With two weeks left let's see where P&N stands

[DisgruntledVirus]

I thought it might be interesting to see what the results are on P&N. I think I know the outcome for president in this poll, but am still curious as to the outcome.

What do you think the "surprise" will be if there is one?

Why do you think this will be the "end of America as we know it" if you think whoever will win is satan/devil/horrible/terrorist/whatever?

How do you think the VP will become president (if you believe they will)?

As of right now (and in 4 years things will obviously be different based on what they do in office), do you think the winner will get re-elected?

Edit: added not voting option for main poll.

Edit 2: based off poll results adding "Is it possible for something to change so McCain/Palin win?" and post what that would have to be to "change" the race significantly enough so McCain/Palin win.

Edit 3: Added "Will McCain/Palin be able to use Obama's 3 day campaign halt to swing the election to them?". Just to clear it up a bit, what I mean is with Obama going to HI until Friday (IIRC), McCain has until then to come up with something that is a "game changer". With Obama in HI and halting his campaign, will McCain get something that hurts Obama to the point he can't recover from? I realize Obama won't be "out of touch" with his staff, and will be able to have them issue statements. That is not the same as Obama himself commenting on it though for most people.

 

[Tab]

Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Interesting results after the first 20 votes. The president poll is close (9-7 Obama), but "who will win" question is a landslide (17-3 Obama).

 

[DarrelSPowers]

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

People in solid red/blue states who think their vote won't matter because of the retarded electoral college.

 

[AstroManLuca]

Originally posted by: DarrelSPowers

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

People in solid red/blue states who think their vote won't matter because of the retarded electoral college.

Still matters. A few years ago, people would have said that about Virginia, Colorado, and North Carolina, among others. Now those states are in play and it's likely that at least one of them will go to Obama.

Voting against the large majority in a state can still have an effect, because if enough people do it, it will make the race closer, causing the candidates to spend more time and money campaigning there next time. That's good if you're a member of the minority party in your state - force the candidate you don't agree with to spend money there.

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

Not voting is a vote for the McSame so I am not surprised you are not voting.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. I'm in MA so my vote won't matter. I can't get myself to vote for either of these losers. I will be voting on state/local issues though.

 

[jjones]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

Not voting is a vote for the McSame so I am not surprised you are not voting.

Nonsense, only a blind partisan or idealist would feel that way. Not voting is a vote for dissatisfaction with the electoral process and/or the candidates. It is a vote against the system. It is a choice that one makes just like anyone casting their vote for a candidate. It is a real shame on the American political system and the people of a great nation that too many people feel it is their duty to hold their noses and vote for the lesser of two evils. The real third party is not the libertarians, it is the dissatisfied who withhold their vote. If things continue on their present course, and I have no reason to doubt that they wouldn't, one election, probably not in my lifetime, this third party will be the agent of change.

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

you think these two candidates are worse than bush/kerry? are you fucking insane? you should never vote again then

 

[glugglug]

On the question "Who do you think will win", do you mean "who will be legitimately elected" or do you mean "who will Diebold and the NWO appoint"?

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: glugglug
On the question "Who do you think will win", do you mean "who will be legitimately elected" or do you mean "who will Diebold and the NWO appoint"?

I mean who do you think will be the next POTUS. Answer it based off how it reads to you. If that means "legitimately elected" okay, if it means "appointed by rigged elections" okay.

There is another question in the poll's that asks if there will be another contested election. Be it from "hanging chads", not winning the popular vote, a "rigged election" by (insert company/org/military/official/etc here), or something else do you believe this election will have some kind of issue where they *shouldn't* have become POTUS.

As a side note (don't want to derail the thread or anything) do you really believe that the elections will be "rigged"?

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: jjones
[ ... ] Not voting is a vote for dissatisfaction with the electoral process and/or the candidates. It is a vote against the system. It is a choice that one makes just like anyone casting their vote for a candidate.

I disagree. Voting for a third-party candidate sends a message of dissatisfaction with the status quo. Not voting sends a message of laziness, or at best disengagement. If one truly can't find a good choice in Obama or McCain, find a third-party candidate you can support, or even write in someone you believe in. That sends a much clearer message than not voting.

It is a real shame on the American political system and the people of a great nation that too many people feel it is their duty to hold their noses and vote for the lesser of two evils. ...

Amen.

 

[Bowfinger]

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
[ ... ]
As a side note (don't want to derail the thread or anything) do you really believe that the elections will be "rigged"?

I don't think there's any questions that elections are "rigged" ... by both sides (and with some of the unbelievably insecure electronic voting systems, potentially even by outsiders). The question is whether there's enough manipulation to affect the outcome.

 

[magomago]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

KERRY was a better option than OBAMA? Are you serious???

I'm not voting for either, but I'll have to say that 2004 really provided the worst choices...

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
[ ... ]
As a side note (don't want to derail the thread or anything) do you really believe that the elections will be "rigged"?

I don't think there's any questions that elections are "rigged" ... by both sides (and with some of the unbelievably insecure electronic voting systems, potentially even by outsiders). The question is whether there's enough manipulation to affect the outcome.

Want to explain what you mean by they are "rigged" by both sides?

I have no doubt that the election is going to have flaws and not be 100% accurate and not affected by external sources (political parties, unions, special interest groups, etc). I also don't believe that this "rigging" of the election is significant enough as to affect the outcome (unless the election is within 1% or less of the total votes cast, which varies based on the stage they are voting on. Federal <.5%, state <.7%, and local <1% roughly).

