Question Windows 10 laptop upgrade question

[Muse]

I have two similar Lenovo P1 laptops, a P1Gen1 and a P1Gen3. Both run Windows 10 64bit ATM. So, having been busy with other concerns I've declined the MS prompts to "upgrade" to Windows 11, but am aware that support ceases on Oct. 14.

Both these machines have had issues for years.

The Gen3 machine doesn't suspend. I forget exactly how this manifests, but it's been a few years since this cropped up. My workaround is to use hibernate, which does work. I close the lid, it hibernates. I open the lid and it takes maybe 20-30 seconds before the browser (default now is Firefox) to wake up and function, other programs less time.

The Gen1 machine's problem is more challenging and is the reason I'm posting this. I can't get a USB storage device to come up in File Explorer. This has been consistent for years. If I connect a USB cable to one of my LG phones, it is seen in File Manager, but no storage device is seen. Disk Management sees a USB HDD or a flash drive but won't assign a drive letter. I've followed directions to fix that to no avail. I've figured all along that a clean install of Windows would probably fix this but haven't tried it.

Now, a search says to clean install Windows (right now I suppose it should be Windows 11) I'd need to create a bootable USB storage device after downloading an MS utility that I'd use to create it. Well, since the P1Gen1 machine isn't currently able to do anything with a USB storage device in Windows itself, I figure I might not be able to do a Windows 11 clean install.

Should I create a bootable flash drive and see if the machine will boot to it? Is there another workaround for this problem?

Suggestions welcome!

 

[Muse]

Online research yesterday suggested try Fortect and I've been running the 24 hour free version, on both laptops, actually. Maybe a waste of time. Same problem with the P1Gen1 machine, haven't checked on the other. Fortect Free is extremely annoying because it makes you run every little thing manually and it throttles the download speed of drivers tremendously, Fortect itself says 10x! They try to get you to pay for the "Premium" version by boring the hell out of you.

 

[bba-tcg]

I have two similar Lenovo P1 laptops, a P1Gen1 and a P1Gen3. Both run Windows 10 64bit ATM. So, having been busy with other concerns I've declined the MS prompts to "upgrade" to Windows 11, but am aware that support ceases on Oct. 14.

Both these machines have had issues for years.

The Gen3 machine doesn't suspend. I forget exactly how this manifests, but it's been a few years since this cropped up. My workaround is to use hibernate, which does work. I close the lid, it hibernates. I open the lid and it takes maybe 20-30 seconds before the browser (default now is Firefox) to wake up and function, other programs less time.

The Gen1 machine's problem is more challenging and is the reason I'm posting this. I can't get a USB storage device to come up in File Explorer. This has been consistent for years. If I connect a USB cable to one of my LG phones, it is seen in File Manager, but no storage device is seen. Disk Management sees a USB HDD or a flash drive but won't assign a drive letter. I've followed directions to fix that to no avail. I've figured all along that a clean install of Windows would probably fix this but haven't tried it.

Now, a search says to clean install Windows (right now I suppose it should be Windows 11) I'd need to create a bootable USB storage device after downloading an MS utility that I'd use to create it. Well, since the P1Gen1 machine isn't currently able to do anything with a USB storage device in Windows itself, I figure I might not be able to do a Windows 11 clean install.

Should I create a bootable flash drive and see if the machine will boot to it? Is there another workaround for this problem?

Suggestions welcome!

You could download the Windows 11 ISO to the desktop, mount it and run setup from there. No USB required.

 

[Muse]

You could download the Windows 11 ISO to the desktop, mount it and run setup from there. No USB required.

Would that give me a clean install, completely. No remnants of anything before? Would it reformat the disk?

 

[bba-tcg]

Would that give me a clean install, completely. No remnants of anything before? Would it reformat the disk?

If you tell it to. Obviously, you can't format the disk, but you can tell it not to save anything.

Edit: and if you're correct about the USB issue being windows related, you could always format and reinstall afterwards. Or, you could make the flash drive on the other laptop and see if the laptop in question can boot from it.

