WTB gamer system - your recommendations pls

[hsmomtoo]

Back in 06/99 I replaced our 486/33 with the following system:

P3-450mhz, Asus p2b-f 2/440 bx, 64M SDRAM PC100 (upgraded to 256 in 2002), Lite-on 40x cd-rom, Panasonic 1.44 fdd, Quantum CR 13GB HD, Diamond Viper 770 TNT-2 16M AGP, Creative SB Live, USR 56K v.90 PCI modem w/v/d/f, Altec Lansing ACS-44 speaker system, 17" Viewsonic E771 Monitor, and (of course) MS keyboard & mouse, and case to complete all. I was looking for a system that wasn't quite mainstream yet, with good gaming capability for our kids (Starcraft/Warcraft, Half-life, etc.) and still enough for the usual home office applications/music, for a decent deal. I did all the reading of computer papers that I could prior (and I know some of you will probably roll your eyes at this system set up) - but it seemed like a decent system then ($2000.). I researched components and put the system together (not physically but by request).

Now No. 1 son is going to inherit this system and we therefore need a replacement. I want someone's honest opinion/recommendation for a comparable (just under top of the line) system that will probably be replaced in another 5 years when No. 2 son inherits! It should be configured with (of course) more complicated, upcoming game requirements in mind. What say you to this:
Intel P4 3.2GHZ C 512KB 800FSB S478, Corsair PC3200 CM64SD512-3200 512MB DDR 184PIN CAS3, Asus P4C800-E Deluxe S478 875P Dual DDR 5PCI SATA RAID 1000LAN 1394 SOUND, Seagate Barracuda 7200.7 120GB ATA100 7200RPM 8MB, ATI Radeon 9800 PRO 128MB AGP VGA DVI-I TV OUT, Creative SB Audigy 2 ZS 7.1 1394 PCI, U.S.R 56K DFV ALANA PCI VOICE WIN MODEM INT, LG CRD-8521B 52X MAX EIDE ATAPI CD-ROM , PLEXTOR Plexwriter PX-W5224TA CDRW 52X24X52 INT IDE, 1.44 FDD, Altec Lansing ATP3 3-PIECE /W subwoofer, NEC Multisync FE770 17IN flat screen CRT 0.25MM 1280X1024@66HZ (FE770), MS Multimedia keyboard & Optical Mouse.

I am not well versed in computer component compatibility and come at this strictly from a layperson's point of view, but I try to do my homework! ~ Questions: 1) Are such things as a performance optimizer and video cooling system necessary? 2) Are any areas over/underkill? 3) Am I missing any critical stuff (aside from a case)? 4) Would I be better to opt for P4EE (or AMD according to some of your postings)? 5) Should I be looking at a 1200VA Universal UPS for this system, or something less? 6) Is the Radeon 9800 the video board preferred these days? Corsair better than Kingston?

I would like to stay a little ahead of the game without going too high in price (roughly comparable in today's market for the $2000 I spent back then).

Your input is greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[Wuzup101]

You might want to have a mod move this to a more appropriate forum. This is a Small Form Factor/Notebook forum pretty much (what you're considering isn't either). Anyway, what you have planned sounds decent. You might consider an AMD64 or a faster (or overclocked) AMD "barton" processor. If you do go P4 don't opt for the grossly overpriced P4EE. Your hard earned cash will only get you marginal performance gains. 9800Pro seems to be the hot choice right now for the price. If you can wait for a few weeks you should see another price drop as the new boards come out. There isn't a huge jump over the Pro with the XT... so i say the XT is probably not worth the extra cash as of now. I also think that instead of a CD drive and a CD burner you should go DVD drive and a DVD-RW. The difference between a pioneer 16x slot loading (or tray) DVD drive over a CD drive isn't very much. A decent DVD-RW (sony, lite-on, etc...) shouldn't cost more than $150 (but you should be able to get one for less). If you're not planning on overclocking go with the pc3200 (corsair is great). If you want to have the option of overclocking go with pc3500-4000 (whatever you can afford). I would also strongly consider going with 1gig of ram.

Just screwing around at newegg:

AMD Athlon XP Mobile 2500+ (512k L2) - $94
Thermaltake Silent Boost Heatsink - $38
Abit NF7-S (Serial ATA raid, 10/100 ethernet, 6x usb 2.0, 2x firewire, 5.1 digital/analogue soundstorm audio, 5pci, ddr400) - $105
Saphire Radeon9800Pro 128mb RETAIL package - $219
2 x 512mb Corsair XMS pc3200 - $288
Lite-On 8x DVD-RW (model SOHW 812s 8x DVD+/-R and 4x +/- RW w/ 40x CD-R and 24x RW) - $107
Sony 16x DVD-ROM - $35
Sony FDD - $11
Enermax 460W PSU - $108
Chieftech Midtower Case (4x 5.25 external, 2x 3.5 external, 4x 3.5 internal, very nice fan mounts 2 front intake 2 exhust, fans not included, front usb2, firewire, audio) - $65
2x 120gb Segate 8mb SATA drives (you can hook them up in raid) - $212
Hatachi 17" LCD model: CML17SXWB (16ms response, great gaming monitor, Digital DVI-D input/analogue also, 400:1 contrast ratio, .264 pix pitch, 260 cd/m^2 brightness) - $467
Logitech Z5300 Speakers (5.1 THX cert, analogue, 280watt RMS, very nice for the price esp for DVDs and gaming) - $149
4x Panaflow fans (Low or med output has low noise with 4 it should provide enough cooling, newegg doesn't carry, price is a bit of an overestimate) - $50
Logitech MX Duo (great keyboard/mouse, both wireless, rechargable mouse batts) - $75

