XP Crash

[munga]

Both XP Home and McAfee auto-updated and needed to reboot. So I did. I may have forced a few processes to "end now" rather than wait (I assume this is "bad" but tell me so anyway). When my machine went to reboot, XP wouldn't load because my "windows\[something32]\config\system" was either corrupt or missing. It tells me I can use the repair console to fix it.

So I boot from my XP cd and see the prompt for SCSI/RAID drivers. The os is on a raptor, so...

QUESTION 1) do I need to hit F6 right away and load SATA drivers from floppy?

I skipped it for now and chose "r" for repair console and made it to the c: prompt, where the os is installed. However, I can't change directories?? I managed to figure out that I needed to run configsys /scan , but the computer said there was a disk problem and I need to run chkdisk. Did that and it said there are no problems. Is this my SATA problem?

QUESTION 2) if I decide to say F-it and reinstall windows, should I reformat c: before doing so? I have other partitions with games & programs that won't be affected, right?

QUESTION 3) are you giggling because you know of some big issues I'm going to have to deal with just after I figure out this repair console bs? Please be kind and share a little bit up front. I'm reasonably comfortable with reading up, so point me in the right direction if that's all you have time for.

Many thanks in advance.

Matt

 

[Smilin]

This is usually a pretty easy fix.

1.) Yes, you'll need to provide mass storage drivers.

2.) Don't reinstall. Fix.

3.) hehe. You're on the right path. Here are the details you're missing: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;307545

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: Smilin
This is usually a pretty easy fix.

1.) Yes, you'll need to provide mass storage drivers.

2.) Don't reinstall. Fix.

3.) hehe. You're on the right path. Here are the details you're missing: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;307545

Awesome. Thank you.

 

[munga]

Well, it didn't go so well.

The gist of it is that windows and/or my mobo will no longer recognize my sata drive.

I hit f6 when prompted by windows setup and have an the latest sata drivers from abit. I have four choices for driver, but three of them give me errors and won't load. The fourth seems to load ok.

But when it comes time to either install windows or use the repair console, the sata drive isn't recognized and my IDE drive is (and winstaller calls it the c:\ drive as well - that was confusing).

So now I'm looking for some floppy based bootable disk utilites that will tell me whether the sata drive is hosed (if that's even possible). Any suggestions for this or otherwise?

 

[Smilin]

Just to be clear... You're using F6 while going to recovery console as well right?

A corrupted system hive often stems from corruption on the filesystem. Be sure to run a Chkdsk /P first thing when you get to recovery console.

 

[rkoenn]

First question is is your SATA a RAID or single drive? If RAID it is probably even more trouble then a single drive. I am not sure but it seems odd that even if you load the SATA drivers that windows will not recognize the drive. Maybe that only works once you get a "full" windows up and running and not when the command prompt is running alone. I have repaired some machines recently, earlier this week in fact, using that link on Microsoft's knowlege base, it does work quite well but is labor intensive. Try this link if you want to go to even more trouble, how I fixed a bad registry earlier this week. Even more hands on though. http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=34&threadid=1592749&enterthread=y Finally, if you try the "second" repair option overlaying a new XP install on an existing one, you may find that without a good registry system file that the new install process may not see the existing installation. I had that happen recently also and restoring the original registry fixed that problem. This is probably why so many geeks abhor the Microsoft Windows registry. It could have been done differently and not caused so many folks heartburn.

 

[Soffty]

I used Mc Affee once a while back, destoyed nearly all of windows most important system files.

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: Smilin
Just to be clear... You're using F6 while going to recovery console as well right?

A corrupted system hive often stems from corruption on the filesystem. Be sure to run a Chkdsk /P first thing when you get to recovery console.

Yes, every time. Recovery console sees my IDE drive no problem. That now has a copy of windows on it as well. Even from this installation, the device manager shows the sata drivers as uninstalled (big yellow question mark).

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: Soffty
I used Mc Affee once a while back, destoyed nearly all of windows most important system files.

I am intrigued by your perspective and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: rkoenn
First question is is your SATA a RAID or single drive? If RAID it is probably even more trouble then a single drive. I am not sure but it seems odd that even if you load the SATA drivers that windows will not recognize the drive. Maybe that only works once you get a "full" windows up and running and not when the command prompt is running alone. I have repaired some machines recently, earlier this week in fact, using that link on Microsoft's knowlege base, it does work quite well but is labor intensive. Try this link if you want to go to even more trouble, how I fixed a bad registry earlier this week. Even more hands on though. http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=34&threadid=1592749&enterthread=y Finally, if you try the "second" repair option overlaying a new XP install on an existing one, you may find that without a good registry system file that the new install process may not see the existing installation. I had that happen recently also and restoring the original registry fixed that problem. This is probably why so many geeks abhor the Microsoft Windows registry. It could have been done differently and not caused so many folks heartburn.

It is a single 36 gb raptor, so the data is there, somewhere (I hope).

Thanks for the heads up about seeing the drive but not seeing the installation. I'll check out that link, too.

 

[willstay]

I don't understand why Microsoft adheres to Registry system so much. One small problem, things go bleak and black.

windows\system32\config\system is a registry file. If you have a safe 'System State' backup (taken using ntbackup tool), you can copy it to your healthy system. Restore the backup into different location (using ntbackup of course. If you do not restore to different location using advance options, it will overwrite your healthy system). You can then restore your corrupted file.

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by: munga
It is a single 36 gb raptor, so the data is there, somewhere (I hope).

Thanks for the heads up about seeing the drive but not seeing the installation. I'll check out that link, too.

If you have a parallel system going you should be able to read that drive with the proper drivers. It will certainly be easier to check different drivers with a running OS.

