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Will Intel present Ivy Bridge at CES 2012?

F

Fjodor2001

Diamond Member
Hi,

The last couple of years Intel has always presented the next generation x86 CPUs at the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas, and the new CPUs were then also immediately available in the shops. This has followed the well known tick-tock pattern.

However, since Intel have announced that Ivy Bridge will not be available in the shops until around March 2012, I just wonder if you think Intel will still present it officially at CES 2012 as usual? Or will Intel come to CES this year without even presenting the next generation x86 CPUs?

What do you think?
 
Well, since IB chips are already exiting the fab in a pre-production ramp phase, there is no technical reason for IB to not be extensively demo'ed at CES.

The delay to March is more for supply-chain management reasons. Board integrators and system's builders were cut short by 3 months because of the SB chipset recall. Intel is doing the prudent thing and is managing the rate of change of the product lineup so as to not ostracize the downstream supplier ecosystem.
 
If you're right, then this 3 month delay will continue even in the future, since mother board manufacturers and builders likely desire a one year sales window for Ivy Bridge and any successors as well.

I also wonder if you think tech review sites like Anandtech will be given CPU samples ahead of launch, so that they can have comprehensive reviews available when Ivy Bridge is presented at CES 2012 in January (assuming it actually is presented officially then)? Or perhaps Intel will not allow that, so reviews will be postponed until the CPUs are actually available in the shops (i.e. as has been the case for previous CPUs)?
 
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Fjodor2001 said:
If you're right, then this 3 month delay will continue even in the future, since mother board manufacturers and builders likely desire a one year sales window for Ivy Bridge and any successors as well.
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Not necessarily. Its not that a 12 month product window is necessary, but since it was communicated as an expectation for the SB cycle that meant all the businesses involved invested resources accordingly with the projected net TAM for SB facing products.

Had they been guided to expect SB to be a 9 month product (so to speak, obviously SB will be sold for years to come) then those platform supporting businesses would have scaled back their upfront development expenses accordingly.

What we don't know in the public domain is whether or not Intel guided the OEM's to expect a 9 month or 12 months (or 15, etc) cycle for IB before Haswell is launched.

There is flexibility in the timeline, but more important at the business relationship level is the trust involved and having an alignment of expectations. Intel guided its platform ecosystem to expect a 12 month sales window for SB before IB would debut, its up to Intel to deliver on that expectation.

Delaying IB for 3 months fulfills the spirit of their obligations and keeps the relationships in good standing.

Fjodor2001 said:
I also wonder if you think tech review sites like Anandtech will be given CPU samples ahead of launch, so that they can have comprehensive reviews available when Ivy Bridge is presented at CES 2012 in January (assuming it actually is presented officially then)? Or perhaps Intel will not allow that, so reviews will be postponed until the CPUs are actually available in the shops (i.e. as has been the case for previous CPUs)?
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Given that the reasoning for the delay is one of financial motivation, they aren't about to do anything that undermines that per se.

An announcement at CES is necessary in the sense that too much negativity would be read into the situation if Intel were to not have something to show for IB at that time. That would trash their stock and undermine confidence throughout the platform ecosystem.

But they aren't about to tip their hand too much for fear of undermining the very SB-based sales they are intending to generate during those extra 3 months selling period.
 
is there supposed to be a nice IPC increase over SB-E? sometimes i wonder why i always get newer crap. i side graded my 2600k to a 3930.
 
nanaki333 said:
is there supposed to be a nice IPC increase over SB-E?
Click to expand...

No. IvyBridge is basically the same design as SB.

The advantages of going to the smaller size and 3D transisters appears from inital reports all being directed to lower power consumption (so basically the same clock speeds, but lower TDP).

Only other change is a doubling (?) of the size of the GPU, but that is only really important at the low end / portable systems market.
 
Idontcare said:
Not necessarily. Its not that a 12 month product window is necessary, but since it was communicated as an expectation for the SB cycle that meant all the businesses involved invested resources accordingly with the projected net TAM for SB facing products.

Had they been guided to expect SB to be a 9 month product (so to speak, obviously SB will be sold for years to come) then those platform supporting businesses would have scaled back their upfront development expenses accordingly.

What we don't know in the public domain is whether or not Intel guided the OEM's to expect a 9 month or 12 months (or 15, etc) cycle for IB before Haswell is launched.

There is flexibility in the timeline, but more important at the business relationship level is the trust involved and having an alignment of expectations. Intel guided its platform ecosystem to expect a 12 month sales window for SB before IB would debut, its up to Intel to deliver on that expectation.

Delaying IB for 3 months fulfills the spirit of their obligations and keeps the relationships in good standing.
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Latest news is that IB will not be out until April (the mobile variants even later):

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-ivy-bridge-22nm-cpu-3d-transistor,14093.html

Do you really think that Intel will only let IB have a ~8 months sales window so that they can release Haswell at CES 2013?

Idontcare said:
Given that the reasoning for the delay is one of financial motivation, they aren't about to do anything that undermines that per se.

An announcement at CES is necessary in the sense that too much negativity would be read into the situation if Intel were to not have something to show for IB at that time. That would trash their stock and undermine confidence throughout the platform ecosystem.

