WRT54GL viability today

[Bob.]

I don't use wireless much and only have a few cell phones and a laptop that's 3 or 4 years old (doesn't get used much).

I have a 50mbps connection and get about 20mbps give or take on the wireless (laptop and phones).

Questions:

1. Am I limited by the wrt54GL? How much could I expect to get with a newer router?

2. What router would be recommended to accommodate the high speed and new (n?) devices?

Any new routers would need to be as reliable and support dd-wrt or similar 3rd party firmware that supports dd-wrt - type features.

All said, those 54GL routers are very reliable and just work!

Thanks!

Not important now, but could be in the future...

 

[Elixer]

The wrt54G isn't going to break any speed records, and you are most likely limited to ~20Mbps max wired as well.
It just is a very old, slow router, that was good for its time, but, now.. it isn't that good.

The Asus n66u is pretty nice.

 

[Excelsior]

I had a reliable and faithful WRT54GL with Tomato that I replaced with an Asus N66U running the Merlin firmware. I've not regretted the decision for one second. The 54GL was good for its time, but with new devices running N/AC, faster internet connections..it just makes since.

I love it.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

its pretty crazy how popular it still is to this day (can still find it sold for more than newer/better routers), a continued success existing purely off of a legendary reputation rather than what it is actually capable of by modern standards

 

[Bob.]

The wrt54G isn't going to break any speed records, and you are most likely limited to ~20Mbps max wired as well.
It just is a very old, slow router, that was good for its time, but, now.. it isn't that good.

Actually, my wired speeds don't seem limited at all. I generally get between 43 & 50mbps. What could a modern router do for my wireless speeds?

I had a reliable and faithful WRT54GL with Tomato that I replaced with an Asus N66U running the Merlin firmware. I've not regretted the decision for one second. The 54GL was good for its time, but with new devices running N/AC, faster internet connections..it just makes since.

One important feature for me is the ability to create vlans. Can the factory or good 3rd party fw accommodate vlans?

its pretty crazy how popular it still is to this day (can still find it sold for more than newer/better routers), a continued success existing purely off of a legendary reputation rather than what it is actually capable of by modern standards

I buy them on Amazon for 49.00 delivered. Plus, they're very reliable (not saying the Asus isn't...just don't know). I very rarely have to reboot them, and even then, it's due to a power flicker or a change I've made.

Thanks for all comments. But I'm still not sure how I would benefit by say, the Asus. I suppose when I get newer devices, better wireless performance? What should I expect for decent wireless speeds? I'm not sure I'd benefit with my wired connections, given that they seem to hold their own. Again, the vlans are the deal breaker.

 

[Elixer]

Actually, my wired speeds don't seem limited at all. I generally get between 43 & 50mbps. What could a modern router do for my wireless speeds?

That is using the BCM5352 CPU @ 200 MHz, which isn't that fast. My WRT54G topped out at 23Mbps.
Anyway, using N ? Not that much, if at all.
If you want faster wireless speeds, then the devices to to support a better protocol, which the Asus supports, but, as usual, around the corner are faster wireless protocols.

That means, you have to look what your devices support, if it is just N, and only a couple devices at the same time, then... you can wait a bit longer to upgrade to a gigabit device.

Most all the 3rd party firmwares support vlans IIRC.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

just have to keep in mind that this is a piece of hardware with origins that date back to 2002 (L model came out in 2005, but the hardware didn't exactly improve)

it might be reliable, but its still extremely slow by modern standards, modern wireless and wired speeds are at least 10x faster, and modern routers with more RAM and CPU power can handle more connections for superior P2P performance and more simultaneous wireless connections at higher speeds. Additional features like USB support are nice as well.