If you find you are unable to access this drive from the parallel then I would abandon any software based troubleshooting and start looking at possible failed hardware.

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: Smilin

Originally posted by: munga
It is a single 36 gb raptor, so the data is there, somewhere (I hope).

Thanks for the heads up about seeing the drive but not seeing the installation. I'll check out that link, too.

If you have a parallel system going you should be able to read that drive with the proper drivers. It will certainly be easier to check different drivers with a running OS.

If you find you are unable to access this drive from the parallel then I would abandon any software based troubleshooting and start looking at possible failed hardware.

It would be quite a coincidence for it to fail on that particular reboot, but I guess I have to consider that possibility. If I run windows from my IDE drive, will I be able to install the sata drivers through that instance of windows? I've only installed them as part of the windows installation in the past.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[Smilin]

No, you can't really "insert" drivers into a different installation.

What you should be able to do VERY easily is simply "update driver" in device manager of your parallel install. You should immediately gain access to your drive. If not you likely have a hardware failure and it's not going to do much good to fool with your original Windows install.

 

[munga]

Okay, I have experienced some progress. I didn't do anything different from what I've been trying to do for the past couple of hours, so I don't feel like the progress was "made". Whatever...

I have installed windows in my second hd (IDE) and finally am able to see my SATA drive from there. My drive appears to be functioning. Using the check disk utility from windows, it appears that the partition having my first windows instance is no longer pristine, as it can't finish the check.

I guess the next thing to do is try and move some data and then try to repair the installation. We'll see.

 

[munga]

Update:

I'm trying to repair the windows installation on my sata drive but I'm humg up trying to access the System Volume Information folder. I have XP home and the NFTS file system, so it appears there's no way to change the access through windows. An MS help article tells me to try using cacls to edit the access control list from a command line. It appears to work but I am still denied access to the folder. (yes, I have admin access).

This is frustrating. I'm about ready to reformat the whole thing, but I haven't been able to get the repair console or win installer to see this drive, so Im not sure I'd be able to install.

Thoughts or suggestions?

 

[imported_Phil]

cacls "c:\System Volume Information" /E /G Administrator:F

Replace "C:" with the drive that contains the folder you can't get in to.

Replace "Administrator" with your username. Remember, there's no spaces in "Administrator:F".

 

[Smilin]

Originally posted by: munga
Update:

I'm trying to repair the windows installation on my sata drive but I'm humg up trying to access the System Volume Information folder. I have XP home and the NFTS file system, so it appears there's no way to change the access through windows. An MS help article tells me to try using cacls to edit the access control list from a command line. It appears to work but I am still denied access to the folder. (yes, I have admin access).

This is frustrating. I'm about ready to reformat the whole thing, but I haven't been able to get the repair console or win installer to see this drive, so Im not sure I'd be able to install.

Thoughts or suggestions?

Ok, from your functioning parallel OS you say that a chkdsk won't complete? What is the error you are seeing? Are you performing a chkdsk on that drive with the /F switch? Since that drive isn't a boot/system drive for your OS you should be able to run a chkdsk /F without a reboot. If it does insist on a reboot, you can see the results in your application log under a "winlogon" event. Pretty much the only error that is absolute is "there were one or more unrecoverable errors". If you're getting that then save what you can from the drive and reformat it.

If you need to access your system volume information folder you'll simply have to take ownership and grand administrators + system access to the folder. Be sure you treat this folder as read only - feel free to take copies of your registry out of it but don't edit anything that's already there. There is a good reason why you aren't granted access to that folder by default. I typically just grant access via the GUI when I have to do this.

 

[munga]

Smilin, I was weak and reformatted.

Current situation is this:

My Sata drive has first (primary?) and second (extended?) partitions. XP used to reside on the first but I reformatted through windows (see below). The second partition is divided into two logical drives, one of which contains programs and data therein that I would like to keep.

My IDE drive has a single partition, is the primary drive, is now the C:\ drive (don't know how this changed) and has a new instance of XP home. From this I can fully access the SATA drive. I was able to do so by installing the default windows drivers through device manager.

Whenever I try to install windows on my sata drive, first partition, the drive can't be found. I've tried two different drivers (F6, floppy, yada yada) both of which seem to load correctly. I've tried disconnecting the IDE drive but installer/repair console say no hard drives are installed and give up right away.

Based on the ability to read/write through windows, I'm assuming the sata drive, cable, and on-board hardware are not the problem. Do I need to delete my partitions and start from scratch with the sata drive? What exactly is "scratch" for a hard drive? What utilities do I need to do this?

 

[rasczak]

did you enable the sata drive in your bios? if it is enabled, you may have a bad sata port and need to rma. or you can try plugging the sata cable into another port on your motherboard (they usually have more than one port) and try again. unplug your ide drive and try installing again.

 

[munga]

Originally posted by: jpbelauskas
did you enable the sata drive in your bios? if it is enabled, you may have a bad sata port and need to rma. or you can try plugging the sata cable into another port on your motherboard (they usually have more than one port) and try again. unplug your ide drive and try installing again.

Yes, sata is enabled in bios. It was working fine until windows and mcafee did auto-updates and I was prompted to reboot. I think my mobo (abit ai7) has a second sata port so I will try this out tonight. I am skeptical that it is a hardware issue, though, because of the timing of the problem and ability to access the drive from current windows installation.

 

[munga]

Well whaddya know! When prompted for sata drivers, I can only see four choices. Although there's nothing to indicate it, I CAN SCROLL DOWN AND SEE MORE DRIVER CHOICES.

Right driver, problem solved. Many thanks to those who offered help. The lesson is a familiar one: I'm an idiot.

 

[rasczak]

hah, good job man!