But they aren't about to tip their hand too much for fear of undermining the very SB-based sales they are intending to generate during those extra 3 months selling period.
Click to expand...

The questions is whether Intel will let review sites such as Anandtech provide full reviews of the IB CPUs 4 months ahead of when it will be available in the shops? Unfortunately this year I think we'll have to prepare ourselves for not having a full review available of the latest Intel CPUs at the time of CES 2012.
 
Fjodor2001 said:
Do you really think that Intel will only let IB have a ~8 months sales window so that they can release Haswell at CES 2013?
Click to expand...

I don't think that will happen either. Haswell will be a year later at spring 2013 if anything. Although IDC has a point about March/April release a prudent decision due to the chipset delay. Perhaps giving extra 3/4 months would avoid such problems in the future.

Unfortunately this year I think we'll have to prepare ourselves for not having a full review available of the latest Intel CPUs at the time of CES 2012.
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We won't have full review until the release but a preview one might be in order just like they did with Sandy Bridge when Anandtech got a sample little before September IDF.

nanaki333 said:
is there supposed to be a nice IPC increase over SB-E? sometimes i wonder why i always get newer crap. i side graded my 2600k to a 3930.
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No. Remember this is a "Tick" which is a process shrink. Process shrinks give the potential to fit more transistors, but that's not how Tick Tock works. The new architectures coming with "Tock" is what uses the extra room afforded by process shrink for performance increase.

Although if some of you are adverse to upgrading to new tech to wait for the "kinks to be ironed out", from my experience Tick generally happens to be more stable(compared to a Tock) with more wide range of SKUs to choose from.
 
Fjodor2001 said:
Do you really think that Intel will only let IB have a ~8 months sales window so that they can release Haswell at CES 2013?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think Intel or its supply chain partners are interested in seeing IB have a mere 8 month sales period before Haswell's arrival. I suspect the release shift will be permanent.
 
fastamdman said:
Overclocking will be better also because of the die shrink. Something I am looking forward to.
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Supposed to be. But this is completely new 3d transistors. I would wait till they come out before believing anything like this. several reasons. 1st is the clocks will be about the same as Sandy. 2nd we are ~5ghz. I cannot imaging ivory being too much higher. I mean, it would be nice to have a 6ghz chip on air, but somehow i doubt that these 3d transistors are reaching clocks like that or we wouldve been hearing something on this by now.

But even if we get 5.5 on air. I just think thats got to be reaching....i am just not gonna think too much just yet on this.

Idontcare said:
No, I don't think Intel or its supply chain partners are interested in seeing IB have a mere 8 month sales period before Haswell's arrival. I suspect the release shift will be permanent.
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I am starting to catch wind that this node isnt going so smooth as intel is playing it off as. maybe there is a little more to this, didnt they push off some budget 22nm too? This makes me wonder if maybe it is true.

you are correct, everything is pushed back though.
 
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Idontcare said:
No, I don't think Intel or its supply chain partners are interested in seeing IB have a mere 8 month sales period before Haswell's arrival. I suspect the release shift will be permanent.
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While I generally agree, it takes the release cycle out of line of the reasons it was choosen for these specific periods.

I think the change from IB to the next will see a stagered change over to try and get back into step. This is more of a release the high end cpus in limited numbers, only release high end boards in limited numbers and charge accordinitly for limit availabily for the few month overlap needed to get back in cycle. But then, the easy path is to just shift the release (and hope no need to do it again in the future).
 
greenhawk said:
While I generally agree, it takes the release cycle out of line of the reasons it was choosen for these specific periods.

I think the change from IB to the next will see a stagered change over to try and get back into step. This is more of a release the high end cpus in limited numbers, only release high end boards in limited numbers and charge accordinitly for limit availabily for the few month overlap needed to get back in cycle. But then, the easy path is to just shift the release (and hope no need to do it again in the future).
Click to expand...

Intel has never really had a specific release cycle though, it has slowly but surely changed over time for as long as they have been releasing processors.

At best you can force a static snapshot of recent history and attempt to argue that Intel chose to recently release CPU's in the Q1 timeframe for reasons XYZ, but we need to be honest with ourselves and accept the reality that such a snapshot is arbitrary in its length because if we go back in time for any arbitrary period of time we find a moving target for release timelines.

Intelreleasedates.png
 
We are involved in just such a project now. I may have to remove parts from wifes water cooled set up to be ready as venders are being slow to deliver
 
Seems like Intel did not present any new technical details at all about Ivy Bridge on CES 2012?

No review or even a preview by Anandtech either? 🙁
 
greenhawk said:
No. IvyBridge is basically the same design as SB.

The advantages of going to the smaller size and 3D transisters appears from inital reports all being directed to lower power consumption (so basically the same clock speeds, but lower TDP).

Only other change is a doubling (?) of the size of the GPU, but that is only really important at the low end / portable systems market.
Click to expand...

Actually, Ivy Bridge will have an IPC advantage over Sandy Bridge (+25% in Excel!):
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/di...y_Bridge_Performance_Numbers_to_Partners.html

Ivy Bridge will also have a higher overclock potential than Sandy Bridge (max multiplier is raised from 57 to 63).

Hence, this is why Ivy Bridge will have a better performance than Sandy Bridge-E at applications that use up to 4 cores.
 
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