WTO rules US aid to Boeing is illegal

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,986
3,321
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This is par for the course. It`s okay for another country to subsidies but let us do it and everybody cries foul!!!
Who give a about the EU??
The EU is Germanys attempt to do what it could not do in two -- YES -- two world wars!!



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110331/ap_on_bi_ge/eu_wto_boeing

GENEVA – The World Trade Organization has ruled that Boeing Co. received at least $5.3 billion in illegal U.S. subsidies to develop and build new planes, according to a finding of a report first issued in January but made public on Thursday.

The WTO trade panel's report came in response to EU complaints, which had alleged that Boeing received almost $24 billion in illegal state subsidies between 1989 and 2006.

The public release of the ruling Thursday is the latest development in a six-year contest and will likely next go to a WTO appeals panel.

WTO say in its ruling that the EU has demonstrated the U.S. gave Boeing "export subsidies that are prohibited" and recommends the U.S. either withdraw them or "take steps to remove the adverse affects."

The report details findings, which were first issued in private to the EU and U.S. in January. It says Beoieng received illegal subsidies such as grants and free use of technology, from NASA, the Department of Defense, and the states of Illinois, Kansas and Washington.

These include $2.6 billion in NASA research and development programs, $2.2 billion in foreign sales corporation export subsidies, and various tax breaks and other incentives from several states and cities. The Defense Department also gave Boeing an illegal subsidy, the ruling says, but "the amount of the subsidy ... is unclear."

Other subsidies, such as the $2.2 billion in export tax benefits, are essentially a moot point, the panel found, because U.S. law has changed.

The ruling says the panel estimated the subsidies were "at least $5.3 billion over the period 1989-2006."

The panel of trade judges say that $2.6 billion in NASA aid, $112 million from the Defense Department and $16 million in tax breaks from Washington state and the city of Everett, Wash., violated international trade rules.

Competing aircraft maker Airbus, a unit of European Aeronautic Defence and Space Co., estimates it has lost $45 billion in aircraft sales because of the subsidies.

The release of the ruling Thursday is the latest development in a six-year contest and will likely next go to a WTO appeals panel.

A separate WTO trade panel, ruling on U.S. complaints, also has faulted European governments for illegally supporting Airbus.

Airbus welcomed the ruling saying that WTO had "publicly condemned the United States for giving Boeing massive illegal subsidies that caused Airbus to lose $45 billion in sales."

Boeing, meanwhile, said the WTO had "shattered the longstanding European myth that illegal Airbus subsidies are necessary to fend off alleged U.S. subsidies to Boeing."

Boeing acknowledged it got $2.6 billion of illegal U.S. funding, but said that pales in comparison to $20 billion of "illegal Airbus subsidies."

That interpretation was echoed by the office of the U.S. Trade Representative, which said the subsidies the Europeans give to Airbus "dwarf anything that the U.S. government does for Boeing."

Germany was quick to welcome the WTO's ruling.

"The WTO confirms that the U.S. subsidies were considerably damaging for the European aviation industry, to Airbus in particular," Economy Minister Rainer Bruederle said in a statement Thursday.

Germany said it supports the EU effort to allow both the Boeing and Airbus cases to be judged by the WTO at the same time. As the two giant aircraft manufacturers have dueled, other nations' industries have begun muscling into the business.

"Despite the findings in the WTO's Boeing report, we have to continue working toward a political solution without preconditions," Bruederle said. "From an economic policy point of view, this is necessary for the future of the aviation industries on both sides of the Atlantic, especially in light of the changed global competition."
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
38,416
4
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Good, now let us take a look at European and Asian subsidies to their native companies, which may or may not be state owned.

Samsung, **cough**
 

ichy

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2006
6,940
8
81
This is par for the course. It`s okay for another country to subsidies but let us do it and everybody cries foul!!!
Who give a about the EU??
The EU is Germanys attempt to do what it could not do in two -- YES -- two world wars!!

Are you illiterate? The article that you posted said that the WTO has also ruled against European aid to Airbus.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,330
126
Wait a minute, it is illegal for the US to subsidize the building, research, and development of its war machines???

I am with a previous poster, tell em to get fucked.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Good, now let us take a look at European and Asian subsidies to their native companies, which may or may not be state owned.

Samsung, **cough**

My dad imports door handles and locks from China. He regularily gets pricing information based on the rate the Chinese govt is subsidizing the factory.
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
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NEWS FLASH: The WTO is no longer interested in actually regulating fairness in trade so much as issuing large fines against large corporations in order to pad their own pockets.
 