 

[Muse]

If you tell it to. Obviously, you can't format the disk, but you can tell it not to save anything.

Edit: and if you're correct about the USB issue being windows related, you could always format and reinstall afterwards. Or, you could make the flash drive on the other laptop and see if the laptop in question can boot from it.

Yup, will need a bootable windows flash drive anyway for the other laptop. See if the P1Gen1 will boot from it.

Another problem cropped up this afternoon while running Fortect on both laptops. The P1Gen1 (same as can't deal with USB storage devices) has no sound now. I am almost positive that just happened today. Tried everything, can't get a peep from speakers or headphones. I suppose a clean install of Windows 11 will resolve that.

I did the whole 99 yards with Fortect trial version, quite tedious but I can't see a thing that I neglected to do.

I also ran sfc /scannow on both laptops. Don't know that it did anything, however the problem laptop reported it replaced corrupt files. I didn't look at log(s) to try to find out what.

Another development, the P1Gen3 machine that seemed pretty OK except wouldn't go to sleep is now evidently not having that problem.

Fortect reported that there was no malware on either machine.

Windows Defender has never said it found any threats on either machine. The good machine is my everyday laptop.

I don't understand how Fortect found so many drivers to update. There were probably upwards of 25 on each machine that it said needed updating and I just went along with the whole process but I had to initiate every action. It throttled the download speed by at least 90%. Lenovo, however, consistently reported that my drivers were up to date, as did Windows Update.

 

[bba-tcg]

Yup, will need a bootable windows flash drive anyway for the other laptop. See if the P1Gen1 will boot from it.

Another problem cropped up this afternoon while running Fortect on both laptops. The P1Gen1 (same as can't deal with USB storage devices) has no sound now. I am almost positive that just happened today. Tried everything, can't get a peep from speakers or headphones. I suppose a clean install of Windows 11 will resolve that.

I did the whole 99 yards with Fortect trial version, quite tedious but I can't see a thing that I neglected to do.

I also ran sfc /scannow on both laptops. Don't know that it did anything, however the problem laptop reported it replaced corrupt files. I didn't look at log(s) to try to find out what.

Another development, the P1Gen3 machine that seemed pretty OK except wouldn't go to sleep is now evidently not having that problem.

Fortect reported that there was no malware on either machine.

Windows Defender has never said it found any threats on either machine. The good machine is my everyday laptop.

I don't understand how Fortect found so many drivers to update. There were probably upwards of 25 on each machine that it said needed updating and I just went along with the whole process but I had to initiate every action. It throttled the download speed by at least 90%. Lenovo, however, consistently reported that my drivers were up to date.

Most of those drivers were probably okay to start with. I shun driver update programs.

 

[Muse]

Most of those drivers were probably okay to start with. I shun driver update programs.

Yeah, I've never engaged with driver update utilities before but this was presented as a comprehensive fixall and figured run it against especially the machine that wouldn't see storage USB devices. I figured good chance it was a waste of time but maybe a learning experience.

The program in terms of its updating drivers appeared to do so when it found a driver of apparently newer version. It showed the version of the driver being replaced and the version of the replacement and they were always different. So, WTF, I figured. Just do every GD thing it wanted to do and see if things got fixed. Instead I lost sound on the bad machine. Anyway, I'm gonna work up a bootable flash driver to install Windows 11 clean and see if the bad machine will boot off it.

Before update need to grab data off the machines' HDDs. There's a bunch although I like to keep my important data on my NAS.

Device Manager of the bad machine looks crazy as hell now. I think I'll get a screenshot and post it here. It thinks my Sandisk Sansa M250 DAPs are storage devices and "working properly."

 

[Muse]

Each of my machines thinks it's in some foreign country. This one in Nepal! The other, I forget which one. Fortect is crap. It's buggin' me to pay for annual plan. I wouldn't do it for free.