My current router is the ASUS N66U, and before that it was a Netgear WNDR3700v2, both are capable of DD-WRT (which is great on the 3700), although I use Tomato v1.28 by shibby on the N66U. Both routers have at least one USB port which is useful for printer sharing to any device on the network, while the N66U has a 2nd USB port and an internal microSD port that I end up using for storage, useful for Tomato's FTP, file sharing, media server, or even the included bittorent client.

the WRT54GL is old enough to the point where I really wouldn't want to bother with one even to use strictly as an additional access point unless I absolutely needed it and didn't have another choice, but then I'm also lucky enough where my internet would be bottle-necked by what that router is capable of, and if that's strictly what you use the router for, its still a somewhat capable router (although I'd still be leery of the P2P performance)

 

[ch33zw1z]

Still got one for a quick DDWRT client bridge, other than that....I wouldn't keep it around.

 

[Mushkins]

Thanks for all comments. But I'm still not sure how I would benefit by say, the Asus. I suppose when I get newer devices, better wireless performance? What should I expect for decent wireless speeds? I'm not sure I'd benefit with my wired connections, given that they seem to hold their own. Again, the vlans are the deal breaker.

Forget bandwidth measurements for a minute and think about what a router is actually for: routing.

The WRT54GL is for all intents and purposes, legacy hardware. It has an extremely slow processor, and in today's fully connected world it's very easy to overwhelm the device. Even if you have the bandwidth available from your ISP, how your using it determines whether or not the router is adequate. Do you have a few phones/tablets and an old laptop on your network and you're just browsing the web and reading gmail, or are you a power downloader and big time media streamer? Wired or wireless, the device can only process so many concurrent connections so fast, and if you're doing a lot of things at once with your network, it's gonna choke.

A better router isn't necessarily about tapping into untapped bandwidth, it's about routing more efficiently/faster. Grandma Jane isn't going to see a difference between the two devices when she checks her AOL mail, but someone running a Plex server, torrenting 24/7, and all sorts of other things is going to notice a difference between that 54G and a modern router.

 

[Bob.]

I posted this firmly entrenched in my beloved 54GL. Y'all have definitely given me something to think about. I have 2 of these set up in my office and am about to put a 3rd one that I just bought in. I may have to return that one [no worries, I have a few more laying around ].

I guess I'm going to have to give the Asus a try. It's unfortunate that it costs 2.5 times more than the 54GL.

I think I can still make use of the 54GL's in adding an additional layer of security for my 'specialty vlans', including the network I use to clean up "foreign", usually virus ridden, machines.

@Mushkins: Your point is well taken. I use a Netgear gigabit switch for my LAN routing, but we do game and stream movies (both are wired connections). I haven't done both at the same time to really make a determination on its impact, but it's worth trying the Asus for that alone.

Thanks to all.

 

[azazel1024]

Its always unfortunate when something costs more than something else. You are paying for a newer, much more capable router though.

Or you could look at something a little cheaper. A new TP-Link WDR3600 is only around $55.

I just got a second one (open boxed for $36) to replace my Netgear 3500L I was using as a router. I replaced my other 3500L that I was using as an AP a few weeks back with a used WDR3600.

Wireless side of things, the WDR3600 is only slightly faster on 5GHz than 2.4GHz performance is and 2.4GHz performance is about the same as the 3500L, though somewhat better range/performance at range than my 3500L's managed. Routing is a fair amount better though. Speed is the same 83/38 over WAN, but my latency dropped by 40% or so and on the wire, page loads are noticably faster. Wirelessly not a whole lot of difference on page loads.

Would you still use a ~10 year old desktop? If not, maybe you shouldn't use a ~10 year old router design?

Just saying.

 

[Bob.]

Its always unfortunate when...

Hi azazel. Thanks for your comments. I will look into the Asus or similar at some point. Of course, budget is always an issue, but that doesn't preclude paying more for quality. I'm not in any serious hurry, as internet sppeds aren't that big an issue as things stand now. 45mbps (give or take) wired and 20 or so wireless isn't too shabby. Of course, as mushkins mentions, routing traffic could be an issue. But for the most part, there aren't any major issues with that simply because I'm the bandwidth jockey around here, so the high bandwidth usage (WAN & LAN) usually only has one place to go at any given time. And my switches provide gigabit speeds on my LAN.

