Nothing like empowering the people to stop working and go on welfare.

Maybe this is a good thing as it will increase demand for workers!
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
Originally posted by: bobcpg
Nothing like empowering the people to stop working and go on welfare.

Maybe this is a good thing as it will increase demand for workers!

Yeah, because it makes so much sense to quit a job in these hard times, just to pull a $500 or so welfare check every month.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,430
6,088
126
Originally posted by: umbrella39
Originally posted by: bobcpg
Nothing like empowering the people to stop working and go on welfare.

Maybe this is a good thing as it will increase demand for workers!

Yeah, because it makes so much sense to quit a job in these hard times, just to pull a $500 or so welfare check every month.

The brain dead morons have nothing else going for them but to flatter themselves their go getters and hard workers. When they have nothing to feel their kids they'll be screaming for help just like the ones already there. Then it will be the filthy heartless capitalists are letting my baby die.
 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,489
0
0
It is change my friend.

Democrats are no longer Tax and Spend. They are Spend and Tax :) Part 2 comes later...
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
126
Unbelievable. The welfare reform Clinton ironed out with a republican congress was one of the best thing our govt has done in the past 40 years.

Power grab is all this pork package has become.
 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,489
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
Unbelievable. The welfare reform Clinton ironed out with a republican congress was one of the best thing our govt has done in the past 40 years.

Power grab is all this pork package has become.
Wingnut! Wingnut!

 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
85
91
Originally posted by: halik
WTF

The welfare reform, spearheaded by the Republicans Contract With America during Clinton's two terms, is by far the best piece of legislation he's signed into law in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.

Fixed.
 

Wheezer

Diamond Member
Nov 2, 1999
6,731
1
81
People go on an on how the Republicans power is tied to the number of people they make rich....the more rich people there are from GOP legislation the more power they get.

The flip side of that coin?

The more poor people the Democrats produce through legislation and the more tax money they can hand over to those poor people without expectation of a return on that money the more power they have.

Republicans buy votes from the rich and the Democrats buy votes from the poor...it's a numbers game....if there are more rich people going to the ballot box the better their chances of winning...if more poor go to the ballot box the Democrats win.

American politics is great ain't it?
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,442
7,506
136
Originally posted by: halik
WTF

Clinton's welfare reform is by far the best piece of legislation he's done in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.

This reform was with Newt Gingrich and the Republicans in control of Congress. Change has come indeed.
 

Nemesis 1

Lifer
Dec 30, 2006
11,366
2
0
Originally posted by: halik
WTF

Clinton's welfare reform is by far the best piece of legislation he's done in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.


What are you talking about. What elections???? Were joining the EU. What Elections.

After were in the EU. Than lets talk elections. Any of you guys in big cities ever drive threw the grave yards. Maybe ya should go take a peak. Millions upon millions of caskets are being prepared. Go look there stacking them everywere. We have a old camp here from the 30's That was used durring depression. And immagrant housing . Fema has gone in there built it bigger . With some very strange looking buildings added. The Fence is design to keep people in not out.

15 miles from my doorstep.

 

newnameman

Platinum Member
Nov 20, 2002
2,219
0
0
Originally posted by: Nemesis 1
Originally posted by: halik
WTF

Clinton's welfare reform is by far the best piece of legislation he's done in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.


What are you talking about. What elections???? Were joining the EU. What Elections.

After were in the EU. Than lets talk elections. Any of you guys in big cities ever drive threw the grave yards. Maybe ya should go take a peak. Millions upon millions of caskets are being prepared. Go look there stacking them everywere. We have a old camp here from the 30's That was used durring depression. And immagrant housing . Fema has gone in there built it bigger . With some very strange looking buildings added. The Fence is design to keep people in not out.

15 miles from my doorstep.
wat
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
Originally posted by: Nemesis 1
Originally posted by: halik
WTF

Clinton's welfare reform is by far the best piece of legislation he's done in his 8 years. The poverty rate went down ex-post and the cost of the system went down also... democrats will spend themselves out of the office yet again.


What are you talking about. What elections???? Were joining the EU. What Elections.

