YACT - During a cold start... car cranks through first try but does not start

[Zee]

89 buick park ave

Only on a cold start, (warm start no problem)....

can anyone offer any suggestions as to why the car wont start the first time? It will constantly turn over until i let go... wait about 10 seconds... and then turn the key again in which in that case, it takes about one turn over before the car starts. Sometimes, the car shakes while it's idling....

Changed my fuel pump and filter already at the suggestion of mechanic because the car would die out again if i didnt gas it after starting the car... so that's one problem fixed. $280 right there.

off topic: changed rear brakes/shoes because of a leaking brake fluid.... another $280 there....

new battery in the beginning of winter.... $98

changed spark plugs last year... $6... change em again?

Thank you in advance... I just want to go back to the mechanic with a little more knowledge and awareness...




cliff notes
1) the car turns over, but doesen't actually start... but when try it again 10 seconds later, it does
2) don't want to start replacing random parts until i pin the tail on the donkey. Cost starting to add up.

 

[ndee]

how about a battery gone bad?

 

[Jeff7181]

Lubricate muffler bearing... refill blinker fluid resevoir... adjust kanooter valve... good to go!

Nah seriously... someone else can probably give you a better idea, but it sounds like computer problems... if it were me I'd check for trouble codes before doing anything else. Definately don't start replacing random parts that someone you talked to thinks might be the problem.

 

[Zee]

ooh, that reminds me... changed battery right in the beginning of winter... had alternator looked at that time to see if it was the battery for alternator that was having a problem... Thanks ndee

 

[Eli]

I don't quite understand the problem..

So you're saying the car turns over, but doesen't actually start... but when you try it again 10 seconds later, it does?

 

[Zee]

Originally posted by: Eli
I don't quite understand the problem..

So you're saying the car turns over, but doesen't actually start... but when you try it again 10 seconds later, it does?

yessireee. Sorry, i wasnt sure I was using that word "crank" correctly... Let me edit the OP coherently

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Lazee

Originally posted by: Eli
I don't quite understand the problem..

So you're saying the car turns over, but doesen't actually start... but when you try it again 10 seconds later, it does?

yessireee. Sorry, i wasnt sure I was using that word "crank" correctly... Let me edit the OP coherently

Hmm. That's strange. My first guess would be fuel pump/filter, but you said you've had it changed already.....

Does it run fine once it's started?

If you keep cranking it without the pause, will it eventually catch?

Oh, OK.. so you have to pause? Hmm...

And it starts just fine while it's warm? Hmmm....

Cold start injector/circuit/sensor?

 

[Zee]

Originally posted by: Eli
Hmm. That's strange. My first guess would be fuel pump/filter, but you said you've had it changed already.....

Does it run fine once it's started?

If you keep cranking it without the pause, will it eventually catch?

Oh, OK.. so you have to pause? Hmm...

And it starts just fine while it's warm? Hmmm....

Cold start injector/circuit/sensor?

1) Car runs fine once started.

2) I've never actually pushed it that far. Max I've pushed it was 5 seconds. Usually I stop around 3-4 seconds.

Yeah i was thinking it might have something to do with the clogged fuel injectors or something.... but I haven't asked a professional. I just see it on the bottle a lot about fixing problem with cold-starting.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Lazee

Originally posted by: Eli
Hmm. That's strange. My first guess would be fuel pump/filter, but you said you've had it changed already.....

Does it run fine once it's started?

If you keep cranking it without the pause, will it eventually catch?

Oh, OK.. so you have to pause? Hmm...

And it starts just fine while it's warm? Hmmm....

Cold start injector/circuit/sensor?

1) Car runs fine once started.

2) I've never actually pushed it that far. Max I've pushed it was 5 seconds. Usually I stop around 3-4 seconds.

Yeah i was thinking it might have something to do with the clogged fuel injectors or something.... but I haven't asked a professional. I just see it on the bottle a lot about fixing problem with cold-starting.

Probably best, don't want to wear your starter out. If you go for the long haul, just do it when it's cold and you probably won't burn anything up. Try pumping the pedal while cranking.. although, I'm not sure that actually does anything on a fuel injected engine.

