YAMCWST (Yet Another My Car Won't Start Thread)

[CycloWizard]

I've made enough of these at this point to warrant a new acronym... Anyway, 1990 Acura Integra LS, ~215k miles. I was driving on the interstate for about 30 miles, got off at my exit, stopped at the stop sign, went about 10 feet, then my car died. Wouldn't restart. $50 later, it's sitting in front of my house. Only one more month until I'm done with 9 years of college and can finally get a real job/newish car.

The starter is definitely turning the engine. However, it sounds a little different than usual. There are two distinct sounds in the turning cycle, and the second one is longer than it used to be and sounds almost pained. The last thing I did on the car was replace the main relay, which controls the fuel pump. Therefore, my first guess is that the fuel pump might be the culprit. I tried opening the gas cap and I didn't hear anything, which tells me that there isn't as much pressure as there usually is/should be.

Haynes manual troubleshooting guide lists the following:
1. Fuel tank empty. I have about 1/2 tank
2. Battery discharged (engine rotates slowly). My battery appears to be fine.
3. Battery terminal connections loose or corroded. Tried reconnecting, didn't change a thing.
4. Leaking fuel injector(s), faulty fuel pump, pressure regulator, etc.
5. Fuel not reaching fuel rail.
6. Ignition components damp or damaged.
7. Worn, faulty, or incorrectly gapped spark plugs. My plugs are 1-2 years old, should be fine.
8. Broken, loose, or disconnected wires at the ignition coil or faulty coil.

I'll also note that I drove about 600 miles to go home the weekend before last. About 20 miles into the drive, the check engine light came on for the first time since I replaced the cylinder head (which was about 4 years ago now). Restarted the car, it went off, then came back on. I think this is due to a bad temperature sending unit that has been indicating overcooling on the interstate, but can't say for sure. Like I said, I'm trying to get this thing running for another month or so, so I haven't been dealing with every little problem that pops up.

Any advice you guys have is, as always, greatly appreciated. :beer:

 

[bruceb]

One thing comes to mind on an engine like that:

Broken Timing Belt

Guaranteed not to start when that breaks

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: bruceb
One thing comes to mind on an engine like that:

Broken Timing Belt

Guaranteed not to start when that breaks

Yep, had that happen back in... 1999 or so. In that case, the engine wouldn't even turn over. I would turn the key and absolutely nothing would happen. I was relieved when that wasn't the case this time.

 

[CoachB]

I had the same thought as bruceb esp. when I saw 215K mileage.

I had a 1989 Toyota that would crank and crank but not start or attempt to fire...broken timing belt. Most cars have a port or window in the timing belt cover where you can see if the belt looks ok and is rotating when you crank the engine.

I'm not sure about Acura but Hondas have an electronic timing sensor built into the distributor that will trigger a check engine light. Car will usually still run but with reduced power and pep.

You might try getting the sensor codes checked by someone with a code reader. Most auto parts stores will do it free or you can rent a reader at some places. The code might tell you something about your current issue.

My $0.02

 

[Q]

When my car didn't start a few months ago, it ended up that the cables that connected to the battery were bad. Not sure if that applies to you but just wanted to throw that out there.

Cost $300 BTW

 

[CycloWizard]

Thanks guys. I can pop the valve cover and take a look at the timing belt. I changed it at 125k and actually have a new one sitting in my trunk because I knew it needed to be done soon, so that would be nice if that's all it is. My engine is an interference engine though, so if that is is, it could be much worse still. :\

 

[CycloWizard]

So I took off the valve cover to check the timing belt . Lo and behold, the third intake valve cams are COMPLETELY dry, but all the rest are completely covered in oil as they should be. Visible wear metal on the valve cover and corrosion on the cams. I tried to take pictures, but my batteries are dead so they'll have to wait a bit. Any ideas on how the hell this could happen? If I had to guess, I'd say it looks like it's been dry for at least a week, but it's hard to judge based on worn corrosion in that sort of environment, so... I'm thinking maybe a blocked oil jet, which might be why the check engine light came on two weeks ago, but I have no idea for sure. I'll try to get pics up as soon as my batteries are charged.

 

[bruceb]

Sounds to me like it is time for an Upper Engine
rebuild. You will need to pull the head(s), decarbon
the piston tops (methyl ethyk ketone is best for this)
or a soft flap wheel, send the heads out for a crack
and surface check, have the valve seats & guides done.
New valves, springs & keepers. Also check the camshaft
for excessive wear. You may even need to drop the oil
pan & see if any metal is in there. Check your OIL Pressure
and while you are at it, flush the coolant & the oil galleys.
If an internal water / oil pump, consider changing them while
you can get to them.

Maybe easier to just ge a whole engine out of a salvage yard.

 

[natto fire]

The oil galleys on that engine are fairly large and should not clog easily. How long has it been after cranking that you pulled the valve cover? Your valve guide sealse might be bad and after sitting for a bit the oil drained off the parts and into the combustion chamber. Pull the third spark plug and check it for oil saturation. If it is hard to tell, then pull a couple more for comparative purposes. As you probably already know, the car is OBD0 so a code reader is out of the question. There is a service jumper that you can short out and the CEL will flash a certain number of times to give basic codes.

When you replaced the cylinder head, did you do anything with the distributor? The ignitor on these is very prone to failure and after working on Integras for over 4 years, I have owned three of them and my friends have owned them as well, I have replaced a couple ignitors as well as the main relay. I know you only need to have the car for a bit longer, but you should be able to find another B18A easily as many people swap them out for B16's, H22's, and B18C's. Finding one that is OBD0 might be a bit harder, but you can also easily convert the car to OBDI. I did this on my '91 in one day, and I am assuming you are comfortable with soldering/wiring.

