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Woman thrown out of ladies' bathroom for not looking feminine enough

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yowolabi

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2001
4,183
2
81
Originally posted by: moshquerade
alright, in a way i feel bad from her. she's a butch lesbian. we all get the idea that lesbians are so beautiful and feminine looking, but in reality a lot of them look like guys. so then i see why she'd be mistaken for a man.

hopefully she doesn't win her lawsuit. she should just accept an apology and move on. it was an honest mistake.
It ceased to be an honest mistake after the bouncer refused to look at her id, and then threw her and her party out of the restaurant.

Originally posted by: Nikamichi

The bouncer obviously believed it was a man. Why would showing ID make a difference, especially if there was a chance it was fake?
Bullshit. This is a restaurant/bar where they serve alcohol and card people all of the time. The bouncer himself probably cards people on a regular basis. That argument is a non-starter.

 

Gooberlx2

Lifer
May 4, 2001
15,381
5
91
Originally posted by: Xavier434
Originally posted by: Throckmorton

Suing for activist reasons is how a lot of laws get changed...
Only if they gain popularity in the media spotlight for long enough and it usually requires many instances. It does happen though. Still, in this case, there is no law to change here. The bouncer made a mistake and he deserves to pay the consequences. That's all. Suing the business makes no sense unless the owner happens to support what the bouncer did after he found out the truth. The only thing that should come out of this is that the bouncer gets fired. She doesn't deserve any compensation. If she feels "damaged" because she was mistaken for a man then she shouldn't being actively trying to look like a man. Pretty simple if you ask me.
There is law to change here, the article mentioned it. NYC already has anti-discriminatory laws based on gender stereotypes, but the state does not. They're filing on both levels.
 

torpid

Lifer
Sep 14, 2003
11,631
11
76
So, in order to stop a person believed to be a man from entering the restroom, they send another man in, and that man tells the other potential man that men aren't allowed in the women's room?
 

AbAbber2k

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
6,487
1
0
"Excuse me, sir?"
"MA'AM!!!"
"Whoa... Ok bye, Human. Bye, Person! Nice to meet you, Individual."
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,182
635
126
Originally posted by: NFS4
The fact that someone's appearance is so beyond the norm that a person PROVE that they are female is pretty f*&ked up to begin with. Damn the legalities involved. You put yourself in that situation... YOU made it an issue.
No way, not everyone should be forced to fit into the neat little mold you've deemed to be acceptable. Maybe she feels more comfortable in pants and button down shirt with short hair and no makeup so who are you to tell her that she should be wearing makeup and a skirt? It's not as though she was dressed as a lumberjack for christ sake...:roll:
 

Casawi

Platinum Member
Oct 31, 2004
2,366
1
0
was she on opera ? she was born with a small penis, and a vagina. they shut the vagina hole and left with a small penis. Now she realizes that she is a woman??
 

Mr Incognito

Golden Member
Feb 20, 2007
1,035
0
0
The man should have checked her ID and let her finish up her business. The guy obviously couldn't be wrong, so there was no need to check ID. The guy is a jackass, and he should be fired for such pride and ignorance.

EDIT: She has madea lawsuit of this. I think it's stupid but that bouncer must feel like a jackass because she tried to provide evidence of her innocence.
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
72,640
8
81
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
The fact that someone's appearance is so beyond the norm that a person PROVE that they are female is pretty f*&ked up to begin with. Damn the legalities involved. You put yourself in that situation... YOU made it an issue.
No way, not everyone should be forced to fit into the neat little mold you've deemed to be acceptable. Maybe she feels more comfortable in pants and button down shirt with short hair and no makeup so who are you to tell her that she should be wearing makeup and a skirt? It's not as though she was dressed as a lumberjack for christ sake...:roll:
I'm not saying that she should be forced to do a damn thing. It's her choice. But she had better be able to accept the consequences of those choices.

If she wants to look, dress and sound like man... that's her choice. But don't pitch a fit when you get treated like one and then say "Oh wait....um, yeah. I have a vagina."

I saw this "woman" on the Today Show this morning (the reason why I posted this thread). If the host hadn't said that she was a female, I would have assumed that she was a man (as would have 99.99% of the people who saw her). She even sounded like a man.
 