If it starts fine every time while warm & runs fine otherwise, my bet is something to do with the cold start system.
Engines need an extra shot of fuel to start when cold. With carburetored engines, it was simply a choke - a restriction at the beginning of the throttle body that caused the engine to suck more fuel than air. With modern fuel injected computerized engines, it involves sensors to detect if the engine is cold and needs that extra volume of fuel.

I'm not familiar with your engine at all, so I can't really comment on specifics. And, I could be totally off

The whole 10-second thing really makes me think fuel pump though. Are you sure they replaced it? Maybe you should have your fuel pressure checked. When you first turn the key on, can you hear the pump prime? Might be kinda hard to hear, but if you look for it, it should be there.

Better wait for Roger..

 

Here I am

GM's have a known delayed start problem that relates to one of the following ;

1) Corroded terminals on the electrical distribution center, follow the positive battery cable to a red cap covered terminal on the inside of the fender, there you will find the distribution center, remove the cover and check all the electrical connectors for corrosion, any corrosion what so ever will cause this problem.

2) Extract any trouble codes by shorting out the "A" and "B" terminals of the ALDL connector (assembly line diagnostic link) under the drivers side dashboard, follow these directions, if no codes are found, on to the next step.

3) upon a cold start up, check for spark upon the first cranking of the engine, if none is found, check the coil pack(s) weather pack connector for corrosion. Weather pack connector

4) Check for injector spray by leaning one end of screwdriver against any one injector, have someone crank the engine while leaning your ear against the opposite side of the screwdriver, if a clicking is heard, then the injector is firing, if no clicking is heard, the ECM is not firing the injector, thus you have a PROM (Programmed read only memory) chip problem or your quad drivers in the ECM are not firing on a cold start situation which requires a OBD I scanner to diagnose.

5) Check for cold start fuel pressure by locating the fuel rail, on that rail you will find a shrader valve, depress this before cranking the engine to relieve fuel system pressure. Watch out, fuel will spray all over the place, use a rag to cover it and soak up the excess fuel), now turn the key to "ON", then off and check for fuel pressure once again, you should see a good deal of pressure.

6) If no pressure is found, then either your fuel pressure regulator is defective or the vacuum line leading to it is leaking or the nipple it connects to on the intake manifold is plugged with carbon or your fuel pump relay is defective, on to the next step.

7) Check for fuel pump operation, with someone in the drivers seat, remove the gas cap, stick your ear to the filler neck, now have your assistant turn the key to "ON", if the fuel pump is working, then you will hear a distinct whine eminating from the gas tank, this is the pump.
If nothing is heard, then either the fuel pump relay is defective, or you have a problem with your ignition switch or wiring.


If you still have a problem starting it after all this is checked out, PM me and I will guide you through a thorough diagnostic.

 

[CraigRT]

sounds like the exact problem may parents had with the celebrity.

it was leaky injectors... they had to re-pressurize at cold startup if they sat long enough to leak all the fuel out.

 

[Vette73]

^^


What roger said and if you find out it is not getting fuel then check this probalem I have seen on several GM cars.

When you FIRST try to start a cold car it powers the fuel pump through the fuel pump relay, then after the oil pressure comes up it switchs over to the oil pressure switch. So when you crank it and it will not start the oil pressure is building. When it gets up enouhg to singinal the oil switch then the switch kicks over and powers the fuel pump.

So if no fuel is your problem then chek the Fuel Pump Relay and the wiring also.

 

If nothing is heard, then either the fuel pump relay is defective, or you have a problem with your ignition switch or wiring.

I know I posted a lot of info, but read at the end Martin

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by:

If nothing is heard, then either the fuel pump relay is defective, or you have a problem with your ignition switch or wiring.

I know I posted a lot of info, but read at the end Martin

Yea I didn;t see that till after I wrote it. But that has always been the number #1 problem when a customer has had this problame on a GM car there Robert.

 

Who is Robert ?

 

[Vette73]

Probable a friend of Martin?

 

[Zee]

hahahhah... thank you martin and robert... i mean marlin and roger....

I will most certainly check out what you've written

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Lazee
hahahhah... thank you martin and robert... i mean marlin and roger....

I will most certainly check out what you've written

LOL..

Wow, Roger is the man! That's some good info right there.

 

BAHAHAHA

I read it as Martin, sorry Marlin