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YACT: Posessed power steering?

B

Black88GTA

Diamond Member
Well, some of you may remember how I bought a car cheap a week or so ago. After a week of driving it around, there's a few problems I've found...but the biggest thing that pisses me off about it is the steering - it likes to move on its own??!! WTF!

I can drive the car fine with it like this, but it's a huge annoyance. Here's a vid I took this afternoon - keep in mind, the car is in PARK, on a flat surface, and the motor is running. Cellphone format, but IE plays it. It's over a minute long, but the important thing is in the first 15 seconds.

http://www.msu.edu/~hardinge/Prelude/steering.3G2

Car is 1989 Honda Prelude, 2.0L 4 cyl, 117k miles, automatic.

Anyone ever see this before? Is it the PS rack?

 
Probably damaged PS Rack from somone using the wrong PS fluid at some point. Honda PS systems need PS fluid that is specifically marked as "Honda Power Steering Fluid". To the best of my knowledge, no other brand of automobile uses a compatible fluid and if some previous owner poured in generic "power steering" fluid (or, worse, ATF) into the system it can really screw up the entire system, rack, pump, and all.

ZV
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Probably damaged PS Rack from somone using the wrong PS fluid at some point. Honda PS systems need PS fluid that is specifically marked as "Honda Power Steering Fluid". To the best of my knowledge, no other brand of automobile uses a compatible fluid and if some previous owner poured in generic "power steering" fluid (or, worse, ATF) into the system it can really screw up the entire system, rack, pump, and all.

ZV
Click to expand...

Hm, I was afraid of that. I suppose it would be a waste of time to drain + refill it, huh? The damage has been done, I guess...jeez, it seems every car I get takes some sort of weird thing in the power steering. Conquest used ATF. This car has special Honda-only fluid. Doesn't anyone use regular PS fluid anymore?? :frown:
 
Originally posted by: thedarkwolf
Is the powersteering pump on its own belt? If so cut it you don't need powersteering you pany.
Click to expand...

Yes, the pump is on its own belt. I thought about just removing the belt and going He-Man steering, but I was a little worried to do it that way....I guess because that's a HUGE no-no on my Conquest. If you do that on a Starion / Conquest, you'll completely wipe out an essential steering column part in a very short time...causing your steering to become worthless, power or not. :Q
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Probably damaged PS Rack from somone using the wrong PS fluid at some point. Honda PS systems need PS fluid that is specifically marked as "Honda Power Steering Fluid". To the best of my knowledge, no other brand of automobile uses a compatible fluid and if some previous owner poured in generic "power steering" fluid (or, worse, ATF) into the system it can really screw up the entire system, rack, pump, and all.

ZV
Click to expand...
I got some fluid from a friend's shop that claims to be 100% compatible with Hondas. I used it in my own car and saw no ill effects. Best part was it cost me $1 a bottle.
 
what phone do you have and how do you transfer your vids from the phone to the comp

btw good luck with the steering thing
 
Originally posted by: Black88GTA
Originally posted by: thedarkwolf
Is the powersteering pump on its own belt? If so cut it you don't need powersteering you pany.
Click to expand...

Yes, the pump is on its own belt. I thought about just removing the belt and going He-Man steering, but I was a little worried to do it that way....I guess because that's a HUGE no-no on my Conquest. If you do that on a Starion / Conquest, you'll completely wipe out an essential steering column part in a very short time...causing your steering to become worthless, power or not. :Q
Click to expand...

Well thats mitsu quallity for you 😉. The parts should be more then adequate to hold up to the abuse. I cut the belt on my old beater 81 plymouth horizan cause it leaked fluid faster then you could pour it in and drove it for over a year. Who know how long the pump had just been pumping air before I got it, surprised it hadn't seized.

Anyway I think the problem is the valve dohicky in the power steering rack that directs the fluid flow. Hit up howstuffworks.com cause I can't remember what that thing is called.
 
Drain and fill MAY save it, certainly the cost effective first option. The other is the recirculating ball in the rack is not centered to pinionn, there are adjustments. the wrong fluid usually only dages the punp itsel. I wouldnt lose hope yet..
 
Originally posted by: dugweb
what phone do you have and how do you transfer your vids from the phone to the comp

btw good luck with the steering thing
Click to expand...