Nocturnal

Lifer
Jan 8, 2002
18,927
0
76
Originally posted by: moshquerade
alright, in a way i feel bad from her. she's a butch lesbian. we all get the idea that lesbians are so beautiful and feminine looking, but in reality a lot of them look like guys. so then i see why she'd be mistaken for a man.

hopefully she doesn't win her lawsuit. she should just accept an apology and move on. it was an honest mistake.
This is the truth. There is a huge misconception that all lesbians or most lesbian couples include beautiful blond bombshells with breast implants. That's so far from the truth it isn't even funny.

I've noticed that every single lesbian couple I've seen or observed, had one butch looking lesbian who resembled a guy and one who looked like a normal woman. I have never seen anything like what porn shows us, ever.
 

BigJ

Lifer
Nov 18, 2001
21,335
1
76
The bouncer should've check the ID, if only to cover his ass. This way, he could've said that he believed it was a very good fake ID and then said he had no way of knowing that she was truly a female.

The woman looks like a man.
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
1
81
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
The fact that someone's appearance is so beyond the norm that a person PROVE that they are female is pretty f*&ked up to begin with. Damn the legalities involved. You put yourself in that situation... YOU made it an issue.
No way, not everyone should be forced to fit into the neat little mold you've deemed to be acceptable. Maybe she feels more comfortable in pants and button down shirt with short hair and no makeup so who are you to tell her that she should be wearing makeup and a skirt? It's not as though she was dressed as a lumberjack for christ sake...:roll:
I'm not saying that she should be forced to do a damn thing. It's her choice. But she had better be able to accept the consequences of those choices.

If she wants to look, dress and sound like man... that's her choice. But don't pitch a fit when you get treated like one and then say "Oh wait....um, yeah. I have a vagina."

I saw this "woman" on the Today Show this morning (the reason why I posted this thread). If the host hadn't said that she was a female, I would have assumed that she was a man (as would have 99.99% of the people who saw her). She even sounded like a man.

I don't know about that. I watched a clip on the net of the same show. Clearly she looked butch, but she still favored somehwat of a woman. I'll put this way after seeing the video, he should have checked her id.
 

tfinch2

Lifer
Feb 3, 2004
22,114
1
0
Originally posted by: NFS4
The bouncer obviously believed it was a man. Why would showing ID make a difference, especially if there was a chance it was fake?
Did the bouncer throw "her" out because she was a lesbian, or was it because she looked like a man? ID doesn't mean shit.
I'd agree here
:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll:

So what's the point of IDs if they have a possibility of being fake? Do you question everything you see as SHENS?
 

Squisher

Lifer
Aug 17, 2000
21,207
65
91
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".

 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,219
5
81
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
she should have just committed hair kari for not being attractive enough or looking like they expected her to.
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
72,640
8
81
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,219
5
81
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
24,442
4
0
Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Why does a legal ID mean shit? She offered it and he refused to review it. The bouncer fooked up and hopefully gets fired.
Right, because your average bouncer has magical legal-ID-detecto-vision.

Weren't you ever under 21?

Throwing them out of the restaurant was crossing the line, though. No reason for that.

The city law, whose gender protections are generally considered more expansive, is intended to protect residents whose gender expression is different from what is traditionally associated with the legal sex assigned to a person at birth.
Interesting case, though. It sets the precedent for actual men to sneak into women's restrooms, and then claim to be women when caught. Maybe even sue for "gender stereotyping"...even if you actually ARE a man, that doesn't give them the right to assume so based on what their senses are telling them! I'm surprised it's still legal to say "sir" or "ma'am" in the grocery store...
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
72,640
8
81
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
I'm very sorry that you can't point out male speech patterns/body language from a female's. That coupled with the the appearance and clothing probably "alarmed" the women that saw "her" in the bathroom.

It's the same way that everyone says that they can spot a gay guy by how he carries himself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypatHWIqVgs

You would have thought that was a woman if you only had audio. And what guy moves around like that and has those mannerisms?
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
LOL great points I am wondering myself.


Originally posted by: shadow9d9

If someone complains that you aren't in the right place, sure they can.

The camera comparison is so off the mark, it wouldn't be worth it to comment on.

If people fear for their safety, it is the reasonable thing to do, and IDs could be faked.

Stop blowing things out of proportion. This isn't a big deal. She chooses to look like a man, so she must learn to deal with confusion.
So if someone hears me in my apt in the shower, they can call the cops and say that I broke in and I am taking a shower in someone else's apt and the cops just bust in without any evidence?