 

[Muse]

Spent around 2 hours trying to use the Microsoft Windows 11 Media creation tool but it won't work. I'm lucky if I get the window asking me if I will let it change settings on my computer. After that or just launching (yes, as administrator) nothing happens whatsoever. I've tried every fix I found on the internet to no avail. So, I'll attempt an alternate means of creating a bootable windows 11 flash drive, download the ISO and use Rufus to create it.

I could try upgrading within the corrupt and crazy windows 10 on the P1Gen1 machine, but figure try this. Anyway, I'd like it for the better machine, the P1Gen3. That's the machine I've been using to try to run the media creation tool.

 

[bba-tcg]

Spent around 2 hours trying to use the Microsoft Windows 11 Media creation tool but it won't work. I'm lucky if I get the window asking me if I will let it change settings on my computer. After that or just launching (yes, as administrator) nothing happens whatsoever. I've tried every fix I found on the internet to no avail. So, I'll attempt an alternate means of creating a bootable windows 11 flash drive, download the ISO and use Rufus to create it.

I could try upgrading within the corrupt and crazy windows 10 on the P1Gen1 machine, but figure try this. Anyway, I'd like it for the better machine, the P1Gen3. That's the machine I've been using to try to run the media creation tool.

Odd, I've never had any trouble with the Media Creation Tool. I do uncheck the box that says use the recommended options for this PC. But Rufus is a better choice other than its insistence on making the media GPT and NTFS.

 

[Muse]

Odd, I've never had any trouble with the Media Creation Tool. I do uncheck the box that says use the recommended options for this PC. But Rufus is a better choice other than its insistence on making the media GPT and NTFS.

Well, should I use GPT or NTFS?

 

[Muse]

Odd, I've never had any trouble with the Media Creation Tool. I do uncheck the box that says use the recommended options for this PC. But Rufus is a better choice other than its insistence on making the media GPT and NTFS.

If you search you'll find a lot of stuff on what to do to try to fix ms win11 media creation tool not working. I tried everything they suggest, nothing has helped at all.

 

[bba-tcg]

Well, should I use GPT or NTFS?

If you use Rufus to make the media, it'll partition the flash drive as GPT and format it NTFS. You don't really have to worry about it.

If you search you'll find a lot of stuff on what to do to try to fix ms win11 media creation tool not working. I tried everything they suggest, nothing has helped at all.

I guess I've just been lucky, then.

 

[Muse]

If you use Rufus to make the media, it'll partition the flash drive as GPT and format it NTFS. You don't really have to worry about it.

I guess I've just been lucky, then.

Yup.

Good news! The Rufus generated Win11 installation flash drive does work in the P1Gen1 machine. I just booted from it. Fortect screwed that machine up bigtime, it's so frustrating, Windows 10 doesn't boot normally, it gives me an option to choose from a menu:

Windows 10

Roxio Backontrack

The latter is evidently history.

Anyway, after I grab the data off that machine I'll wipe the HD and install Windows 11 clean. I'm thinking my problems with it will be over. Then I'll do a clean install in this machine, the P1Gen3, which is working rather well ATM, at least I think so. I already backed up the data on this machine. But I want to work on setting up the bad machine first and keep the good machine on the side so I have a decently working machine at all times.

 

[Muse]

Got on an MS chat just now and the guy took control of this, the problem laptop and fixed my audio not working. We decided to not mess with the USB storage devices not showing up in File Explorer, too hairy an issue. Windows 11 install will fix that. I need to backup data on the C: drive, then I'll be pretty ready to do the Windows 11 clean install. Will format the entire drive and let Windows create the partitions and installation.

Earlier, removed Roxio from my boot menu, so that's fixed.

 

[bba-tcg]

Got on an MS chat just now and the guy took control of this, the problem laptop and fixed my audio not working. We decided to not mess with the USB storage devices not showing up in File Explorer, too hairy an issue. Windows 11 install will fix that. I need to backup data on the C: drive, then I'll be pretty ready to do the Windows 11 clean install. Will format the entire drive and let Windows create the partitions and installation.

