WTF is a Cisco Media Convergence Server?

[Epsil0n00]

I am looking at purchasing Cisco Clean Access, a network admission control solution that enforces custom policies like patch levels, anti-virus state, etc.

Anyhow, our consultant that is submitting a quote for Clean Access included 2 Cisco Media Convergence Servers. What exactly is a Cisco Media Convergence Server and why would I need to purchase two of them for Cisco Clean Access?

Are these the actual hardware server machines on which the server software runs? If this is the case, couldn't I just purchase a normal HP or Dell server box?

Thanks for any perspective.
Epsil0n

 

[spidey07]

Its their server. To ensure maxium reliability they use just a few different hardware options.

Its just a rebadged HP server.

-edit- I think you need two...one for the manager and one for the agent. don't know if you can use your own server.

 

[melthemoose]

cisco box, cisco software: something goes wrong, call Cisco, Cisco fixes

Cisco software, HP server: something goes wrong, 2 calls to fix with each company blaming the other for the problem.

You make the call.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: melthemoose
cisco box, cisco software: something goes wrong, call Cisco, Cisco fixes

Cisco software, HP server: something goes wrong, 2 calls to fix with each company blaming the other for the problem.

You make the call.

Just note this. I installed a CallManager cluster 4 years ago using Cisco equipment, as Spidey says a rebadged HP (Compaq then) server. Standard DL380.

This last weekend, I upgraded CCM to 4.1. Found out several months back my hardware from Cisco from 4 years back is no longer supported on version 4 or above. So I had to buy a brand new server. Cisco reseller quoted roughly $3500 for a DL 320 with 80 GB SATA drive and 1GB memory. And that quote was 40% off list.

I bought absolutely identical box direct from HP from <$1800.

So yes, buy from Cisco if you don't want the hassle of 2 vendors, but you will pay thru the nose.

 

[spidey07]

is call manager even supported on a non-MGS platform?

I can understand though. But 4 years is a very long time for server hardware to be current.

 

[alent1234]

Originally posted by: dphantom

Originally posted by: melthemoose
cisco box, cisco software: something goes wrong, call Cisco, Cisco fixes

Cisco software, HP server: something goes wrong, 2 calls to fix with each company blaming the other for the problem.

You make the call.

Just note this. I installed a CallManager cluster 4 years ago using Cisco equipment, as Spidey says a rebadged HP (Compaq then) server. Standard DL380.

This last weekend, I upgraded CCM to 4.1. Found out several months back my hardware from Cisco from 4 years back is no longer supported on version 4 or above. So I had to buy a brand new server. Cisco reseller quoted roughly $3500 for a DL 320 with 80 GB SATA drive and 1GB memory. And that quote was 40% off list.

I bought absolutely identical box direct from HP from <$1800.

So yes, buy from Cisco if you don't want the hassle of 2 vendors, but you will pay thru the nose.

that's crazy

we have 2 DL320's as domain controllers and with 512MB RAM ours were like $1500 each

Is that price tag with a good support contract?

Depending on the business it might be a good deal. If you are in a 24/7 environment and something needs to be fixed right away if it goes down then you save more money by buying a solution from one vendor.

 

[Epsil0n00]

They quoted me $3765 per server for the Cisco badged hardware. They didn't even tell me what type of server it is, or what model it is. All they put on the quote was "2 x Cisco Media Convergence Server - $3765"

So, it sounds like they are way over charging me! OMG, I am totally just buying some normal HP servers.

Thanks for all the advice/info!

 

[spidey07]

Not really.

the MCS comes in many different models. without knowing the models it is hard to tell.

US list pricing for MCS servers...

