Solved! Wiped stock thermal paste off of Wraith Prism cpu cooler and 3600x cpu, replaced with kryonaut. Temperatures higher though?

Tmansdc

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Mar 19, 2019
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I have a 3600x with an asus tuf x570 wi fi mobo and a mattrexx 50 case.

Anyways I had a spare never used wraith prism cooler with the stock paste still and used that instead of the wraith spire. Temperatures dropped and it was working pretty good.

However I had to get into my computer and change my nvme drive so I had to remove the heatsink and in doing so I used 99% rubbing alcohol to completely clean the thermal paste off of the prism and cpu.

I ordered two small 1 gram tubes of kryonaut and just put it on tonight. However the temperatures are higher than they were with the stock paste. I used up the whole tube doing the paste three times. I spread it at first, wiped it off then tried the x method, wiped that off then did the line method.

All three times I did this my temps were higher than before. Cinebench r15 would never go above 77 celsius even during five multi core tests in a row. Immediately it jumps to about 83 celsius now. Also my max boost all core clock on everything stock/auto would boost to 4.1 ghz all core prior to this with the fan switch on high now i get 4.03 at best with full speed high setting cpu cooler fan and by the time the benchmark is over I am around 3.97 ghz. I used to get in the 1620's (1629

was the best I ever got) if I had the prism set to high and full speed in bios and even with silent bios and low setting on the prism I'd get between 1595 and 1605 so about 1600 on average. Now I'm getting that with high speed prism and full fan speed and 1550's! when I'm on low prism fan speed and silent fan bios.

What am I doing wrong? Could I have gotten a bit of the old stock thermal compound under the lid in the area where the i/o die and chiplet is on the cpu and could that affect the heat? Did I put the paste on wrong?

I'm so fed up I just ordered a new wraith prism on ebay to see if that will help and if not then I might just order another 3600x or even just plain 3600. This is crap.

Also when I was cleaning the thermal paste off I think I may have had some get inbetween the small gap between the IHS and the top of the cpu. Could some of that thermal paste have gotten onto the IO Die or chiplet and be effecting that? If so is there a way I can remove that without delidding?
 

UsandThem

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Yeah I'm not going to undervolt as that will cut single threaded performance. Any other tips? I'm willing to do modded bios, power plans, chipset drivers, etc. Those are all up to date though.
Until you get a new back plate and properly install a CPU cooler, there's no need for you to ask for help concerning CPU temps.

Sometimes you just have to be blunt, but at this point I just don't really believe anything you say. The posts you've created here and at places like Reddit, Linus, TechPowerUP, and Tom's make no logical sense at all. I feel that you are trolling people and wasting their time with nonsense.

When you first joined here, you posted you were concerned about gaming on your laptop for 2 hours. Next was about a case where you said you couldn't remove the front panel (despite users showing you could), and now you are posting across all the forums asking about CPU temps when you don't even have the CPU heatsink installed?!?! Your temperature concerns have nothing to do with properly using thermal paste. It's because you don't have it installed, and simply just have it sitting on top the CPU, with the only pressure being provided by gravity. o_O

You don't tell anyone that vital information of course, so whatever you motives/angle is, you really need to stop wasting people's time.
 

UsandThem

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However I had to get into my computer and change my nvme drive so I had to remove the heatsink and in doing so I used 99% rubbing alcohol to completely clean the thermal paste off of the prism and cpu.

I ordered two small 1 gram tubes of kryonaut and just put it on tonight. However the temperatures are higher than they were with the stock paste. I used up the whole tube doing the paste three times. I spread it at first, wiped it off then tried the x method, wiped that off then did the line method.
It's user error. With Ryzen CPUs, the best method to ensure the heat spreader is completely covered, is to spread a small amount on it using a flat item (like a credit card).
Also when I was cleaning the thermal paste off I think I may have had some get inbetween the small gap between the IHS and the top of the cpu. Could some of that thermal paste have gotten onto the IO Die or chiplet and be effecting that? If so is there a way I can remove that without delidding?
You did not get it inside the IHS, and you would most likely destroy your CPU if you attempted to delid it. From the sound of it, you probably got thermal paste in the socket (or around it). That generally means you are using way too much paste.
 
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DrMrLordX

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Getting the thermal paste under the IHS wouldn't hurt temps anyway. It's soldered to the dice. Thermal paste wouldn't interfere with the solder.

