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Wind, snow, and hydrogen, oh my! A "What I've been up to" thread.

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Originally posted by: Rubycon
Ever take an LED fan and hold it in a stiff wind? Those commutatorless motors make fairly decent low yield gennies. 😉
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I haven't, but now I will. 😉

I've been tearing apart all kinds of old electronics looking for 3 phase motors to play with, but none of them can match the power that the tiny little walkman motor will put out. 😕

 
Originally posted by: nakedfrog
I might just steal that idea for a UPS.
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It works great! 😀

A lot of higher end UPSs use a 24V system though, so you would need two batteries.

Edit: I was thinking about the whole hydrogen project/energy thing.. At its core, my goal is to be able to run an engine/generator using hydrogen for less money than it would cost if I were to do the same thing using gasoline.

If I can do that, I'll be a very happy camper.

One other thing I forgot to discuss was the modification of the engines ignition system. Running an engine on hydroxy gas requires that the ignition timing be advanced to around 18º ATDC. Hydrogen burns much faster than gasoline.

Most small gasoline engines trigger firing via the crankshaft. That means that the ignition coil actually fires twice per cycle; once during the intake stroke and then during the power stroke. This poses a big problem for a hydrogen engine. Since the timing is advanced so far, you will have ignition 18º into the intake stroke. Obviously, this is not good.

The plan is to use a simple hall effect sensor and accompanying circuitry, a local electronics saavy friend is going to help me build a circuit that can count to two. 😉

So as the crankshaft turns, the circuit will ignore the first impulse from the hall, and count 1. When it passes again, the circuit will count 2, fire the plug, and reset. I haven't really even started on this part yet, so we may come up with better ideas in our late night brainstorming sessions.

I love being alive.
 
Try making a ring of fire.

All you need is a MOT (Microwave Oven Transformer) and a motor. It's basically a rotary spark gap running with no capacitance. (as it would in a Tesla circuit)

EDIT: I must stress the hazard of a MOT. It is a LETHAL amount of power - at 2,000 volts at one half ampere, contact with such potential WILL kill you. Spark carefully. 😀
 
Originally posted by: Rubycon
Try making a ring of fire.

All you need is a MOT (Microwave Oven Transformer) and a motor. It's basically a rotary spark gap running with no capacitance. (as it would in a Tesla circuit)

EDIT: I must stress the hazard of a MOT. It is a LETHAL amount of power - at 2,000 volts at one half ampere, contact with such potential WILL kill you. Spark carefully. 😀
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😀

Mmmm.... I love the smell of ozone in the morning.
 
Actually a HOT arc at 60Hz doesn't generate too much O3. You will smell it (actually what you are smelling is the OPO's - Ozone produced oxidants, but that's another discussion altogether 😉 )

A corona will produce a LOT of ozone especially in dry air or an oxygen enriched atmosphere.

More torture

Don't do these experiments around this guy - he's pretty shocked. :laugh:

Power on the loose - DANGER!-

Nice arcing action here Was waiting for the BOOM when it crossed to the other phase but it didn't. Quite possibly it was the only phase energized since there were faults galore. (post cane damage?)

Interrupt demo - this is why you NEVER ignore the interrupt rating of a power fuse! :shocked:
 
Originally posted by: Eli
Edit: I was thinking about the whole hydrogen project/energy thing.. At its core, my goal is to be able to run an engine/generator using hydrogen for less money than it would cost if I were to do the same thing using gasoline.
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Hmm...I haven't done the actual calculations, but considering electricity is a fairly high-quality power source, wouldn't it be cheaper to produce it from natural gas via the water-gas shift reaction?

Neat project...I have a friend who's trying to convert a car engine to steam power.
 
Originally posted by: jagec
Originally posted by: Eli
Edit: I was thinking about the whole hydrogen project/energy thing.. At its core, my goal is to be able to run an engine/generator using hydrogen for less money than it would cost if I were to do the same thing using gasoline.
Click to expand...

Hmm...I haven't done the actual calculations, but considering electricity is a fairly high-quality power source, wouldn't it be cheaper to produce it from natural gas via the water-gas shift reaction?

Neat project...I have a friend who's trying to convert a car engine to steam power.
Click to expand...

Since it takes more energy to extract hydrogen/oxygen from water than you'd get by burning it, you incur a net loss performing that process. The more direct you can get to your fuel source, the more efficient you'll be.

If he just wants to run an engine, it will be more efficient simply burning gasoline than trying to break down water and burning the byproducts.

If he wants to turn a generator with it, it would be far more efficient to just buy the electricity from a utility. Since a generator is normally used when you have no power, his best bet would be to get a diesel generator. But that wouldn't be any fun.
 
Awesome. I would do something about the exposed battery terminals, though. I mean, what with that adjustable spanner laying around. :Q
 
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Since it takes more energy to extract hydrogen/oxygen from water than you'd get by burning it, you incur a net loss performing that process. The more direct you can get to your fuel source, the more efficient you'll be.

If he just wants to run an engine, it will be more efficient simply burning gasoline than trying to break down water and burning the byproducts.

If he wants to turn a generator with it, it would be far more efficient to just buy the electricity from a utility. Since a generator is normally used when you have no power, his best bet would be to get a diesel generator. But that wouldn't be any fun.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I should rephrase my post. I understand thermodynamics fairly well, so my question wasn't whether his little project will actually save money (obviously not), but whether making hydrogen would be cheaper if he bought electricity from the power company and used his electrolysis setup, or if he extracted it from methane.
 
Originally posted by: jagec
Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Since it takes more energy to extract hydrogen/oxygen from water than you'd get by burning it, you incur a net loss performing that process. The more direct you can get to your fuel source, the more efficient you'll be.

If he just wants to run an engine, it will be more efficient simply burning gasoline than trying to break down water and burning the byproducts.

If he wants to turn a generator with it, it would be far more efficient to just buy the electricity from a utility. Since a generator is normally used when you have no power, his best bet would be to get a diesel generator. But that wouldn't be any fun.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I should rephrase my post. I understand thermodynamics fairly well, so my question wasn't whether his little project will actually save money (obviously not), but whether making hydrogen would be cheaper if he bought electricity from the power company and used his electrolysis setup, or if he extracted it from methane.
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Yeah, exactly.

Even though our power is fairly cheap here, a kilowatt of electricity is a fair ammount, and it is only 8 cents.

How many equivilent kWh does a gallon of gasoline contain? And how much does a specified ammount of hydrogen/oxygen contain? I'll have to see if I can find some numbers. I'd need to know how much gas the cells will put out before I could make any real estimates of cost effectiveness. With gasoline at 3$/gallon, you could buy 37.5kWh with that same 3 dollars.

I do know that gasoline is quite energy dense, so maybe this is more of an uphill battle than I first thought. But like I said, even if I fail miserably, it is not an entire failure.. as I learned things, and had fun doing it. 🙂

And yes, I will own a diesel engine one of these days. I almost went that route, actually. A diesel generator running off WVO would be heaven.
 
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