Cisco Media Convergence Servers
MCS-7815-I1-ECS1 MCS 7815 tower; Unity and Unity Bridge; 1GB; Win2K C $6,000
MCS-7825-H1-ECS1 MCS 7825-HP rack; 1GB RAM; sATA RAID; Win2K C $9,000
MCS-7825-I1-ECS1 MCS 7825-IBM rack; 1GB RAM; sATA RAID; Win2K C $9,000
MCS-7835-H1-ECS1 MCS 7835-HP; rack; 2GB; RAID 1; Win2K C $14,000
MCS-7835-I1-ECS1 MCS 7835-IBM; rack; 2GB; RAID 1; Win2K C $14,000
MCS-7845-H1-ECS1 MCS 7845-HP; VM-6HDD; rack; 4GB; RAID 1(x3) DUAL CPU; Win2K C $25,000
MCS-7845-H1-ECS2 MCS 7845-HP; UM-4HDD; rack; 4GB; RAID 1(x2) DUAL CPU; Win2K C $23,000
MCS-7845-I1-ECS1 MCS 7845-IBM; VM-6HDD; rack; 4GB; RAID 1(x3) DUAL CPU; Win2K C $25,000
MCS-7845-I1-ECS2 MCS 7845-IBM; UM-4HDD; rack; 4GB; RAID 1(x2) DUAL CPU; Win2K C $23,000
MCS-7825H-3.0-CC1 MCS 7825H-3000 With P4 3060, 1GB RAM, 40GB HD B $6,000
MCS-7825H-3.0-IPC1 HW Only MCS 7825H-3000 With P4 3060, 1GB RAM, 40GB HD B $6,000
MCS-7825I-3.0-CC1 MCS 7825I-3000 P4 3060MHz, 1GB RAM, 80GB SATA HD B $6,000
MCS-7825I-3.0-IPC1 HW Only MCS 7825I-3000 With P4 3060, 1GB RAM, 80GB HD B $6,000
MCS-7835I-2.4-36= Spare 36GB Ultra SCSI Hot Plug Drive for MCS 7835I-2400 B $1,495
MCS-7825H-2.2-CC1 MCS 7825H-2266 Server With P4 2.266,1GB SDRAM, 40GB ATA B $6,000
MCS-7815-I1-IPC1 HW Only MCS-7815-I1 with 1024MB RAM and 80GB HD B $4,000
MCS-7835-H1-IPC1 HW Only MCS-7835-H1 with 2048MB RAM and Two 72GB SCSI HD B $12,000
MCS-7835-H1-RC1 HW Only MCS-7835-H1 with 2048MB RAM and Two 72GB SCSI HD B $12,000
MCS-7835-I1-IPC1 HW Only MCS-7835-I1 with 2048MB RAM and Two 72GB SCSI HD B $12,000
MCS-7835-I1-RC1 HW Only MCS-7835-I1 with 2048MB RAM adn Two 72GB SCSI HD B $12,000
MCS-7845-H1-IPC1 HW Only MCS-7845-H1 with 4096MB RAM and Four 72GB SCSI HD B $24,000
MCS-7845-H1-RC1 HW only MCS-7845-H1 with 4096MB RAM and Four 72GB SCSI HD B $24,000
MCS-7845-I1-IPC1 HW Only MCS-7845-I1 with 4096MB RAM and Four 72GB SCSI HD B $24,000
MCS-7845-I1-RC1 HW Only MCS-7845-I1 with 4096MB RAM and Four 72GB SCSI HD B $24,000
MCS-7815-I1-RDT HW Only Two MCS-7815-I1 Servers used Redundantly B $8,000
MCS-7815-I1-CC1 HW Only MCS-7815-I1 with 1024MB RAM and 80GB HD B $4,000

That's list. Cisco discounts should run 30-50%

But what really matters here is support and maintenance/operations. DO NOT SKIMP on capital to save a few bucks on a server only to waste thousands upon thousands of dollars of downtime while the software and hardware vendors argue with each other.
I guess what I'm trying to say is operation of any network solution is generally 70% of a solution is in support/operations - that's where you save the money. Not on the hardware cost.

IMHO, you paid a consultant to provide you a solution. To try and skimp on corners and not see the big picture for a paltry couple grand will bite you later on.

 

[alent1234]

Originally posted by: Epsil0n00
They quoted me $3765 per server for the Cisco badged hardware. They didn't even tell me what type of server it is, or what model it is. All they put on the quote was "2 x Cisco Media Convergence Server - $3765"

So, it sounds like they are way over charging me! OMG, I am totally just buying some normal HP servers.