I have the Samsung A940. There's a USB cable that connects the phone to the PC (and Bluetooth as well), but the way I did it was just remove the Trans Flash card, stick it in the supplied SD adapter, put it in the card reader on my printer, and downloaded it to the PC. 😉

thedarkwolf, I have been looking in an online Prelude service manual, and it looks like you may be right...there's a flow chart in there that has some of the symptoms I'm seeing, and it says to check the rack guide and cut-off valve. I may tear into that when it's warmer out.
 
Originally posted by: Krazefinn
Drain and fill MAY save it, certainly the cost effective first option. The other is the recirculating ball in the rack is not centered to pinionn, there are adjustments. the wrong fluid usually only dages the punp itsel. I wouldnt lose hope yet..
Click to expand...

Well, it couldn't hurt to try that. At most, I'm only out a few bucks for Honda PS fluid. If that should fix it - awesome, if not...time for more drastic measures, I guess. I don't think the pump is bad - at least, it doesn't leak, whine, vibrate, or make odd noises, and the fluid doesn't look burned up (although who knows what's actually in there). Something else to check out in the Autozone parking lot this weekend.
 
your steering rack is borked. its either blown a seal and isn't keeping even pressure on either side OR its way the hell out of adjustment if it is adjustable. some ford racks have balance adjustments maybe yours does too.
 
Originally posted by: Krazefinn
Drain and fill MAY save it, certainly the cost effective first option. The other is the recirculating ball in the rack is not centered to pinionn, there are adjustments. the wrong fluid usually only dages the punp itsel. I wouldnt lose hope yet..
Click to expand...

does rack and pinion steering have recirculating balls in the same sense as a plain old steering gearbox? i've never taken one apart and i'm curious as to what they look like in the inside and what the recirculating balls do if theres no worm gear?
 
Originally posted by: OrganizedChaos
your steering rack is borked. its either blown a seal and isn't keeping even pressure on either side OR its way the hell out of adjustment if it is adjustable. some ford racks have balance adjustments maybe yours does too.
Click to expand...

That would be my guess... leaking seal that's letting fluid go where it shouldn't.
 
Well, there is a rack adjustment procedure in the shop manual...but I'm betting that you guys are right, and it is the rack itself that's messed up, or an internal seal or something. I'll probably try flushing & filling it with the proper fluid...if that doesn't fix it, I'll probably end up doing the rack. It looks like that'll be cheaper and a lot less hassle than trying to track down what the exact problem is.

There's a guy on Ebay selling remanufactured TRW racks for this car for $69 + shipping (shipping works out to $10.64 to my location) and no core charge. Provided this job isn't really involved - in other words, something I can do in one afternoon in a parking lot - I might just buy one of those racks, install it on a weekend afternoon when it's warm out, and be done with the whole thing for less than $100. I'll have to see how the flush & fill goes.
 
I will tell you exactly what you need.

A rack and pinion. What your rack is doing is called bypassing , and its not uncommon for a rack to wear out one seal before the other.

This is not a pump problem. That year of honda did not recquire a "honda" ps fluid. I have ALL-DATA right in front of me and it used same old off the shelf p/s fluid. The clear stuff. Its nice to once every few yrs or so run the return line from your pump into a bucket (with car running) and have someone turn wheel left to right as you flush fresh fluid through the reservoir until the return hose pumps out clear. Then put the return hose back on the reservoir fill it up and presto good for another four years or so.

If you see alot of black specs in reservoir its time to replace your hoses (actually past time). Alot of manufacturers wont warranty a rack unless the fluid is flushed before installation, as those same particles can cut away at the new seals.

Good driving !

Edit : That rack is a breeze, just remember to center the rack and wheel before you reconnect linkage.


 
Thanks everyone for the responses.

I've been reading the replacement procedure in the factory shop manual. It doesn't look hard - although, maybe a bit messy. I'm going to be doing the CV shafts and motor mounts anyways...as long as I have all that apart, might as well throw a new rack in while I'm in there, rather than try to band-aid this one. From reading on other forums and such, it looks like it's only gonna get worse.

LOL, Autozone's gonna hate me 😀 Hopefully they don't kick me out of their lot.
 
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