Winchester Model 12 - 12 Gauge

[boomerang]

Go easy on me please. I'm pretty new to the firearms world and may not use the right terms.

I've more or less inherited this gun. No sense going into the story behind it. I bought some shells and went out to get some experience with it. On the first shot, the shell casing did not eject. I've since found out that this may have been due to my having no experience with the gun.

I've taken it to a local guy who has admitted that he's not real confident in his abilities on repairing these. I went today to pick it up and shot it about a half dozen times and it appears to be working fine. But there is one issue that I'm not certain about and neither is he.

The slide handle, at the end of the forward stroke requires more force to move at the extreme end of the stroke. Kind of hard to explain, but it moves along with a very easy action but right near the end for maybe the last 1/4 to 1/8 inch, it gets rather stiff. It's way too easy to not move it fully forward and then it locks up and the release button must be pressed.

It doesn't feel right to me and he's not sure. I can take it in to a local gun shop, but I wanted to get some opinions here if possible. He lubricated it and it shoots fine. If this is normal, there's no sense having it looked at and dropping more money on.

Is this description good enough to understand what I'm getting at?

 

[pontifex]

I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

 

[boomerang]

Originally posted by: pontifex
I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

Shit, you may be right. According to the serial number, this one was manufactured in 1928. Although I understand that due to records being destroyed in a fire at the factory, this information has had to be recreated. It has a six digit serial number which does make it quite old.

It's had the barrel cut off by a previous owner which I understand reduces the value of the gun. The local gun shop said they'd give me $180 in trade. So, it's either not that valuable, or they sized me up for the rookie that I am and were hoping for the trade. Maybe I should try to find someone independent to give me an appraisal.

 

[Gothgar]

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: pontifex
I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

Shit, you may be right. According to the serial number, this one was manufactured in 1928. Although I understand that due to records being destroyed in a fire at the factory, this information has had to be recreated. It has a six digit serial number which does make it quite old.

It's had the barrel cut off by a previous owner which I understand reduces the value of the gun. The local gun shop said they'd give me $180 in trade. So, it's either not that valuable, or they sized me up for the rookie that I am and were hoping for the trade. Maybe I should try to find someone independent to give me an appraisal.

wow... go sell it for more then show them the receipt and tell them they lost a customer forever and ever

fucking greedy assholes

 

[Kwatt]

A Model 12 year 1928 may be chambered for 2 and 5/8" shells.

I would have it checked before using 2 and 3/4" roundss.



..

 

[boomerang]

Originally posted by: Gothgar

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: pontifex
I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

Shit, you may be right. According to the serial number, this one was manufactured in 1928. Although I understand that due to records being destroyed in a fire at the factory, this information has had to be recreated. It has a six digit serial number which does make it quite old.

It's had the barrel cut off by a previous owner which I understand reduces the value of the gun. The local gun shop said they'd give me $180 in trade. So, it's either not that valuable, or they sized me up for the rookie that I am and were hoping for the trade. Maybe I should try to find someone independent to give me an appraisal.

wow... go sell it for more then show them the receipt and tell them they lost a customer forever and ever

fucking greedy assholes

Well, guns are selling so well these days that they probably wouldn't much care. Those 12 Gauges in the link from pontifex are more full featured guns than what I have. Mine is in excellent condition (everyone that's seen it has remarked about that) but it does not have checkered grips, a pad or a Vent Rib. Plus, like I said, mine has been shortened from it's original configuration. Many, many of these guns were made. There are a lot of them out there.

 

[tfinch2]

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: pontifex
I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

Shit, you may be right. According to the serial number, this one was manufactured in 1928. Although I understand that due to records being destroyed in a fire at the factory, this information has had to be recreated. It has a six digit serial number which does make it quite old.

It's had the barrel cut off by a previous owner which I understand reduces the value of the gun. The local gun shop said they'd give me $180 in trade. So, it's either not that valuable, or they sized me up for the rookie that I am and were hoping for the trade. Maybe I should try to find someone independent to give me an appraisal.

Wow, I'd never go back there...

 

[boomerang]

Originally posted by: Kwatt
A Model 12 year 1928 may be chambered for 2 and 5/8" shells.

I would have it checked before using 2 and 3/4" roundss.



..

Thanks, but it's 2 3/4. Stamped right on the barrel. I'm a rookie, but unless the barrel was replaced, I'm assuming I can rely on that. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Kwatt]

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: Kwatt
A Model 12 year 1928 may be chambered for 2 and 5/8" shells.

I would have it checked before using 2 and 3/4" roundss.



..

Thanks, but it's 2 3/4. Stamped right on the barrel. I'm a rookie, but unless the barrel was replaced, I'm assuming I can rely on that. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Wikipedia

The majority of "modern" Model 12 shotguns manufactured after the 1930s were chambered for 2¾-inch shotgun shells, only. Some early 16 gauge Model 12's, however, were chambered for 2 9/16-inch shotgun shells, the 12 gauge guns had chambers that were 2 5/8" and the 20 gauges had chambers that were 2 1/2". To add further confusion, some of these early Model 12's have subsequently been modified, with their chambers lengthened to accept 2¾-inch shotgun shells, while others remain in their factory-stock chamber lengths. Careful inspection by a gunsmith is always recommended to determine whether or not it is safe to fire a modern 2¾-inch shotgun shell in older Model 12's.

