YAWT: Lifting for strength vs. lifting for size

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WhiteKnight

Platinum Member
May 21, 2001
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I'm currently 24, 5'11", 180 lb. I've been lifting regularly for about three years but I was plateaued for quite a while until a month ago when I decided to gain some weight. I'm up to the low 180s from the high 160s and my strength has increased noticibly, but I don't think there's been too much change in size, just muscle density or "feel". So far I've been doing 4-6 reps, 4-6 sets per muscle group across 1 or 2 exercises per muscle group. I was planning on starting a cutting phase some time next week and I'm looking for some advice on the best way to do that.

I know that sets of 8-12 reps are generally used to promote hypertrophy, but should I continue to consume excess calories for another couple weeks with higher rep sets before cutting back or should I cut back my calories now and continue with the higher rep sets?

I'm not looking to get huge, just defined.

Edit: Removed reference to Brad Pitt's physique in Fight Club vs. that in Troy, due to inability of some ATOT members to function while visualizing said images.
 
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Accipiter22

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Feb 11, 2005
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or www.wannabebig.com great forums there....as for your question I'm not exactly clear on it...do you get the basics behind a cut phase? There's no reason really for calories to be up if you're cutting...then it's not a cut...it's just a bulk, and you're doing 8-12 reps...
 
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fbrdphreak

Lifer
Apr 17, 2004
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My $0.02

More reps & more sets for more lean muscle, more definition, more stamina; wait longer to bump up weight, get really good at the level you're at and start up-ing the weight of your last 1-2 sets until you're more comfortable with the next weight level.

From what you wrote, I'd guess your % body fat is fairly low; so you're not trying to reduce body fat, but increase muscle definition directly. Cutting calories will only hurt muscle growth, maintain a healthy eating schedule and eat more meals w/less @ each meal. This helps keep your metabolism going 24/7, which will help in fat burning & muscle growth.

There are also certain lifts you can do that some people find help "sculpt" the muscle more. For instance, slow one-handed bicep curls where you sit on a bench and prop your elbow between your legs on the bench itself. Keep the weight fairly low, but smooth & controlled for lots of reps. Can't say I've done enough of those to comment on its effectiveness, but its just another way to tone those muscles up.
 
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kaymin

Senior member
Jul 21, 2001
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You shouldn't be really asking that here. GO TO www.discussfitness.com and post in the forums there. There's some real weightlifting gurus and you can search the posts too. Great site!
 
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WhiteKnight

Platinum Member
May 21, 2001
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Originally posted by: Accipiter22
or www.wannabebig.com great forums there....as for your question I'm not exactly clear on it...do you get the basics behind a cut phase? There's no reason really for calories to be up if you're cutting...then it's not a cut...it's just a bulk, and you're doing 8-12 reps...
Click to expand...

Just to clarify, I do know what a cut phase is. What I'm asking is if I'm better off changing to higher reps now and keep bulking or if I should change to higher reps now but go to a cut phase, with the goal being definition in both cases. Thanks for the link.
 
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fbrdphreak

Lifer
Apr 17, 2004
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What are you doing to "bulk" right now? Eating shitloads of calories? I'd just eat a reasonable amount; in the free "muscle & fitness" i get, they were listing on average 2300-2600 calories per day for someone who is very active and wants to build lean muscle. I'd do that and lift with higher reps; while you can make weight lifting a life long obsession, if you don't get all obsessed about it, its not rocket science.
 
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Special K

Diamond Member
Jun 18, 2000
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The whole high reps = definition is BS. Definition is gained by reducing bodyfat, which is accomplished through gradual reduction of calories. You want to keep lifting heavy while dieting to encourage your body to burn fat instead of muscle. "Sculpting" is also BS. You can't change the genetic shape of your muscle, you can only force it to grow larger, and bring out definition by losing bodyfat. As another poster mentioned, here is a very good place to go for diet/lifting advice:

Wannabebig Forums
 
Amused

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
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Originally posted by: fbrdphreak
My $0.02

More reps & more sets for more lean muscle, more definition, more stamina; wait longer to bump up weight, get really good at the level you're at and start up-ing the weight of your last 1-2 sets until you're more comfortable with the next weight level.
Click to expand...

A complete and utter myth. More reps and more sets = wasted time. Not only that, but it leads to over-training which is counter productive. You'll stay fat AND make no gains in muscle size or strength.

Definition comes from diet and cardio. No change in how you lift is going to define a muscle covered in fat.

Stamina also comes from cardio. You cannot possibly do enough reps of any amount of weight to build stamina unless you lower the weight enough and it becomes cardio.

If you want some size, and definition, you need to bulk and cut. If you're a hard gainer, you need to bulk far more often than you cut.
 
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Accipiter22

Banned
Feb 11, 2005
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Originally posted by: fbrdphreak
My $0.02

More reps & more sets for more lean muscle, more definition, more stamina; w
Click to expand...


NO NO NO NO NO NO ABSOLUTELY INCORRECT. Muscle definition is a DIRECT function of bodyfat %. More reps&sets are NOT going to increase your muscle definition


There are also certain lifts you can do that some people find help "sculpt" the muscle more. For instance, slow one-handed bicep curls where you sit on a bench and prop your elbow between your legs on the bench itself. Keep the weight fairly low, but smooth & controlled for lots of reps. Can't say I've done enough of those to comment on its effectiveness, but its just another way to tone those muscles up.
Click to expand...


ALSO ABSOLUTELY INCORRECT. you can not SCULPT muscles. Muscle firing is an all or none action. you can't shape parts of muscle.
 
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Accipiter22

Banned
Feb 11, 2005
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Originally posted by: WhiteKnight
Originally posted by: Accipiter22
or www.wannabebig.com great forums there....as for your question I'm not exactly clear on it...do you get the basics behind a cut phase? There's no reason really for calories to be up if you're cutting...then it's not a cut...it's just a bulk, and you're doing 8-12 reps...
Click to expand...

Just to clarify, I do know what a cut phase is. What I'm asking is if I'm better off changing to higher reps now and keep bulking or if I should change to higher reps now but go to a cut phase, with the goal being definition in both cases. Thanks for the link.
Click to expand...


losing bodyfat is the only way to increase definition
 
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