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: Bowfinger
I disagree. Voting for a third-party candidate sends a message of dissatisfaction with the status quo. Not voting sends a message of laziness, or at best disengagement. If one truly can't find a good choice in Obama or McCain, find a third-party candidate you can support, or even write in someone you believe in. That sends a much clearer message than not voting.

Hey, you can always vote for yourself!

 

[CycloWizard]

Originally posted by: evident
you think these two candidates are worse than bush/kerry? are you fucking insane? you should never vote again then

Bush and Kerry both pretended to care about the issues (even if only in passing), about cutting spending, and a lot of other issues. Neither Obama nor McCain has put together a coherent package on something as fundamental as a tax plan. Sure, they have thousands of talking points for their commercials, but there is no tax bracket table available from either of them. Why? They promise that their tax plan will help x while placing more of the burden on y, so SHOW ME. But they can't. They have no intention of carrying out any of their campaign promises. Obama broke one of his biggest promises - to use only public campaign funds - DURING the campaign. McCain lost his integrity in an effort to appeal to the "conservative" base. I have absolutely no desire to cast my vote for either of them as neither represents even 5% of my views. Nor do any of the third party candidates, who are largely libertarian or ignorant "green" hippies, both of which I find logically incoherent positions. I will not endorse a candidate that I completely and utterly disagree with only virtually every issue.

What scares me is that some people think that they agree with any of these candidates on a significant number of issues, thereby demonstrating that they haven't tried to read the fine print on either candidates' web sites.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Originally posted by: magomago

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. There is no one that I care to vote for. It'll be the first time that I don't vote for a presidential candidate. I thought Bush and Kerry were a pair of piss poor options, but this is ridiculous.

KERRY was a better option than OBAMA? Are you serious???

I'm not voting for either, but I'll have to say that 2004 really provided the worst choices...

Note - if Obama wins, Kerry will be appointed to his administration.

And yes, I voted for Kerry but will not for Obama.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard

Originally posted by: evident
you think these two candidates are worse than bush/kerry? are you fucking insane? you should never vote again then

Bush and Kerry both pretended to care about the issues (even if only in passing), about cutting spending, and a lot of other issues. Neither Obama nor McCain has put together a coherent package on something as fundamental as a tax plan. Sure, they have thousands of talking points for their commercials, but there is no tax bracket table available from either of them. Why? They promise that their tax plan will help x while placing more of the burden on y, so SHOW ME. But they can't. They have no intention of carrying out any of their campaign promises. Obama broke one of his biggest promises - to use only public campaign funds - DURING the campaign. McCain lost his integrity in an effort to appeal to the "conservative" base. I have absolutely no desire to cast my vote for either of them as neither represents even 5% of my views. Nor do any of the third party candidates, who are largely libertarian or ignorant "green" hippies, both of which I find logically incoherent positions. I will not endorse a candidate that I completely and utterly disagree with only virtually every issue.

What scares me is that some people think that they agree with any of these candidates on a significant number of issues, thereby demonstrating that they haven't tried to read the fine print on either candidates' web sites.

I couldn't agree more. This is my biggest issue with this election. Neither has put forward an actual outline of their goals/objectives/etc as POTUS. They say they will do a little of everything and appease 90%+ of the voting public. This is not possible on most issues (taxation, healthcare, and military issues are 3 biggies). I want to know where you stand. I want to be able to hold you accountable for what you said you were going to do when you wanted my vote.

People see Obama as a man to "change", because that is how he sold himself. I am all for change. Please Mr. Obama, show me how you are going to "change" things. They both have given up who they were at the start of this election (before getting their nominations), and become everything for everybody (or tried to).

This is why I am actually considering 3rd party/write in, because frankly none on the ticket are worth my vote IMHO. The flip side of that is I want to make my measly vote count for who I align *most* with (even that is only a small sliver of topics I agree on).

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: AstroManLuca

Originally posted by: DarrelSPowers

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

People in solid red/blue states who think their vote won't matter because of the retarded electoral college.

Still matters. A few years ago, people would have said that about Virginia, Colorado, and North Carolina, among others. Now those states are in play and it's likely that at least one of them will go to Obama.

Voting against the large majority in a state can still have an effect, because if enough people do it, it will make the race closer, causing the candidates to spend more time and money campaigning there next time. That's good if you're a member of the minority party in your state - force the candidate you don't agree with to spend money there.

This makes no sense. Electors *should* be swayed by their districts...but in reality they arent.

 

[glugglug]

Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
As a side note (don't want to derail the thread or anything) do you really believe that the elections will be "rigged"?

Yes, I firmly believe that the past 2 (or more, especially if you include the senate) elections have been rigged, and that if not for the large scale fraud, Kerry would have won by one of the biggest landslides in history. And I believe we will see that fraud again in November.

 

[morkinva]

In real elections, there should be a choice of 'no confidence'

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

Originally posted by: morkinva
In real elections, there should be a choice of 'no confidence'

So who runs the country if "no confidence" is the majority? The current administration? Randomly pick one? Have more debates and a follow-up election? Let them take turns?

 

[alchemize]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Originally posted by: Tab
Who the fuck is not voting? :shocked:

Me. I'm in MA so my vote won't matter. I can't get myself to vote for either of these losers. I will be voting on state/local issues though.

I suggest a Dave McCowen write in.