YACT - Clutch master cylinder...

[TuffGuy]

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it with a braided stainless steel clutchline?

part 13

Thanks!

:beer:

 

[CrackRabbit]

If you have a Hydraulic clutch yes.

 

[TuffGuy]

Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

 

[TuffGuy]

^^^

 

[NutBucket]

Its most likely a damper of some sort. No danger in removing it. You may feel extra vibrations or similar through the pedal though.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

Yea your left leg will get huge from the workout. 😛

Don't even think about it. Most people try to find a way to add it to old systems, not take them out.

 

[MercenaryForHire]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

Yea your right leg will get huge from the workout. 😛

Don't even think about it. Most people try to find a way to add it told systems, not take them out.

You clutch with your right leg? 😕

- M4H

 

[Rookie]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

Yea your right leg will get huge from the workout. 😛

Don't even think about it. Most people try to find a way to add it told systems, not take them out.

QFT

 

[TuffGuy]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

Yea your left leg will get huge from the workout. 😛

Don't even think about it. Most people try to find a way to add it to old systems, not take them out.

It makes it friction point "funny", especially in the morning when the fluid hasn't fully warmed up yet and isn't flowing smoothly. It's annoying.

 

[Antisocial Virge]

Originally posted by: TuffGuy

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
Thanks!

Are there any drawbacks to bypassing it?

Yea your left leg will get huge from the workout. 😛

Don't even think about it. Most people try to find a way to add it to old systems, not take them out.

It makes it friction point "funny", especially in the morning when the fluid hasn't fully warmed up yet and isn't flowing smoothly. It's annoying.

Which fluid? The fluid in the clutch line shouldn't/does not get any real warmth to it.

 

[TuffGuy]

I think that the clutch and the brakes use the same fluid system.

Until it warms up and thins out a little, not enough gets past the ball bearing/spring thingy inside the clutch master cylinder. The two "fixes" are to gut the cylinder (free mod), or to buy a clutch line to bypass the cylinder.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
I think that the clutch and the brakes use the same fluid system.

Until it warms up and thins out a little, not enough gets past the ball bearing/spring thingy inside the clutch master cylinder. The two "fixes" are to gut the cylinder (free mod), or to buy a clutch line to bypass the cylinder.

Since you missed it in the previous person's post: THE CLUTCH/BRAKE FLUID DOES NOT HEAT UP.

There should be little to no viscosity change in brake fluid regardless of temperature. There is either contamination in your fluid or the problem lies elsewhere in the system and removing the master cylinder increases the pedal effort by such an incredibly high degree that the problem is masked, not cured.

ZV

 

[godmare]

people bypass the clutch master cylinder??

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: TuffGuy
I think that the clutch and the brakes use the same fluid system.

Until it warms up and thins out a little, not enough gets past the ball bearing/spring thingy inside the clutch master cylinder. The two "fixes" are to gut the cylinder (free mod), or to buy a clutch line to bypass the cylinder.

Since you missed it in the previous person's post: THE CLUTCH/BRAKE FLUID DOES NOT HEAT UP.

There should be little to no viscosity change in brake fluid regardless of temperature. There is either contamination in your fluid or the problem lies elsewhere in the system and removing the master cylinder increases the pedal effort by such an incredibly high degree that the problem is masked, not cured.

ZV

Brake fluid doesn't heat up?

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Howard
Brake fluid doesn't heat up?

Not to any significant degree at the reservoir where it would impact the clutch hydraulics. Yes, at the caliper pistons it will heat up with use, and there will be some small heating due to the engine compartment but this is not sufficient to cause the sorts of viscosity changes in the fluid to cause the problem he's describing. For his purposes, the fluid may be said not to heat up.

The simple fact here is that this supposed "issue" with the viscosity of the hydraulic fluid has not been encountered in any other hydrauic clutch system and the basic physics of the system's operation are sufficient to show that this is not an issue with the hydraulics.

ZV

 

[TuffGuy]

If I may pick your brain for a sec...

What happens is that when the car is cold, it feels like the clutch skips/slips/shudders when engaging first. It goes away once it "warms up".

It only happens when the car's been sitting in the garage (cold). If I leave it out in the sun, it never happens.

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Since you missed it in the previous person's post: THE CLUTCH/BRAKE FLUID DOES NOT HEAT UP.
ZV

As you say, most use brake fluid for the hydralic clutch. Also, replacing the hydralic system with a cable will not help matters, only make it worse, as the leverage generated by a hydralic system can be many hundreds of times the force you can get with a hydralic system, just as you say.

My Zuk has a cable, and it is a pain in the ass to keep adjusted correctly. Hydralic systems 'take up the slack' of the wearing clutch, while a cable needs to be periodicly adjusted.

However, brake fluid does heat up. It gets VERY hot. A properly functioning brake setup can generate well over 1000 degrees at the rotor surface. Try driving next to a car doing a good 90 mph and have them hit the braks. you will see the rotor glow red hot. The heat just doesn't disaper into thin air, although a huge portion is given off as radian heat into the atmosphere. the heat that doesn't travels though the pad and into the fluid. brake fluid temps of > 300 degrees are not that uncommon. The brakes I put on my truck recommend >450 degrees of dry boiling tempeature fluid, which basicly means a synthetic, which is what I use. I think it has a boiling point of just under 500.

Now, as you know, brake fluid is hydroscopic, which means it absorbs water VERY well. A can of fluid left open is basicly ruined as it will absorb water right out of the air. Once the fluid becomes contaminated with water in this fashion, it will boil right around the boiling point of water, 212. Several hard stops will get the fluid in the caliper past this point, and will boil the water right out of the fluid, which will make the entire hydralic systm fail, as hydralics are based on an uncompressible liquid, while the vapr that i released by boiling fluid will be easily compressed, and your pedal will hit he stop or the floor. At that point, remember to aim or the softest thing you see, such as a bush. aiming for that cement divider is abad idea, because you are not going to be stopping until you hit something or yank on the cable actuated emergency brake.

Now, the fluid in a hydralic clutch system does not have the same problem with heat buildup that brakes do. Heating a clutch to 1000 degrees will polish the clutch disk, plate, and flywheel in short order. A clutch system will still heat up, but nowhere near the tempeatures seen in brakes. When the clutch is fully let out, properly setup clutch will release no heat, as there is no slippage of te clucth. The heat is only generated while the clucth is 'slipping'; basicly when changing gears.

In addition, the viscosity does change, but as you say, it is not all that much unless you are using DOT 5, which you aren't unless you are driving a race car.