The barrel may have been replaced by a "home" gunsmith.

EDIT: It would explain the last 1/8" requiring more force.

..

 

[boomerang]

Originally posted by: Kwatt

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: Kwatt
A Model 12 year 1928 may be chambered for 2 and 5/8" shells.

I would have it checked before using 2 and 3/4" roundss.



..

Thanks, but it's 2 3/4. Stamped right on the barrel. I'm a rookie, but unless the barrel was replaced, I'm assuming I can rely on that. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Wikipedia

The majority of "modern" Model 12 shotguns manufactured after the 1930s were chambered for 2¾-inch shotgun shells, only. Some early 16 gauge Model 12's, however, were chambered for 2 9/16-inch shotgun shells, the 12 gauge guns had chambers that were 2 5/8" and the 20 gauges had chambers that were 2 1/2". To add further confusion, some of these early Model 12's have subsequently been modified, with their chambers lengthened to accept 2¾-inch shotgun shells, while others remain in their factory-stock chamber lengths. Careful inspection by a gunsmith is always recommended to determine whether or not it is safe to fire a modern 2¾-inch shotgun shell in older Model 12's.

The barrel may have been replaced by a "home" gunsmith.

EDIT: It would explain the last 1/8" requiring more force.

..

Interesting. Thank you!

 

[SSSnail]

If I were you, I'd clean that gun up really good and put it on a display. It's made from 1928 for Yosemite Sam's sake.

 

[BabaBooey]

If you do not want to hold onto it as they are excellent guns and sought after then put it on gunbroker.com or a local gun site.

I hope you fully laughed in the douchebag's face that offered $180....:thumbsup:

 

[pontifex]

Originally posted by: tfinch2

Originally posted by: boomerang

Originally posted by: pontifex
I don't know about that gun, but a quick search brought this up:
Text

If that's any indication of what you have, i'd stop shooting it immediately.

Shit, you may be right. According to the serial number, this one was manufactured in 1928. Although I understand that due to records being destroyed in a fire at the factory, this information has had to be recreated. It has a six digit serial number which does make it quite old.

It's had the barrel cut off by a previous owner which I understand reduces the value of the gun. The local gun shop said they'd give me $180 in trade. So, it's either not that valuable, or they sized me up for the rookie that I am and were hoping for the trade. Maybe I should try to find someone independent to give me an appraisal.

Wow, I'd never go back there...

I haven't seen the OP's gun, I only did a quick search on the model and found that, so it's quite possible it's not worth what the guns in the links are. He would have to do research to find out for sure. There are a lot of factors that could change it's worth.

 

[Auryg]

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If I were you, I'd clean that gun up really good and put it on a display. It's made from 1928 for Yosemite Sam's sake.

That's not that old, in gun terms. My dad collects old guns and most are from the 1800s and quite a few are from the 1700s. Hell, you can get a Mosin Nagant from the same period for 80 dollars.

What makes it valuable is a lot of things, none of which we know from the OP.

 

[MedicBob]

Honestly, I hope you get it figured out.

I will never and have never owned a gun that I won't shoot. That is what they are made for. Now, I might not put 5000 rounds through a collector, but 100 a year can be fun.

 

[Born2bwire]

Originally posted by: Auryg

Originally posted by: SSSnail
If I were you, I'd clean that gun up really good and put it on a display. It's made from 1928 for Yosemite Sam's sake.

That's not that old, in gun terms. My dad collects old guns and most are from the 1800s and quite a few are from the 1700s. Hell, you can get a Mosin Nagant from the same period for 80 dollars.

What makes it valuable is a lot of things, none of which we know from the OP.

Yeah, I've shot 100+ year old military rifles. Krag-Jorgensen was nice.

 

[boomerang]

I want to thank everyone for their input.

I'm still wondering about my original question though. I've done enough research on the gun to feel that the last bit of movement on the slide handle being stiffer may be normal. The bolt in this gun tips down before traveling backward with the action of the slide handle. When the slide handle moves forward, there is a cam action taking place that pivots the bolt up at the rear right at the end of the stroke, locking it in place. I think that the resistance I feel is the bolt overcoming a spring and being forced upwards. (I've oversimplified this to some extent.) I would like confirmation of that.

Does anyone have a gun related forum they'd recommend?

 

[OogyWaWa]

this kinda reminds me of a gun i got from a buddy in pakistan. old as hell 1800s enfield. got it cheap to take to reenactment and when i showed it to them they all freaked out and couldn't believe i was going to use it, lol

 

[pontifex]

Originally posted by: boomerang
I want to thank everyone for their input.

I'm still wondering about my original question though. I've done enough research on the gun to feel that the last bit of movement on the slide handle being stiffer may be normal. The bolt in this gun tips down before traveling backward with the action of the slide handle. When the slide handle moves forward, there is a cam action taking place that pivots the bolt up at the rear right at the end of the stroke, locking it in place. I think that the resistance I feel is the bolt overcoming a spring and being forced upwards. (I've oversimplified this to some extent.) I would like confirmation of that.

Does anyone have a gun related forum they'd recommend?

PAFOA.org is one I visit quite often.