Thanks for all the advice/info!

i would think twice about it. last week we had a cisco router go down and a replacement was on site within 3 hours of the RMA being issued for the old one. This was a sunday afternoon. We have a good support contract, but Cisco is good in the support department. The router that went down didn't even match the serial number that was on the contract because of our stupid reseller, and Cisco still gave us a replacement. A few years ago they replaced a router within a few hours on Thanksgiving Day.

If that office went down during the week it would mean we wouldn't bill our customers or sign new ones up. A lot of lost money. Don't save a penny to risk losing a dollar. Look at the entire solution and make your mind up if it's worth it.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: spidey07
is call manager even supported on a non-MGS platform?

I can understand though. But 4 years is a very long time for server hardware to be current.

Yes, so long as the specs are identical to a Cisco rebadge. And I have smartnet coverage on CCM software with HP depot coverage on the hardware.

Cisco does nothing else to the HP box except stick their name on it. And triple the cost.

Also, IMHO, software upgrades to one's telephone platform should not require hardware replacement every 3-4 years. I would never see a Definity PBX replaced after 3 years just to update software.

That's where Cisco needs to fix its telephony offernigns. I was one of the first adapter of Cisco AVVID/Unity in the State and have let my regional Cisco rep know I cannot replace hardware every three years. It's almost like buying a brand new phones system.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: alent1234

Originally posted by: dphantom

Originally posted by: melthemoose
cisco box, cisco software: something goes wrong, call Cisco, Cisco fixes

Cisco software, HP server: something goes wrong, 2 calls to fix with each company blaming the other for the problem.

You make the call.

Just note this. I installed a CallManager cluster 4 years ago using Cisco equipment, as Spidey says a rebadged HP (Compaq then) server. Standard DL380.

This last weekend, I upgraded CCM to 4.1. Found out several months back my hardware from Cisco from 4 years back is no longer supported on version 4 or above. So I had to buy a brand new server. Cisco reseller quoted roughly $3500 for a DL 320 with 80 GB SATA drive and 1GB memory. And that quote was 40% off list.

I bought absolutely identical box direct from HP from <$1800.

So yes, buy from Cisco if you don't want the hassle of 2 vendors, but you will pay thru the nose.

that's crazy

we have 2 DL320's as domain controllers and with 512MB RAM ours were like $1500 each

Is that price tag with a good support contract?

Depending on the business it might be a good deal. If you are in a 24/7 environment and something needs to be fixed right away if it goes down then you save more money by buying a solution from one vendor.

I have Cicso smartnewt coverage on the software and HP 4 hr depot coverage on the hardware. About as good as one can get without actually having a hot spare in place.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: alent1234

Originally posted by: Epsil0n00
They quoted me $3765 per server for the Cisco badged hardware. They didn't even tell me what type of server it is, or what model it is. All they put on the quote was "2 x Cisco Media Convergence Server - $3765"

So, it sounds like they are way over charging me! OMG, I am totally just buying some normal HP servers.

Thanks for all the advice/info!

i would think twice about it. last week we had a cisco router go down and a replacement was on site within 3 hours of the RMA being issued for the old one. This was a sunday afternoon. We have a good support contract, but Cisco is good in the support department. The router that went down didn't even match the serial number that was on the contract because of our stupid reseller, and Cisco still gave us a replacement. A few years ago they replaced a router within a few hours on Thanksgiving Day.

If that office went down during the week it would mean we wouldn't bill our customers or sign new ones up. A lot of lost money. Don't save a penny to risk losing a dollar. Look at the entire solution and make your mind up if it's worth it.

Alent is absolutely correct. If you need absolute peace of mind, go with a straight Cisco solution. Your consultant is giving you pretty good info it sounds like.

I made a concious decision based on my experience (4+years) with CCM and understanding hardware/software integration to go with a separate server direct from HP.

But as I stated in above posts, I made sure I have depot coverage on the hardware and Smartnet on the CCM software.

Don't skimp just to save a few bucks. Especially if this is the first installation, I would also strongly lean toward the integrated Cisco solution adn not spearate hardware.

My 2 cents.