Earlier, removed Roxio from my boot menu, so that's fixed.

1. If the USB drive is recognized as being plugged in, but no drive is appearing in Windows Explorer, it's very likely that automount has been disabled. In your case, it was probably disabled by the Roxio software. If so, it's not a "hairy" issue to rectify, just taking the execution of two commands.

2. To the best of my knowledge, MS does not do chats with endusers. But, the fix for your audio should have been as simple as either rolling back the driver (since you said that the "fix-it" software you installed updated it) or removing the audio device in the device manager and then rediscovering it. I highly recommend not letting people you don't know access your equipment remotely.

 

[Muse]

1. If the USB drive is recognized as being plugged in, but no drive is appearing in Windows Explorer, it's very likely that automount has been disabled. In your case, it was probably disabled by the Roxio software. If so, it's not a "hairy" issue to rectify, just taking the execution of two commands.

2. To the best of my knowledge, MS does not do chats with endusers. But, the fix for your audio should have been as simple as either rolling back the driver (since you said that the "fix-it" software you installed updated it) or removing the audio device in the device manager and then rediscovering it. I highly recommend not letting people you don't know access your equipment remotely.

I don't normally do this but have done 2 Microsoft end-user chats over the last couple weeks. Yes, they're doing it. It's as professional as can be and I accessed it from their Troubleshooter functionality within Windows. They ask for email addy, phone number, make and model of computer. The functionality is initiated with Control+Shift+q. They ask for permission to take control, provide a confirmation key, in my case via email, which I enter to get it working.

I had to wait around 10-15 minutes to get a rep, I was #6 in line to start and saw that number decrement until rep appeared. It was all chat. He provided a long link for me to use in the event that we were disconnected. I needed that to get back to him after I restarted the machine following the installation of drivers.

This guy was quick, knew what he was doing and got the audio working. It seemed like a lark at the time but actually it's helping me a lot in backing up the data because I have a lot of audio files on the C: drive.

Does Microsoft have end-user chat that enables them to take control of a Windows PC?

Yes, Microsoft provides solutions for end-users and organizations to take control of a Windows PC through chat or a chat-like interface. These include Microsoft Teams for taking control during a screen share, Quick Assist for peer-to-peer technical support, Remote Help (an Intune add-on) for IT support with role-based access, and Copilot for voice control and interaction with the PC.


For Peer-to-Peer Support:

• Quick Assist: This free, built-in Windows app allows users to connect with a helper to solve PC problems. The helper can view the user's screen and, with permission, take full control of the device.
• Microsoft Teams: During a Teams call, if someone is sharing their screen, you can select "Take control" to gain control of the presentation, which can include mouse and keyboard control.

For Organizations and IT Support:

• Remote Help: This cloud-based solution requires a Microsoft Entra ID and an Intune add-on. Support staff can remotely connect to a user's device, view the display, and take full control with the user's permission.
• Microsoft Remote Desktop: This allows users to connect to and control a remote Windows PC from another device, using the Remote Desktop Connection app.

For Voice Control:

• Voice Access: A Windows feature that allows users to control their PC and author text using voice commands, which can be a form of taking control through speech.
• Copilot: The AI assistant on Windows 11 can be interacted with using voice, providing access to features, and potentially even controlling the device through voice commands.

 

[Muse]

The problem machine still doesn't see flash drives in File Explorer but I'm not concerned with that because the drive I have Windows 11 installation on will boot the machine, bypassing the screwed up Windows 10 entirely. I'll do that and wipe the primary SSD and install Windows 11 after I finish backing up the data on the primary SSD. Both machines have a secondary SSD, which I'm not dealing with during the upgrade process.

I also have WiFi card upgrades that I haven't installed yet. I figure I'll do that after installing Windows 11.

 

[bba-tcg]

The problem machine still doesn't see flash drives in File Explorer but I'm not concerned with that because the drive I have Windows 11 installation on will boot the machine, bypassing the screwed up Windows 10 entirely. I'll do that and wipe the primary SSD and install Windows 11 after I finish backing up the data on the primary SSD. Both machines have a secondary SSD, which I'm not dealing with during the upgrade process.

