XBOX: 733MHz P3 or 733MHz Celeron :)

[xtreme2k]

I got a feeling it MIGHT be a 733 Celeron since on the XBOX specs page, they did NOT state it is a P3. It only state it is a Intel 733Mhz CPU. Because if it is the better one, they would 'boast' by saying it is a 733Mhz P3. But since they didnt. I got a feeling they are 'keeping quiet' about it because it could be a Celeron 733Mhz.


http://www.xbox.com/hardware/console/

I find this not hard to believe since intel is basically giving the chips to m$ at a "CLOSE TO ZERO" price But then even for a 733MHz P3, I find it no big deal really. A Tbird 1.2GHz + GF3 will kick it definately.

 

[joohang]

Or maybe a 133 MHz FSB Duron?

 

[ThisIsMatt]

<< I find this not hard to believe since intel is basically giving the chips to m$ at a &quot;CLOSE TO ZERO&quot; price >>



Intel: Okay Mr. M$, we'll supply you with all the chips you need under one condition.

M$: Oh, what's that???

Intel: The condition is that you continue your long line of over rated, under performing, bloatware that makes people always jump for the newest and fastest processors, even if they are overrated and over hyped.

M$: No problem, we've got that all planned and laid out for at least the next ten years. As a matter of fact, our next POS OS is coming out in the not too distant future. We call it XP, the X stands for eXpansion, the P for Propagator. Not only does it initially require high end hardware, but it's even self bloating, meaning it gets slower and slower over time.

Intel: Muhahahhaa, exxxxxxcelent.

AMD behind bushes: Ohhhh nooo, must bring superior processors to market at lower prices to help offset this BS

Mr. Linux: Here that boys? Let's get to work - maybe we can clean windows all the way out in the next few years


Sorry, it's late

 

[joohang]

<< Mr. Linux: Here that boys? Let's get to work - maybe we can clean windows all the way out in the next few years >>



LOL. A very realistic joke. With spelling mistake and all for Mr. Linux.

 

They are probably cheap low-yield PIIIs. I was thinking they were custom low-heat PIIIs. Who really knows.

 

[codehack2]

I vote for the 733 Celeron, remember back to the Celeron A days? We saw the 300a @ 450 beating or staying even with a standard 450 PII in games. Having a large L2 cache is not critical for games.

CH2

 

[Pakman]

<< I vote for the 733 Celeron, remember back to the Celeron A days? We saw the 300a @ 450 beating or staying even with a standard 450 PII in games. Having a large L2 cache is not critical for games. >>

Well, that doesn't apply to the P3 since the L2 cache is running at full clock speed. The reason whey the Celeron A's were so fast was because even though they only had half the L2 cache of the P2's, they were running at full clock speed. The P2's L2 cache during that time was running at 1/2 the clock speed. The Celerons and P3s both have on die L2 cache now so the P3s will outperform the Celerons by a more significant margin.

 

[xtreme2k]

P3/733
- 256KByte L2
- 8 way association
- 133MHz FSB

Celeron 733
- 128KByte L2
- 4 way association
- 66MHz FSB

There is a difference

 

[Shmorq]

Is there also a latency difference of the cache?
Somethin like Pentium III's have a zero latency while the Celerons have a latency of 2?

 

[TravisBickle]

*cough* just thought I'd tell you that Celerons are more expensive to produce than PIIIs because of the extra work done on them to cripple them, though they come off the same production lines.
probably is PIII based, Intel just doesn't want everyone to see how they can manage to almost give away a processor that is overpriced in the PC market.

 

[xtreme2k]

There is actually NO lantency difference.

WCPUID is just faulty at detecting that.
As you can see, all the newer version of WCPUID 3.0 does NOT have the lantency information anymore.

Why I say this?
It is because you cannot have a lantency of zero(0). That means when you request the data in your L2, the data is already in your L2 - doesnt make sense right?