After were in the EU. Than lets talk elections. Any of you guys in big cities ever drive threw the grave yards. Maybe ya should go take a peak. Millions upon millions of caskets are being prepared. Go look there stacking them everywere. We have a old camp here from the 30's That was used durring depression. And immagrant housing . Fema has gone in there built it bigger . With some very strange looking buildings added. The Fence is design to keep people in not out.

15 miles from my doorstep.
Were in at Michael Phelp's party recently?

 

heyheybooboo

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2007
6,278
0
0
Since this **big shocker** is based upon Robert Rector of the Heritage Foundation, maybe someone can show me where the current legislation repeals the primary tenets of the welfare reform of the 1990's ...

# - Require most recipients to work within two years of receiving assistance
# - Limit assistance to five years total, and
# - Establish "family caps" to deny additional benefits

Could this be a typical knee jerk of the Offended Conservatives to the Fed actually helping their budget distressed State brethren?



My recollection of welfare reform was that Newt's version was resoundingly rejected - so much so that Clinton shut down the Federal gov't.

... and this subsequently led to Newt's downfall.


I've got some old numbers I can dig out if anyone is interested. It seems that the greatest impact of welfare reform was felt in the rural sections of Red States ...
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: Jhhnn
More of the usual wingnut lameness. Having a system that points people towards work is fine, when there are actually jobs at the end of the process. Right now, we have millions unemployed who've never received assistance in their lives, because there aren't enough jobs to go around, and likely won't be for some time to come.

Whining about the necessary adjustments to the social safety net system puts the lie to the whole concept of "compassionate conservatism" in a very unflattering way for those on the Right. But, go ahead, dare the electorate to kick your ass in 2010 and 2012, stand up for greed and smug self righteousness...

One can create work with just a little creativity. From child care to cleaning to painting in these communities. I never had a problem with welfare per se other than it's too little cash to make next step and is immoral the way it warehouses people intellectually and vocationally making virtually unemployable members of society.
 

mooseracing

Golden Member
Mar 9, 2006
1,711
0
0
Welfarre needs to be setup like other countries that I can't remember the name of. You need to be actively seeking work, you can only be on it for x amount of years, Welfare benefits can't be high enough to support a person living a middle class life. I'm tired of seeing them in new cars, name brand clothes and not work a day in their life. Or at the last Church can food handout, every car that wasn't older than a 2000 model spec, some people don't seem to understand priorities.

Either way this country is goign to continue to fail since we just try to bandage wounds that need to be amputated.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: mooseracing
Welfarre needs to be setup like other countries that I can't remember the name of. You need to be actively seeking work, you can only be on it for x amount of years, Welfare benefits can't be high enough to support a person living a middle class life. I'm tired of seeing them in new cars, name brand clothes and not work a day in their life. Or at the last Church can food handout, every car that wasn't older than a 2000 model spec, some people don't seem to understand priorities.

Either way this country is goign to continue to fail since we just try to bandage wounds that need to be amputated.
BS
My ex-sister in law is on welfare and she gets no cash with 3 kids. She does get free rent in a ramshackled violent apartment complex, free child care and ~ $500 in food stamps. I give her $200 a month just to get to her dental assistants classes. We also paid the $7000 for tuition of the $11000 government did not pay. Frankly they are trapped and without outside help will stay trapped.

The only reason she has a shot is her kids grandparents and uncles have a little money to help irrespective of her deadbeat x-husband, my brother.
 

Nemesis 1

Lifer
Dec 30, 2006
11,366
2
0
You guys are talking about throughing $$$ at a problem that isn't in reality about $$$. It about social justic. Why should I work my ass off . To pay taxes. So that others may get free tax dollars for not working . I don't like that. I agree there are reasons for everthing. BUT. Lets make sure its legit . Than rather than through $$$ at the problem which under the old system went for drugs or what ever. NO throughing money at Welfare is wrong wrong wrong. We need to fix the cause of why people are on welfare. I know a few. All have the same reason for being on welfare. They refuse to work for less than $30 an hour when they aren't worth $3. an hour. Thats a fact.

Ya guys want to fix this country . Listen to this speaker. Don't be afraid to listen to the other witnesses. Good stuff. and its true. Trueth in America. Who would have believed it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...B0hK7c&feature=related