I also have WiFi card upgrades that I haven't installed yet. I figure I'll do that after installing Windows 11.

I know, right? Because it was too "hairy" for the MS support guy to troubleshoot.

I don't normally do this but have done 2 Microsoft end-user chats over the last couple weeks. Yes, they're doing it. It's as professional as can be and I accessed it from their Troubleshooter functionality within Windows. They ask for email addy, phone number, make and model of computer. The functionality is initiated with Control+Shift+q. They ask for permission to take control, provide a confirmation key, in my case via email, which I enter to get it working.

I had to wait around 10-15 minutes to get a rep, I was #6 in line to start and saw that number decrement until rep appeared. It was all chat. He provided a long link for me to use in the event that we were disconnected. I needed that to get back to him after I restarted the machine following the installation of drivers.

This guy was quick, knew what he was doing and got the audio working. It seemed like a lark at the time but actually it's helping me a lot in backing up the data because I have a lot of audio files on the C: drive.

Does Microsoft have end-user chat that enables them to take control of a Windows PC?

Yes, Microsoft provides solutions for end-users and organizations to take control of a Windows PC through chat or a chat-like interface. These include Microsoft Teams for taking control during a screen share, Quick Assist for peer-to-peer technical support, Remote Help (an Intune add-on) for IT support with role-based access, and Copilot for voice control and interaction with the PC.


For Peer-to-Peer Support:

• Quick Assist: This free, built-in Windows app allows users to connect with a helper to solve PC problems. The helper can view the user's screen and, with permission, take full control of the device.
• Microsoft Teams: During a Teams call, if someone is sharing their screen, you can select "Take control" to gain control of the presentation, which can include mouse and keyboard control.

For Organizations and IT Support:

• Remote Help: This cloud-based solution requires a Microsoft Entra ID and an Intune add-on. Support staff can remotely connect to a user's device, view the display, and take full control with the user's permission.
• Microsoft Remote Desktop: This allows users to connect to and control a remote Windows PC from another device, using the Remote Desktop Connection app.

For Voice Control:

• Voice Access: A Windows feature that allows users to control their PC and author text using voice commands, which can be a form of taking control through speech.
• Copilot: The AI assistant on Windows 11 can be interacted with using voice, providing access to features, and potentially even controlling the device through voice commands.

Nearly every machine I clean malware from these days was accessed remotely by "Microsoft" using screen connect. But it's indeed probable that they do offer it since ChatGPT or co-pilot says so, so I'll defer to those sources.

 

[Muse]

I know, right? Because it was too "hairy" for the MS support guy to troubleshoot.

Nearly every machine I clean malware from these days was accessed remotely by "Microsoft" using screen connect. But it's indeed probable that they do offer it since ChatGPT or co-pilot says so, so I'll defer to those sources.

Oh, I did fall for a call from "Microsoft" a number of years ago, over 10, saying my system was under attack or some such argument. I let them have access and I think I cut them off fast but I was so concerned about it that I wiped my system and did a fresh Windows install. I wanted to make sure I didn't have malware on my system. Lesson learned there. I think those guys were in India. Now, what I did the last couple weeks was orders of magnitude more professional. It was the real thing. If you want to see how that works you can probably work that out. There's probably some Youtube videos that show exactly what it's like, actually, and the safest way to observe it.

Hey, in any case, I'm wiping the primary SSD on both machines. I do have a NAS, but AFAIK it's just fine.

 

[Muse]

This isn't exactly how I got connected to MS chat support but it got to the same thing:

I got there through the Troubleshooting facility. Windows Settings is complex. I don't know my way around it very well. There's stuff going on that to me is arcane.

One issue I did get help on, the one a couple weeks ago that I referred to above was low volume from my PC speakers. There's a checkbox in advanced audio settings for Audio Enhancements. I didn't set that but unchecking it did resolve the problem for me.