It is time to look at new tech, though. This thread has just pushed that to an earlier time slot than I might have previously considered.

That said, I do love my 54GL's.

 

[s44]

I don't think anyone in the last five years should have bought a WRT54G(L). The 3500L and Asus N12 have been cheap for a long time, not to mention other devices that become just as stable on flash to Tomato/DD-WRT.

We're closer than people think to being at the point where no one should buy non-AC/ARM home routers either. Maybe a year or two tops.

 

[serpretetsky]

I'll be "that" guy.

Are there any glaring issues in your current network (does the network seem to stop functioning or stutter at all)? Is the wireless/wired speed actually lessening your experience on the internet or on your network (Are videos sometimes choppy, do files download unreasonably slow, do others in your family complain that the internet is slow)

If you answered no to both of those questions, then I think you know what my recommendation is.

edit:

1. Am I limited by the wrt54GL? How much could I expect to get with a newer router?

With respect to your wireless, yes. With a new router you can saturate your internet bandwidth by using wireless assuming you have wireless n/AC devices.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

I don't think anyone in the last five years should have bought a WRT54G(L). The 3500L and Asus N12 have been cheap for a long time, not to mention other devices that become just as stable on flash to Tomato/DD-WRT.

We're closer than people think to being at the point where no one should buy non-AC/ARM home routers either. Maybe a year or two tops.

yeah, we're going to need it to push our gigabit interwebs when that damn finally breaks on the cable companies (at least I still hope )

 

[Bob.]

I'll be "that" guy.

Are there any glaring issues in your current network (does the network seem to stop functioning or stutter at all)? Is the wireless/wired speed actually lessening your experience on the internet or on your network (Are videos sometimes choppy, do files download unreasonably slow, do others in your family complain that the internet is slow)

If you answered no to both of those questions, then I think you know what my recommendation is.

edit:

With respect to your wireless, yes. With a new router you can saturate your internet bandwidth by using wireless assuming you have wireless n/AC devices.

Thanks for the additional info, serpretetsky. This is why I'm in no hurry. The answer to both questions is 'no'. Most of my nw is wired and, being a security nut, that's how it'll stay for the foreseeable future. I do have a few devices, including some smart phones, but 20mbps<> is fine by me for now.

But, having read all of the good info in this thread, I doubt I'll buy any more WRT54G's (besides, I have one I'm not using and one still new in the box ).

The truth is that at some point in the near future, I may replace my "front" router and see how it goes.

 

[John Connor]

I have the WRT54GL and have had it for at leaset 8 years with DD-WRT flashed to it. Has been a solid performer. If you have a NAS then a new router is what you need. IPv6 is something else to consider.

Here's a good router that can be flashed to DD-WRT. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833320091

Make sure you know what you are doing though. http://www.dd-wrt.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=171783&highlight=

 

[Bob.]

I have the WRT54GL and have had it for at leaset 8 years with DD-WRT flashed to it. Has been a solid performer. If you have a NAS then a new router is what you need. IPv6 is something else to consider.

Here's a good router that can be flashed to DD-WRT. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833320091

Make sure you know what you are doing though. http://www.dd-wrt.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=171783&highlight=

Thanks, John. Very helpful .

 

[azazel1024]

Hi azazel. Thanks for your comments. I will look into the Asus or similar at some point. Of course, budget is always an issue, but that doesn't preclude paying more for quality. I'm not in any serious hurry, as internet sppeds aren't that big an issue as things stand now. 45mbps (give or take) wired and 20 or so wireless isn't too shabby. Of course, as mushkins mentions, routing traffic could be an issue. But for the most part, there aren't any major issues with that simply because I'm the bandwidth jockey around here, so the high bandwidth usage (WAN & LAN) usually only has one place to go at any given time. And my switches provide gigabit speeds on my LAN.