Sounds like basic user error? You don't need to get an entirely new CPU. Kryonaut is not easy to handle, and it is definitely possible to use too much. Have you considered using something more user-friendly like MX-4 instead? It should still outperform the stock thermal paste from AMD.
 

UsandThem

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Tmansdc

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Yeah next time I repaste I'm just going to ignore the kryonaut and try the mx-4 instead. Well I put on the new stock cooler so let's see if that'll help. It'll take like two/three days to fully "cure" right?


Could I undervolt without losing performance and actually maybe both drop temps and increase boost clocks?





If so how would I go about doing that?
 

UsandThem

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Yeah next time I repaste I'm just going to ignore the kryonaut and try the mx-4 instead. Well I put on the new stock cooler so let's see if that'll help. It'll take like two/three days to fully "cure" right?

Could I undervolt without losing performance and actually maybe both drop temps and increase boost clocks?

If so how would I go about doing that?
Just leave it be.

You seem to run into problems/issues when messing with your PC(s). You replaced the stock cooler with the same stock cooler. That makes zero sense on correcting your concerns (BTW I'm surprised the cooler you said you ordered on Ebay yesterday already came in).

Put some new paste on it, ensure the head speader is fully covered, and let it do its thing.

Finally, where did this undervolt question come from? Nobody mentioned it in all your threads you posted around, but instead of answering people's questions, you instead ask about under-volting the CPU. Even in your last thread here about your case, you stated you bought a graphite pad and a Macho Rev. C cooler: https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/i-need-some-help-with-my-case-cooling.2571873/

From your previous post:

9.jpg

So why are you not using that cooler, and instead say you are using the stock cooler again? I hate to say it, I just don't think you are serious or honest in any of your posts. People take the time to look up info and specs to help you, so by doing this you really are wasting people's time.
 
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DrMrLordX

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Could I undervolt without losing performance and actually maybe both drop temps and increase boost clocks?
Depends, but in general, yes. You will lose some ST performance on very narrowly ST workloads (CBR20 ST, for example). You may gain or lose some MT performance. Temps will come down regardless.

Take it in steps. SIMPLE steps. But I would recommend you figure out your paste situation first before you try anything too fancy.
 

UsandThem

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Also, I noticed this post from you 9 days ago on Reddit: www.reddit.com/r/pcgamingtechsupport/comments/fl358t/is_the_tctltdie_being_10_to_15_degrees_celsius/
I've just noticed this recently but the temperature seems pretty warm. I'm using:

Ryzen 3600x with everything on auto
Wraith Prism Cooler
Noctua af120-x25 pwm rear exhaust fan
Two 140mm Arctic top exhaust fans
ASUS tuf wifi gaming x570 plus
32gb (2x16) teamforce vulcan 3200mhz ddr4
RTX 2070 Super Founders/Stock edition
Agesa 1.0.0.4 bios
1usmus 1.1 ryzen balanced power plan.

Every fan is set to "Silent" in the bios menu.

Is this normal? The wraith prism cooler I put on back in November. Could the thermal paste already be going bad? I don't do that much to stress out the cpu.

Thank you very much.

Plus I don't know if it was recently or not but I noticed that prior to I'd say three days ago my tctl/tdie was never more than like four or five degrees above the cpu die average. I hope something isn't going on with my cpu.

Ok I'm looking this up and my temps I guess are hotter than they should be.

I've looked up people using the wraith prism cooler at stock settings on other setups and using the default stock settings they seem to be averaging about 10 Celsius lower than I am. Why is that? Is it because I'm using the default paste? It's not seated as properly on the cpu?

The switch on the side is in the "low" position btw.

Yeah I just did a 10 minute long cpu-z stress test (I know it's not really all that stressful of a test but I didn't want something super strenuous.) Tctl/Tdie was at 77.9c, cpu die was at 78.1, and ccd1 was at 79.3 so I'm sure I'm ok.

Plus I ran cinebench r15 three times in a row really quickly. Temps didn't go over 78c.

Although when I set all my case fans and prism to 100% speed and set the switch on the left from low to high at full speed no temps went above 73 celsius. Too loud though for just basically a 5 celsius reduction.

Cinebench r15 scores were 1600, 1602, 1605, and 1583 for silent setting on fans and low prism setting. Got 1620, 1622, and 1625 with all fans at 100% speed and prism on high speed setting. Still good for my setup?