Total: $2023 (all prices reflect shipping)

It really depends on what you want to do with your system. If you do a lot of video editing/backing up DVDs then the 2x raid system is a good idea. If not you might chose to go w/ a 160gb drive to save money. A gig of ram might seem like overkill... but trust me it's not. 2.2ghz (3200+) is a conservative overclock for that processor. Even if you don't want to overclock it's still fast at it's stock speed (but then you are better off getting the desktop version). The mobile versions have been hitting 2.4-2.6ghz. Again this is just to show you what you could get with an AMD system. 5.1 sound from soundstorm is excelent IMHO... no need for an add on sound card!

 

[Wuzup101]

BTW... when did freekin pc3200 jump to 150 a stick? I paid 102 / 512 this summer of the same stuff!

 

[axemanxt40]

If your spending around 2000 bucks for a system...and it doesn't have an AMD 64 processor in it...you are definitely configuring it wrong.

ANTEC Silver Aluminum Performance 1 Series ATX Mid-Tower Case Model "P160" -RETAIL $ 101.00

Lite-On Beige DVD-RW/+RW Drive, Model LDW-811S/851S, OEM Bulk Pack $ 83.00

Lite-On 16X DVD-ROM Drive, Model XJ-HD166S, OEM $ 29.00

Samsung 1.44MB 3.5inch Floppy Disk Drive, Model SFD321B/LEB, OEM Drive Only $ 9.99

Hitachi 160GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model HDS722516VLSA80, OEM Drive Only $ 119.00

2 x Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - OEM $ 288.00

ABIT K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754 CPU, Model "KV8-MAX3" -RETAIL $ 147.00

Thermaltake W0014 Silent Purepower 480W with Black housing $ 60.00

AMD Athlon 64 3200+, 1MB L2 Cache - Retail $ 282.00

Creative Labs Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS PCI Sound Card, -RETAIL $ 83.00

SAPPHIRE ATI RADEON 9800PRO Video Card, 128MB DDR -RETAIL $ 218.00

Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition with Service Pack SP1a - OEM $ 89.99

SONY SDM-S73 17" LCD Monitor ?RETAIL (Silver) $ 429.00

Logitech Z640 5.1 Speakers -RETAIL $ 58.00

Subtotal: $ 1996.98
Shipping (Via Fedex Saver): about $ 55.50

Total: $ 2052.48


This system will outperform what Wuzup configured for you...simply because of the processor, however you are taking a hit on the quality of the speakers. So if you are really picky about sound and such, then you will probably want to upgrade those. The monitor is great I have one, its got a 16 ms response time, excellent picture quality, and costs a few bucks less than the Hitachi.

 

[Wuzup101]

LOL shows how long I have been out of the loop.... I was unaware that 64bit processors are down to that price already... definitely go with something like axeman's setup above. You definitely should (IMHO) look at the z5300 system over the z640s though... worth the extra cost if you like sound

 

[Frightcrawler]

Back to the main topic:

I think you should try going by the "under $100" plan.
Under that plan, you won't spend nearly as much as you will if you buy extremely new stuff. Plus, since its all going to get outdated anyway, why spend a lot of money on it?

Good luck.

 

[hsmomtoo]

Thanks to all of you for your input. I really appreciate it. Sorry I posted incorrectly but with all the categories to choose from ~ I was a little miffed where to post.

Overclocking? No, I don't think the system will be (I don't think No. 1 son knows about that aspect yet, and honestly, I don't either but I have heard of it on radio tech talks).

Usage of the new system will be for internet educational purposes, small business stuff like Excel, Word or Wordperfect, music downloads and games, of course. As usual, the younger likes to mimic the older and therefore Starcraft/Warcraft for battlenet play as well as creation of game scenarios is a must. No. 1 son has Macromedia Flash and Dreamweaver on the current system, so I am certain that No. 2 son will follow with his own computer related interests. They both want to take some animation courses in the fall. I just want a well rounded system that will hold up to the more complex up-coming game programs "just around the corner".

 

[hsmomtoo]

Sound is definitely big, for me personally. I will look into the z5300. Thanks for that.