I also got some Cache/Memory access lantency program benchmark which I tested, and showed No difference.
3cycle L1
7cycle L2 lantency

on both the Celeron-2 and the P3.

 

[xtreme2k]

Actually intel has reasons to use Celeron


P3's L2 is of very high density and hence very easy to be faulty. But might not the whole 256kbyte be faulty, maybe only part of it, say 100byte is faulty, then intel just disable that HALF of the cache and it is basically 'fixed'. Instead of throwing the cpu with slighty faulty caches, they just use them as celerons.

Seriously, if they are REALLY P3, i am SURE that it will be listed as Intel P3/733MHz CPU, not just Intel 733Mhz cpu. Maybe they re-work the FSB to be 133MHz Celeron, but who knows.

 

[Zeeliv]

The processor in the Xbox is known to have 128K L2. They haven't given out what FSB it runs on as far as I know (though I don't think it'd be lower than 133).

 

[xtreme2k]

Zeeliv

Do you have a link confirming that?

 

[Zeeliv]

Ahh crap, it's accepted as common knowledge on every major Xbox board on the net. I know I read it more officially in a few places, but I I'll have to look around...

 

[xtreme2k]

I knew it

I just didnt see any confirmation about it

 

[Finality]

I doubt it. The way Celerons are currently made is that they are just castrated P3s. The cache is still physically there just burnt off.

If Intel changes that process then yes it is possible that the Celeron might be the chip to be used. Its also supposed to use the P4s instruction set (Screaming Cindy?) so its not a stock P3/Celeron processor, but rather a more custom one.

 

[xtreme2k]

Where is the confirmation of P4 instructions used in the XBOX?

 

[MadRat]

If it is 733 Celeron then expect a 133fsb. Synchronous designs are easier to implement as far as that goes. I just highly doubt it would be a Celeron.

 

[twong82]

I remember reading an article from somewhere where they said that Microsoft removed the listing of the Pentium 3 because they might use an AMD processor instead. I forgot where I read about this.

 

[xtreme2k]

I dont think that will be the case.

Because
- it is too late and ugly to change now.
- I think they are using Nvidia chipsets for the P3, which does not support AMD easily.

 

[Oyeve]

Who cares if its a P3 or a celery? Its still gonna be better than PS2 and it will still kick ass!

 

[esung]

twong82: actually it's the otherway around. xbox started with AMD in mind, (DDR and everything), but Intel outbid AMD at the 11th hour, probably doing it under cost.

I'd imagine xbox will be the cheapiest Intel that could part away with, probably a 733/66 Celeron. Plus lower FSB means it's cheaper for the RAM as well.

as the saying that xbox will beat PS2, I'm not too sure about this, because it depends on the producer and the design of the game. Sure, xbox has a higher spec then PS2, but if the game developer couldn't
use it too the fulliest extend, PS2 is still on top (I know only Konami is pushing for xbox, not sure about Square/EA, Capcom, Namco
and other powerhouse in Japan though...)

 

If you do the math it has to be a P3 running on a 133Mhz bus:

Celeron: 66Mhz bus * 11x multiplier = ~733Mhz (not likely)
P3-733: 100Mhz bus * 7.33x multipler (bzzt, wrong answer, impossible)
P3-733: 133Mhz bus * 5.5x multipler = ~733Mhz (sounds good to me)

I still say the chip will be custom, like a mobile chip, for the sake of heat reduction. However, that could be mighty expensive for Intel, being they are whoreing the chips out to have the &quot;Intel Inside&quot; sticker on the XBox (right next to the &quot;Powered by Windows XP technology&quot; sticker).

 

[Macro2]

The X-box chip is Pentium III.
The real danger is that a 733 chip in Q3-Q4 is going to &quot;look&quot; awful slow. Durons over 1000 Mhz will be common.
I suspect the actual speed and name of the chip will not be &quot;featured&quot;.
The big thing is that the chip used in X-BOX needs to be passively cooled. That's why it's necessary for .13u technology.

Mac