Also I should note that I lost the backplate to mount the 3600x on my mobo. Clips don't have anything to latch onto either so it's basically strictly the built-in thermal paste that's keeping the cooler on the 3600x. I could probably contact Asus and get a new backplate but I'd have to remove and reinstall everything again and I'm fine with the current setup sitting on it's side.

I usually trust hwinfo but up until about three days or so ago (Been using this version of HWinfo since February 1st), the tctl/tdie was never more than like four or five ahead of the other two. Lately I've seen it be more like up to 25 degrees ahead of the other two. Has me worried something might be wrong with my CPU or cooler.

Usually I wouldn't be worried about stuff like this but with the quarantine and not being able to go out as much etc. it's left me to obsess over my computer.

From what you're saying though that's normal? Will that affect the fan/boost performance? I mean the temperatures do even out when I run cinebench or cpu-z to within maybe 2 degrees celsius of each other but that massive difference when lower temperature has me a bit worried.

Here's a 25 minute overview of the three cpu temperatures, the cpu cooler rpm usage, and the rear exhaust fan rpm usage.


I'm not going to bother with doing all of that until or unless I get a new cpu/gpu/ram/ssd/etc.

What bios version/windows updates/amd driver updates/power plans/etc. could I install or use to see if that would improve temps or boosts at all?
A couple things stand out:

1. You don't say anything about having to pull your cooler off to upgrade the NVMe drive.
2. You say you lost the backplate to your motherboard, and only the paste is holding the cooler on?!?! :oops:

Please just stop wasting people's time with nonsense.
 

Tmansdc

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Mar 19, 2019
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Also, I noticed this post from you 9 days ago on Reddit: www.reddit.com/r/pcgamingtechsupport/comments/fl358t/is_the_tctltdie_being_10_to_15_degrees_celsius/

A couple things stand out:

1. You don't say anything about having to pull your cooler off to upgrade the NVMe drive.
2. You say you lost the backplate to your motherboard, and only the paste is holding the cooler on?!?! :oops:

Please just stop wasting people's time with nonsense.

I agree on the second one 100%. But where did I ever say I needed to upgrade the NVMe drive? I don't need to do that at all.
 

UsandThem

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I agree on the second one 100%. But where did I ever say I needed to upgrade the NVMe drive? I don't need to do that at all.
From your original post, 3rd paragraph.
However I had to get into my computer and change my nvme drive so I had to remove the heatsink and in doing so I used 99% rubbing alcohol to completely clean the thermal paste off of the prism and cpu.
You post so much stuff (on so many different forums), you must forget what you are posting about.

Seriously, I just looked at your Reddit history. You gotta learn to keep all the different stories straight.

Edit: The stock AMD cooler would not cover the M.2 slot on the motherboard anyways. So you would have not needed to remove the cooler to get to it.

 
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Tmansdc

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Mar 19, 2019
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I must have been looking up nvme drives when I wrote that I never had to remove or upgrade an nvme drive yet. I can't believe I didn't catch that. Stupid me.


Anyways: I don't want to cut too much performance I want the best multi-core and single threaded I can get because I do a wide variety of things on my desktop.


Yeah I'm not going to undervolt as that will cut single threaded performance. Any other tips? I'm willing to do modded bios, power plans, chipset drivers, etc. Those are all up to date though.
 

UsandThem

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Yeah I'm not going to undervolt as that will cut single threaded performance. Any other tips? I'm willing to do modded bios, power plans, chipset drivers, etc. Those are all up to date though.
Until you get a new back plate and properly install a CPU cooler, there's no need for you to ask for help concerning CPU temps.

Sometimes you just have to be blunt, but at this point I just don't really believe anything you say. The posts you've created here and at places like Reddit, Linus, TechPowerUP, and Tom's make no logical sense at all. I feel that you are trolling people and wasting their time with nonsense.

When you first joined here, you posted you were concerned about gaming on your laptop for 2 hours. Next was about a case where you said you couldn't remove the front panel (despite users showing you could), and now you are posting across all the forums asking about CPU temps when you don't even have the CPU heatsink installed?!?! Your temperature concerns have nothing to do with properly using thermal paste. It's because you don't have it installed, and simply just have it sitting on top the CPU, with the only pressure being provided by gravity. o_O

You don't tell anyone that vital information of course, so whatever you motives/angle is, you really need to stop wasting people's time.
 