It is time to look at new tech, though. This thread has just pushed that to an earlier time slot than I might have previously considered.

That said, I do love my 54GL's.

Hey, if it works for you, great. That said, I get wireless speeds of 200Mbps...so 20Mbps would frankly make me cry. Its worse if I am actually using both bands as I can load it up with about 350Mbps or so of traffic if hitting the 5GHz and 2.4GHz bands at once with my laptop, phone and tablet.

Of course its all in what is your budget and what your needs/desires are. I desire a lot more than I get, but I don't need anything better than what I had before my latest upgrade. Old network was working fine...but I figured for $70 total, why not replace my router and AP to get slightly better normal wireless performance, significantly better edge case wireless performance (IE when I have devices on both bands instead of having been stuck with just 2.4GHz) and a lot better routing performance (though speed hasn't changed, but latency has).

Ideally I would have loved to have gotten a couple of TP-Link Archer C7 routers...but my budget didn't stretch to ~$180 and I only have 1 11ac device that could have taken advantage of it anyway (my laptop) with all of my devices being 1:1 or 2:2 11n otherwise, a nice 2:2 2.4/5Ghz router with replacable antennas was pretty much as good as I desired and can really take advantage of.

That and I am half holding out for either 2:2 11ac routers with removable antennas at a decent price (sub $80) or decent 3:3 or better MU:MIMO 11ac routers at $120 or less. So I am probably going to be waiting awhile longer.

 

[VirtualLarry]

As long as you don't need 5Ghz, those $20 WNR2000 (preferably v2 revision, as those are Broadcom, and can take DD-WRT) routers will push 85Mbits WAN to LAN.

 

[Bob.]

Here's a good router that can be flashed to DD-WRT. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16833320091

Is this a special version of this router? The one at amazon (same price) doesn't state that it's open source. Also, I set up the ddwrt fw for my 54GL and have each LAN port assigned to a vlan (of whcih I'm using 3). Is there any reason I couldn't do the same with the N66u?

@VirtualLarry: Thanks .
----------------------------

I've actually ordered the RT-N66U for one of my neighbors, so I will get to check it out.

But one more question, if y'all aren't tired of this thread :

When I was checking the RT-N66U out at amazon, a pop up suggested that there was a newer version (RT-AC66U). It's about $40 more and supports 802.11AC. Of course, I don't have any of those devices, but is there any advantage to that router other than faster speeds (theoretical) for 802.11ac devices?

 

[Elixer]

When I was checking the RT-N66U out at amazon, a pop up suggested that there was a newer version (RT-AC66U). It's about $40 more and supports 802.11AC. Of course, I don't have any of those devices, but is there any advantage to that router other than faster speeds (theoretical) for 802.11ac devices?

The only advantage is, if you have those devices that use AC.
Otherwise, it is pretty much the same.

 

[John Connor]

Make sure you read that DD-WRT thread very carefully and you flash right. From what I was reading it is very easy to brick that router. Make sure you do the 30-30-30 rule and you wait for at least 5 minutes after you flash to access the web based interface.

http://compnetworking.about.com/b/2009/03/11/the-30-30-30-hard-reset-rule-for-routers.htm

 

[Bob.]

@Elixer: Thanks!. Another thought...my neighbor has a 54GL. In replacing it with the Asus, can he expect better range (in 2.4ghz)?

@John Conner:

Thanks. I won't be flashing ddwrt for my neighbor's router (although I . It will give me a chance to check out the factory fw on that router. But when the time comes for me (which may be sooner rather than later...), is there a better 3rd party fw to flash to the N66U (that allows unbridged vlans?)? And thanks for the link to the ddwrt/N66U thread.

 

[s44]

The N66 is almost the reference platform for Tomato, which Asus has actually adopted as the base for their own stock firmware. Also there's Merlin's fw, which is modified/enhanced Asus stock.