This car is your daily driver, correct? So you might not want to bother with the down time of sourcing/swapping an engine, but it still might be an idea as the car will definitely last quite a bit longer if you, especially if you put your new timing belt on the engine before you swap it in. The first thing to do is to try pulling that code by jumping the service connector, it is located on the passenger side where the kick panel meets the dash. If memory serves it is a grey connector, but I know it only has two pins. I have a list of the diagnostic codes. If the light pulses for a long time it indicates a number in the tens place, a short pulse is a number in the ones place. Make sure to double check the pulses and post the number here. My offer still stands to send you the factory service manual, and I have a spare ignitor too.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: bruceb
Sounds to me like it is time for an Upper Engine
rebuild. You will need to pull the head(s), decarbon
the piston tops (methyl ethyk ketone is best for this)
or a soft flap wheel, send the heads out for a crack
and surface check, have the valve seats & guides done.
New valves, springs & keepers. Also check the camshaft
for excessive wear. You may even need to drop the oil
pan & see if any metal is in there. Check your OIL Pressure
and while you are at it, flush the coolant & the oil galleys.
If an internal water / oil pump, consider changing them while
you can get to them.

Maybe easier to just ge a whole engine out of a salvage yard.

Nah, this car has suffered enough. If I can't fix it without blowing a bunch of money and time (neither of which I have at this point), then I'll have to dust off my bike helmet for a month and hope I don't have to do any serious traveling.

 

[CycloWizard]

Meh, I typed another reply to you Captain Howdy, but the forum ate it. No, I haven't done anything with the distributor.

Here's a pic of what's under the valve cover. I think I'm pretty much screwed unless I want to put a lot of time and money into her, and I simply don't have it at this point.

edit: suck at teh linkage

 

[bruceb]

Looks like Intake for Valve 2 is messed up real bad.
Can't really tell for sure.

 

[996GT2]

If it's just the head that is causing the issues, you can get a B18A1 head pretty cheap online...here's an example of a guy selling one for just $75

http://www.mwir.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=41661

Even the complete B18A1 motor isn't too expensive, since it's a non-VTEC motor that is typically swapped out by Honda tuners in favor of a B18C or LS/VTEC setup.

Example of motor on sale for $200
http://hondaswap.com/parts-sal...otor-sale-trade-47906/

 

[natto fire]

Ouch, that is much worse than I expected. While I hate to see another of my beloved Integras be put out to pasture, it seems that is the most logical thing to do in your situation. While I think that your failure to start problem is not caused by this valvetrain issue, it is very clear that motor is not going to last much longer as there is a major oiling issue. Not sure how the market is in your area for these kinds of cars, but you should still be able to get 300 or more for the rolling chassis if the body is in decent shape. Does it have a manual transmission?

Good luck on whatever you decide.

 

[CycloWizard]

Yeah, I'm sure the head problem isn't keeping it from starting, but it's certainly not helping anything. I still think the fuel pump is the culprit as far as starting goes, but obviously there are larger issues at play here. I'll have to sit down and figure out whether it's worth the $215 for the fuel pump to get another month or two out of her. Thanks for all the help guys.

 

[Zenmervolt]

As for the head, ouch. Hate to see something like that. I'd think that the culprit is the oil passage for that one cam bearing. It might be enough to pull that cam and see if you can clear the oil passage depending on how handy you are.

As far as the starting, weak battery. If the engine is cranking slowly and obviously laboring during the compression portion of the cranking, it's almost always the battery. A bad fuel pump won't cause it to crank slowly. Try jumping it.

ZV

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As for the head, ouch. Hate to see something like that. I'd think that the culprit is the oil passage for that one cam bearing. It might be enough to pull that cam and see if you can clear the oil passage depending on how handy you are.

As far as the starting, weak battery. If the engine is cranking slowly and obviously laboring during the compression portion of the cranking, it's almost always the battery. A bad fuel pump won't cause it to crank slowly. Try jumping it.

ZV

The battery is fairly new, so I guess I didn't think of that. Definitely worth a shot. I might just periodically lube the cams... I think I might still have some special grease around here that would probably keep it going for a while, at least another couple months. If the jump works, I'll see what that does for me. Thanks man. :beer:

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
As for the head, ouch. Hate to see something like that. I'd think that the culprit is the oil passage for that one cam bearing. It might be enough to pull that cam and see if you can clear the oil passage depending on how handy you are.

As far as the starting, weak battery. If the engine is cranking slowly and obviously laboring during the compression portion of the cranking, it's almost always the battery. A bad fuel pump won't cause it to crank slowly. Try jumping it.

ZV

The battery is fairly new, so I guess I didn't think of that. Definitely worth a shot. I might just periodically lube the cams... I think I might still have some special grease around here that would probably keep it going for a while, at least another couple months. If the jump works, I'll see what that does for me. Thanks man. :beer:

If jumping it doesn't help, take that battery cable ends (clamps) apart and clean them with a wire brush until they shine. Sometimes even though they don't look corroded they are. (Found that one out after spending a week and a half trouble-shooting a car that wouldn't crank even when jumped, if I'd tried that first it would have taken me all of 15 minutes to fix.)

ZV

 

[PandaBear]

My top end rebuild on a B18B takes about $900 parts and labor when my head warp. If you have parts the rebuild is probably about $700 labor. For a 89 if you can just save up a bit you can either buy a newer car right now (good deals on new car if you have $, auto industry is in the dump), or borrow $ to fix it and drive a year longer or so.