DrMrLordX

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Yeah I'm not going to undervolt as that will cut single threaded performance.
Again, I'll remind you, it only happens in purely ST workloads. Do you actually have any of those? I don't except for benchmarks. I don't even have any games that use less than three cores where the performance loss is non-existant.
 
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Tmansdc

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I'm just going to deal with it as is. I'm not putting a backplate on the computer unless I need to upgrade or move or deep clean it. Next time I get a computer I'm going to have someone assemble it for me.


Honestly I know I get a little paranoid and freaked out over stuff easily because I think I'm going to break something I spent a decent amount on but I have to realize computers aren't that fragile. I got to just chill with this.
 
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JPB

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I'm just going to deal with it as is. I'm not putting a backplate on the computer unless I need to upgrade. Next time I get a computer I'm going to have someone assemble it for me.


Honestly I know I get a little paranoid and freaked out over stuff easily because I think I'm going to break something I spent a decent amount on but I have to realize computers aren't that fragile. I got to just chill with this.
o_O
 
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Steltek

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I'm just going to deal with it as is. I'm not putting a backplate on the computer unless I need to upgrade or move or deep clean it. Next time I get a computer I'm going to have someone assemble it for me.
Which, will be very soon if you don't put that backplate on. It is part of the retention mechanism....

Gravity ain't an approved application method. It just ... ain't. I guess I just don't have words...
 

Stuka87

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I'm just going to deal with it as is. I'm not putting a backplate on the computer unless I need to upgrade or move or deep clean it. Next time I get a computer I'm going to have someone assemble it for me.


Honestly I know I get a little paranoid and freaked out over stuff easily because I think I'm going to break something I spent a decent amount on but I have to realize computers aren't that fragile. I got to just chill with this.
I HIGHLY advise you put the backplate on. Without it the main board will warp as a result of the pressure from the heat sink. Which will result in solder joints that start to crack. Once they do, you will end up with weird crashes and hangs, and potentially damage other components.
 

UsandThem

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I HIGHLY advise you put the backplate on. Without it the main board will warp as a result of the pressure from the heat sink. Which will result in solder joints that start to crack. Once they do, you will end up with weird crashes and hangs, and potentially damage other components.
But is there any actual pressure from the OEM heatsink if it's simply resting on top of the CPU?

I'm kind of surprised the cooler wouldn't just vibrate right off of the CPU when the fan was spinning. I've seen a lot of weird stuff over the years on here, but I think this whole mess is easily top 5 in my all-time "What the hell" category.

From their previous posts, they claim to have bought a Noctua cooler, a Macho Rev C cooler, several OEM heatsinks, and various brands of thermal paste. All that money and time wasted because they don't even install the coolers.......they simply lay it on top of the CPU. And then they create posts where they are concerned about their CPU temperatures?
 

Stuka87

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But is there any actual pressure from the OEM heatsink if it's simply resting on top of the CPU?

I'm kind of surprised the cooler wouldn't just vibrate right off of the CPU when the fan was spinning. I've seen a lot of weird stuff over the years on here, but I think this whole mess is easily top 5 in my all-time "What the hell" category.

From their previous posts, they claim to have bought a Noctua cooler, a Macho Rev C cooler, several OEM heatsinks, and various brands of thermal paste. All that money and time wasted because they don't even install the coolers.......they simply lay it on top of the CPU. And then they create posts where they are concerned about their CPU temperatures?

Textbook PEBKAC problems/issues. :oops:
*Sigh*

I did not realize they were not even being mounted. In that case, the motherboard will be fine. But I fear the CPU is in for a very rough, short life.
 

UsandThem

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I'm waiting to find out if he'll use thermal glue instead of paste.
I wouldn't be surprised. :p

Maybe the next thing they will try will be putting are hefty amount of Conductonaut on their CPU, and see how it affects their temps (and shorty before their PC shorts out and it dies).
 

DrMrLordX

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Why would you take the backplate off in the first place, unless to install a custom one or to install a cooler that requires the stock retention mechanism to be removed?
 

Meghan54

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Kryonaut is not easy to handle, and it is definitely possible to use too much.
Actually, my experience with Kryonaut is different. Used it for the first time two days ago and I found it to be very, very easy to apply. Of course, there's the fact I've applied thermal crap for decades, so there's that. But the Kryonaut isn't nearly as thick as others I've used and the little applicator enclosed in the 1 oz. package made it very easy.

Then again, I'm not trolling, so there's that point, too. ;)
 

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