YADCT: Need digital camera advice (I think)

[dderidex]

Right now, I've got a pretty cheap "point-and-shoot" model I picked up a few years back - a Canon A60 2mp - that does alright.

However, it has two particular weak spots I'd REALLY like to address. For a sample, I just cropped 2 800x600 sections out of higher res images.

First off:

1) Low-light shooting SUCKS. Example. This was shot at ISO 400 (too dark for any less), but the same...well, 'rainbow colored' pixels exist at ISO 200 and, to a lesser extent, ISO 100. The camera goes to ISO 50, which is what I'm forced to use MOST the time, lighting issues aside, as that's the only one that really seems to get rid of that crap.

2) High-contrast shots SUCK. Example. Notice, especially, the pine needles on the tree at the upper right and the tree branches in the upper left. It's especially noticeable when you compare the sky in that pic to the sky in the reflection in the water. Notice the MUCH richer colors, there?

Basically, my question is - what attributes should I be looking for in a digital camera to address those two complaints? IS there anything, specifically, that would?

(And while I submit that I might just be completely incapable of using a camera - it's a possibility, after all - consider this shot and this shot and here and here that would seem to indicate, at least from time to time, I can use it to good effect.)

 

[Zenmervolt]

The first is something called "noise" and while it's better (slightly) in most newer prosumer digicams, you need to get a DSLR to get an imaging receptor that is clean and clear even at higher ISO settings.

Even very high-end non SLR digicams like the Olympus C-8080 and the Canon PowerShot Pro1 have large amounts of noise at higher ISO settings. Bear in mind that both of these are $600-$800 cameras.

The second is a combination of the limitations of non-DSLR imaging receptors and a low-end lens. Cameras like the C-8080 and the PowerShot Pro1 have less of a problem with high-contrast areas, but it's still not as good as a high-end film camera (bear in mind that a very nice 35mm SLR with a decent multi-purpose zoom lens can be had in the $400-$600 range if you buy brand new, $100-$200 range if you buy a good used example).

Basically, if you want it to come close to film, you'll need a DSLR.

That said, it also appears that both images above are suffering from JPEG artifacts as well and the TIFF and RAW capabilities of the C-8080 and PowerShot Pro1 will allieviate those issues. Also, they will both give much better images than the A60.

You'll do better with a DSLR if you really need clean shots at high ISO settings (even the low-end EOS Digital Rebel is very clean up to ISO 800 and useable at ISO 1600). High-contrast will be better even with a non-DSLR, but it's not the strongest point for digital cameras.

My overall recommendation right now is the Olympus C-8080 and it has received universally exceptional reviews and can be found at CompUSA for $549 right now. It also supports a USB 2.0 transfer rate, allows the use of >=2GB microdrives in its CF slot, and has an insanely long battery life.

ZV

 

[tami]

thank you ZV for some excellent advice 🙂

 

[dderidex]

Indeed, that's exactly the kind of information I was looking for, thanks!

At the moment, my 'discretionary budget' is close to $500 than $1000, though, so I suppose I'll keep my eye out and keep that advice in mind. It's very much what I thought, but the detail helps a lot!

(That $549 is maybe/doable, but the closest CompUSA is...oh...FOUR HOURS AWAY, so...eh...)

 

[yhelothar]

1) Use Tv mode, shutter priority so you can adjust the exposure time manually. You can still get well exposed images easily at ISO50. You'll need a mount or an extremely steady hand though.

2) The poor colors are due to the colors not focusing at the same place, thus you'll get the fringing effects. You will need apochromatic lens(true color). They will be marked with ED. Usually only DSLR lens come with ED, but Nikon also offers it in their consumer line of point and shoot. The olympus camera that ZV recommended has ED lens too 🙂

 

[dderidex]

Taking a look at the DP Review article on the Olympus C-8080, I see it has a max ISO of 400.

Now, it's clearly a better sensor than I'm using right now, but....isn't shooting at the max ISO the camera allows going to have some quality issues?

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: virtualgames0
1) Use Tv mode, shutter priority so you can adjust the exposure time manually. You can still get well exposed images easily at ISO50. You'll need a mount or an extremely steady hand though.

2) The poor colors are due to the colors not focusing at the same place, thus you'll get the fringing effects. You will need apochromatic lens(true color). They will be marked with ED. Usually only DSLR lens come with ED, but Nikon also offers it in their consumer line of point and shoot.

Nikon's non SLR point and shoots have _awful_ noise characteristics, though newer versions have been an improvement.

And for the record, the C-8080 uses an ED lens, while the PowerShot Pro1 uses an L-Series Canon lens, a label previously reserved for SLRs.

ZV

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: dderidex
Taking a look at the DP Review article on the Olympus C-8080, I see it has a max ISO of 400.

Now, it's clearly a better sensor than I'm using right now, but....isn't shooting at the max ISO the camera allows going to have some quality issues?

Other than the noise level, no.

And take a look at the noise profile of the C-8080 compared to other cameras in its range, it's either equal or better. In particular, note the comparison of noise between the Olympus C-8080 and the Minolta DiMAGE A2. The DiMAGE allows an ISO 800 setting, but that setting is un-useable and the DiMAGE's ISO 400 setting is much more noisy than the C-8080's ISO 400. Olympus chose not to include the option for higher ISO selections because they knew that they would be only a marketing gimick and not something that could ever be functional. Note the night shots taken with the C-8080 as well.

The only thing that ISO sensitivity changes is noise level. Just as with higher speed film grain is increased (shots taken with ISO 800 or ISO 1600 35mm film have noticeable grain), higher ISO settings for an image receptor in a digicam increase noise. There are no additional quality differences aside from noise that are incurred.

ZV