Would you be willing to make the ultimate sacrifice for your religion/belief?

[Elledan]

<< Since you seem convinced that Genesis is pure myth with no genuine relevence, I would be curious to see how you explain it's core insights. >>


Insights? Sorry, but every time I read Genesis, I get already pretty annoyed due to the lack of those insights

I'm used to read everything with a very critical look (especially scientific articles) and compare everything which I read with the knowledge I possess at that moment. The bible constantly fails those comparisons.

The only spiritual texts which I've found so far that are reliable are those written down by followers of Buddha ( Link...). Of course I disagree with certain parts of the teachings in those texts, but that's the result of a critical look

Most religions, IMHO, lack spiritualism. Those include the Islam and Christianity. They're just too 'flat'. They lack content.

 

[wilki24]

Elledan,

It's very easy to simply dismiss religion as a 'collection of myths' without explaining WHY you think those 'myths' have no merit. Again, you simply brush aside everything that Athanasius has said. Please answer directly the claims that he's made as I'd be very interested in reading your true, and logically thought out, reasons why you dispute them.

I find it amazing that those who exhibit the most 'open-mindedness' in this discussion are people like believers like Athanasius, and not those who claim to be free of a 'collection of myths'. I have to admit that I would have said, before this thread started, that the majority of those who defend 'religion' would be more close-minded, but I'm pleasantly suprised that does not seem to be the case. In fact, it's obvious that the opposite is true. Do all aethists use emotional arguements, without any apparent critical thinking nonetheless, to support their beliefs?

If a believer of God, or creationism, can openly address the mound of scientific evidence and point out connections between religious texts and science, why can those who do not believe in God do the same to show that the connections do not exist?

 

[Netopia]

Elledan, you are now doing to Athanasius as PCResources was previously doing to me. Why not answer his questions directly? The logic of believing for me is verifiable via the many, MANY fulfilled prophesies of the Old Testement. Secular Historians will varify the antiquity of many of the writings, so we can feel assured that the texts were NOT written after the events occurred, which leaves the question &quot;how is that possible?&quot; The equation gets tilted farther when you realize that dozens and dozens of said prophesies have come to pass and you start to fathom that statistically speaking, the odds of this happening by random chance are so infinitly small that the situation is for all intents and purposes, impossible. And yet.... they occurred! If you simply turn your head and say things like:

&quot;Sorry, but every time I read Genesis, I get already pretty annoyed due to the lack of those insights.&quot;

and continue without investigating, then one has to question the voracity of your speach when you say &quot;The only spiritual texts which I've found so far that are reliable are those written down by followers of Buddha.&quot;. Historians admit that the Bible is probably THE most reliable piece of writing from antiquity... and we've pointed out to you some of the reasons that it deserves a VERY deep examination.

Why are you side stepping?

Joe

 

[wilki24]

Well, Joe, I'll answer that one based on his past responses.

He's sidestepping because he DOES NOT really have any logical reasoning in his emotional-filled opinions. He admitedly gets 'annoyed' if he reads Genesis. I find that amusing. I doubt that if you, or I, or Athanasius would be annoyed if we went to the web site that he graciously provided for us to correct our thinking so that it matches his. In fact, I found the site very interesting, and worthy of futher study.

Furthermore, I certainly do not get 'annoyed' when I study something that doesn't agree 100% with my beliefs, but apparently for the intellectually and emotionally challenged, they have a negative emotional response when they do the same.

That is unfortunate, because it clearly shows the hypocrisy in what some are saying here. We are labeled as blind 'myth-believers', yet for some odd reason, WE are the ones open to expanding past our pre-conceived ideas, while they, self-admitedly, are not.

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is what is wrong with much of modern acadamia. They like to present a front of open-mindedness, and but in reality, they are some of the most arrogantly rigid and narrow-minded people around.

Ironic, eh?

 

[PCResources]

<< You seem to like to take the most literal, and simplistic, approach to interpeting the Bible. >>

 

[PCResources]

<< You seem to like to take the most literal, and simplistic, approach to interpeting the Bible. >>



Sure, you think that i am the only one, i have actually seen lots of people in this very thread defending these actions...

My question was quite simple, if you answer it correctly you will be awarded one point... LOL




<< It seems to me that you are the king of making statements, yet when challenged to back those statements up, you simply ignore the question or try and change your original statement to fit whatever it is that you are trying to say. >>



Oh, so i am the &quot;king&quot; of statements and you are not? how many statements about what i said did you make in your post, and how many of them were interpreted just the way you wanted them?





<< I think that ignorance breeds radicalism, whatever form it may come in. For you to finger Christians as hypocritical killers based on the actions of the very few who are ignorant, in turn shows your own ignorance, and rather clearly I might add. >>



THis is the worst response i have seen yet, you try to label me but you are so very wrong, i just asked a question, all you have to do is answer it, if you say yes, then by your own label you are ignorant (this goes for Netopia and Chrishuff also, he labels you ignorant and you cheer him on.. ) if you say that the everything the bible says is not true or that some parts of the bible are just stories, then i label you sane...




<< Actually, what I've noticed in this thread, and in the public in general, is a kindergarten-like simplistic attitude towards religion, and religious texts. So many people hear a catch-phrase here, or read a snippit there, and suddenly they believe they know what a certain religion is all about. I beg to disagree. >>



Get real, most people deal with their religion in the most ignorant and kindergarten-like way, they just believe, they believe in the bible, they believe in god, they believe in jesus christ, how simplistic is that?



<< You are certainly right that I'm not like that . But still, bombing a clinic is not a Christian act, >>



Optimus, i do agree, but there is a large part of the christian community (whether you like it or not) who are willing to do anything to make people see the &quot;light&quot;, i am not judging you or anyone else in this thread by these measures (except maybe for Netopia) but you have to understand that this was made by people in the name of god, your christian god...



<< I think we can all safely say that PCResources hasn't digested a single morsel fed to him. Let him scream and holler... nothing can be said or done now - only the Holy Spirit can impress anything on him now. >>



Yup, i did not ask for your response, yet you had to enforce it, you are sooo very great and god-like aren't you, no need for any discussions, just try to belittle and insult me, well, you know what, i really don't care, i think you guys are hilarious... LOL

Patrick