 

[theNEOone]

you're going about this the wrong way. it makes no sense to build a computer nowadays unless you're a hobbyist/enthusiast. get a $400 dell P4 2.6ghz, and upgrade the video card and ram. total cost ~$700. it'll be able to take care of what you want, as well as the relatively low hardware requirements suggested for startcraft & warcraft. you'll aslo be able to handle any newer games as well, perhaps at lower detail and quality. definitely still playable though.


=|

 

[Wuzup101]

My girlfriend has a dell that cost her about $1300ish around xmas time (it was a gift from her mom). Granted it's a decent system... pretty fast... etc... it's really a piece of crapola at heart. IMHO you can't do better than building your own system. Ever wonder why everyone seems to have BSODs on Dell computers (this has recently come to my attention as my g/f complained about it... I asked around the dorms and most of my friends have dells... and they all get them). I've never had a BSOD on any of the systems I've put together. I just can't recomend buying a propritary computer unless it's a laptop of course. Granted BSODs are obviously win problems; however, they shouldn't happen frequently/at all on a well built system.

BTW if sound is really of importance to you... you could also check out the z680s... though at around $280 they might put you over budget... they do sound amazing though!

 

[Corporate Thug]

www.abscomputers.com

 

[mrbdm99]

i tend to agree with theNEOone... you will probably get a better preforming, more upgradable, more stable computer if you build one yourself, but for everything you are wanting it to do, that is really overkill. i'm personally running a 4.5 year old gateway with an athlon 800mhz that is slow by todays standards, but if you don't mind waiting (it only took 6 hours to render a 30 minute dvd i created the other day) for certain things, it works quite well. i have upgraded the video card to an ati aiw card and use it as my tivo(ish) system too. check out www.ibuypower.com, www.abscomputers.com, or of course there is dell and even hp/compaq (they have, unlike dell, a pretty decent drop in prices for students, as i assume your sons are). with an upgraded video card and possibly an upgraded sound card since you said it was that important, you will have a machine that will do everything you want and then some. as for the bsod, if you format your hard drive first thing (well, if you get a dell or something anything) and start with a fresh install of xp pro and only the programs you want, not all the crap they stick on there, you can run very smoothly. i haven't had a bsod in about 4 or 5 months.

 

[hsmomtoo]

Well, we've only had three systems in almost 20 years (yeah, we use them until they die!)and have never bought off-the-shelf.
I don't profess to know all about computers, or even half of what you all probably do but always tried to build our own. I do believe that pre-packaged systems involve always trading off something you didn't want in the midst of other things you did.

We've been experiencing bsod more frequently lately and in this day and age one computer per family just doesn't cut it - someone is always jockeying for position, one is always locking another's programs up, someone always wants to check e-mails during anothers time. As homeschoolers in B.C., we are around each other 24/7 so competition can be stiff!

We have a Plexwriter 48/24/48A, and a 52x CD-ROM in this current system. I like the Plexwriter but understand they more than what many people want to spend now.

~ We have a DVD RW system for our TV, but I don't see my husband being much into downloading video; he's not very computer savvy and calls me in to fix his errors.

Axeman suggested in a post above that the new system have a DVD-RW/+RW Drive and DVD-ROM Drive. In this sense, would I be unnecessarily duplicating for the new system, or should I be looking at it from the viewpoint that they play CD's anyway and will eventually replace lone CD writer and rom drives?

Sound is big where I'm concerned, but I have found lately that everyone is using headphones instead (No. 1 son doesn't offend anyone with his choice in music, and the house doesn't have rooms vying for soundproofing!) Any suggestions on this option?
(Personally, I like my car ~ download music, roll up the windows, turn up the volume and drive away [time to myself]; nothing offensive just 70's/80's rock, and loud). Oops, dated myself there


Off topic; I heard that Dell tech support is in India according to a friend who bought one.

 

[hsmomtoo]

Axeman Quote:

Subtotal: $ 1996.98
Shipping (Via Fedex Saver): about $ 55.50

Total: $ 2052.48


I assume that is US? Sorry if I confused anyone ~ I meant Cdn in my original posting.

What is legislation on buying in States and bringing back to Canada?

 

[thuned]

Get a dell for ~1000, or build your own for ~1000. And then get another one for 1000 in 2.5 years. Then that brand new 6-8ghz machine can replace the p3-450 which is struggling to run windows 2006. Plus that $200 21" lcd will be nice.
IMO this is the better route since I can't bare to live with technologies that are "ancient". Plus the performance difference between a 1000$ and a 2000$ system is probably no more than 20-30% (P4 3ghz HT radeon 9600 vs Athlon 64 3200+ radeon 9800). <-- don't flame me on this, I'm just estimating.

edit: fixed some spelling

 

[axemanxt40]

Ya that is US...also those prices have shot up a bit since I quoted that for you. Not sure about legislation about buying parts in the US and taking them back though.

 

[hojl]

I agree with those who are recommending the purchase of a $1000 system. I myself have about 5 computers all very slow by today's standard, but even my PIII 733 dullie with a radeon 9700pro runs these current games pretty well. Kinda what thuned stated. Why not buy 2 $1,000 system.