Camera comparision sure as hell is on the mark, you want someone pounding on the stall door when you are in there? Probably peeking through the cracks trying to see what you are doing and what you look like, forcing you to leave a location you have every right to be in? It's about privacy, same reason cameras aren't allowed in a bathroom no one should be able to just bust in without a REALLY, REALLY good reason (there wasn't one here, the bouncer very easily could have waited outside like the story above).

It is a big deal, the bouncer made numerous mistakes, it could have been handled SO much easier, again exaclty like the example above in M1ldslide1's post.

Also, she chooses to look like a man? Really? In the womb she said God please make my face look manly and give me no breasts so that I may be a butch lesbian?
 

Turin39789

Lifer
Nov 21, 2000
12,219
5
81
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
I'm very sorry that you can't point out male speech patterns/body language from a female's. That coupled with the the appearance and clothing probably "alarmed" the women that saw "her" in the bathroom.

It's the same way that everyone says that they can spot a gay guy by how he carries himself.
Way to not answer the question


And the problem is you can't spot every gay guy, only the stereotypical ones. And some that you spot aren't.


And what did you mean by wanting it both ways? Did she wanted to be treated as equal to a man?
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,547
651
126
Originally posted by: jagec
Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Why does a legal ID mean shit? She offered it and he refused to review it. The bouncer fooked up and hopefully gets fired.
Right, because your average bouncer has magical legal-ID-detecto-vision.

Weren't you ever under 21?

Throwing them out of the restaurant was crossing the line, though. No reason for that.
Why would she be carrying a fake id to use a bathroom? So, bouncer's aren't supposed to check ID and just use their high-IQs to determine age, gender, etc. I'm sure that holds up on many legal grounds.
 

Squisher

Lifer
Aug 17, 2000
21,207
65
91
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
I'm very sorry that you can't point out male speech patterns/body language from a female's. That coupled with the the appearance and clothing probably "alarmed" the women that saw "her" in the bathroom.

It's the same way that everyone says that they can spot a gay guy by how he carries himself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypatHWIqVgs

You would have thought that was a woman if you only had audio. And what guy moves around like that and has those mannerisms?
So, effeminate men should use the women's room and butch women should use the men's room?
Maybe in your world, but in the states it doesn't work that way and I believe the police would be called.

I'd like the see your face when you're using the urinal and a masculine looking female backs up to one next to you, drops her drawers, bends over, and lets it fly.
 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
24,442
4
0
Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
Why would she be carrying a fake id to use a bathroom? So, bouncer's aren't supposed to check ID and just use their high-IQs to determine age, gender, etc. I'm sure that holds up on many legal grounds.
I don't think she went to the place for the sole purpose of using the bathroom.:confused:

If they had a bouncer, they had a bar, and if they had a bar, the chances of their customers carrying fake ID goes way up.

I think he should have checked for ID, but I'm just saying ID isn't irrefutable proof. It's conceivable that now that this story was released, some feminine male pervert might get the idea of using a fake ID to be a "woman" in the woman's restroom.
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
72,640
8
81
Originally posted by: Squisher
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Turin39789
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: Squisher
So, to all of you that think throwing her out is acceptable, into what bathroom should she have gone?

I don't ever remember seeing a sign for the "butch looking woman's bathroom".
She could have passed as a man. If she wants to act like one, she should have gone into the men's room. She wouldn't have even caused a scene :p

I don't see why people want it both ways? You want to act like a man, yet have the same privileges as a woman :confused:
She acts like a man?

How exactly does a man act?
Was she rebuilding an engine? Looting and pillaging? Was she sticking her penis in things(thats the only thing I know that 90+% of men do)?
I'm very sorry that you can't point out male speech patterns/body language from a female's. That coupled with the the appearance and clothing probably "alarmed" the women that saw "her" in the bathroom.

It's the same way that everyone says that they can spot a gay guy by how he carries himself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypatHWIqVgs

You would have thought that was a woman if you only had audio. And what guy moves around like that and has those mannerisms?
So, effeminate men should use the women's room and butch women should use the men's room?
Maybe in your world, but in the states it doesn't work that way and I believe the police would be called.

I'd like the see your face when you're using the urinal and a masculine looking female backs up to one next to you, drops her drawers, bends over, and lets it fly.
If your appearance as the opposite sex is so convincing, why not? If you go through life pretending to be the opposite sex and it's succeeding (dressing like a dude, acting like a dude, sleeping with women), why not go all out?

Ross The Intern couldn't pass as a female on looks alone, but this lady sure could pass for a dude.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.
 

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