Aug 23, 2000
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I'm with the crowd that say, "F off WTO".
$2.6Bill or $20+ billion? Why are the fining the US parties, but not the European ones?
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
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This Just In. World Trade Organization headquarters leveled in an apparent runaway bulldozer incident. Witnesses at the scene had this to say "It was the damndest thing we ever saw, it just kept going back and forth" The driver was finally able to shut the machine off after the last wall fell.
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
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May 11, 2008
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Oh, get of your high horse.

In the EU numerous countries are prevented daily from subsidizing companies. With all the help to the banks in the EU... Yes the banks who got in financial trouble because of the mortgages fraud, could only receive financial aid under strict rules to prevent local country government aided advantages which would undermine the free market.

Besides, companies manufacturing GM food and companies manufacturing medicines and companies manufacturing growth hormones in the US, have attempted many times to use the WTO to force countries in the EU (who have stricter health and safety rules) to open their markets to allow the selling of these illegal and sometimes proven dangerous products without the proper information about hazardous side effects.

I am happy to see the WTO still does some good.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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The EU is Germanys attempt to do what it could not do in two -- YES -- two world wars!!

You mean the blatant imperialism or the waged wars? The occupation of foreign land? The way the EU ignores international law and is NOT willing to follow the rules set by the international community under UN?

Is Airbus German? Is it perhaps French?

Congrats, you've managed to make light of Germanys actions in the WWII, how fucking proud your parents must be of you...
 
Jun 26, 2007
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I'm with the crowd that say, "F off WTO".
$2.6Bill or $20+ billion? Why are the fining the US parties, but not the European ones?

BOEING said 20+billion, otoh, if we are going to go with what the companies say, that's 45+ billions for Boeing according to the same standards.

But hey, let's forget about that since that would make your side look worse.
 

ichy

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2006
6,940
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Both Boeing and Airbus receive huge amounts of government assistance in one form or another. Anyone who pretends otherwise is an ostrich sticking his head in the sand.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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Both Boeing and Airbus receive huge amounts of government assistance in one form or another. Anyone who pretends otherwise is an ostrich sticking his head in the sand.

Absolutely, there is legal subsidies and ILLEGAL subsidies, legal subsidies include those used by government to provide a specific product for government, illegal subsidies are the kind that are used to subsidise the price of sale to other nations.

It's well put in the article itself, if anyone ever cares to read it and follow up on the facts of it they might learn something on how world trade rules apply.

It's NEVER been a bad deal for the US, but once one decision goes against those who believe they are entitled they will whine endlessly about it.

It bores the shit out of me.
 

nCred

Golden Member
Oct 13, 2003
1,109
114
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Actually, Airbus didn't recieve anywhere close to $20 billion in subsidies. They were loans which Airbus payed back in full incl. interest. Problem was that the interest rate on the loans were below the market interest rate.
 
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Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
5
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BOEING said 20+billion, otoh, if we are going to go with what the companies say, that's 45+ billions for Boeing according to the same standards.

But hey, let's forget about that since that would make your side look worse.


And yet:

- Trade court rejects nearly 80% of EU claim of improper support for Boeing; finds no U.S. equivalent for billions in illegal European launch aid provided to Airbus

- Final rulings in U.S. and EU cases now public; findings show Airbus received more than $20 billion in impermissible funding versus $2.7 billion for Boeing.- Boeing reiterates call for Airbus to fund A350 and other new programs on commercial terms, and remedy prohibited export subsidies on the A380


http://www.aviationnews.eu/2011/03/...sive-airbus-advantage-from-illegal-subsidies/


You'll pardon me for not taking your position seriously, since the WTO also ruled that Airbus was receiving illegal subsidies. And contrary to your 45bn assertion, the WTO have thrown out 80% of that very claim.



With control of the $3 trillion global commercial airplane market up for grabs, the World Trade Organization ruled Wednesday that four European governments had provided illegal subsidies over the past 40 years for every jet Airbus has launched and that Boeing and the American aerospace industry paid a steep price for the unfair competition.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/06/30/96806/wto-ruled-illegal-airbus-subsidies.html


Additional sources
http://www.euronews.net/2010/06/30/wto-says-airbus-got-illegal-subsidies/

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/sep/05/eu-subsidies-for-airbus-illegal/

So: We get the Airbus announcement last June. And the Boeing announcement today.


Conclusion? The WTO are lining their own pockets, rather than expressing any real desire to regulate trade fairly.