Will future revision of sb come with flux less vs Tim paste.

[Hugo Drax]

From what I have read it seems intel decided to cut corners and use a cheap thermal paste between the CPU Die and integrated heat spreader instead of using flux less soldier which means much better thermal efficiency.

So it seems the 3770k runs hotter even stock because of the crappy thermal paste compared to sandy bridge.

Is this something they will change as they ramp up production in some future revision?

 

[ShintaiDK]

Most likely no. And TJmax is higher on IB too. And thermal density also makes it hotter. The cores in IB is about half the size as in SB.

Not to mention golden samples of i7 3770K is hitting 5Ghz on air.

 

[Puppies04]

From what I have read it seems intel decided to cut corners and use a cheap thermal paste between the CPU Die and integrated heat spreader instead of using flux less soldier which means much better thermal efficiency.

So it seems the 3770k runs hotter even stock because of the crappy thermal paste compared to sandy bridge.

Is this something they will change as they ramp up production in some future revision?

For the 50th time, Intel have explicitly said that the reason behind the change in the thermal material on IB was down to the increased heat cycling caused by the denser cores. They felt if they used the same material that was used in SB it could have led to problems down the road. If you have some proof to prove this is BS please go ahead and share it with us otherwise a little time googling a subject before jumping to conclusions might be advisable.

 

[Kristijonas]

For the 50th time, Intel have explicitly said that the reason behind the change in the thermal material on IB was down to the increased heat cycling caused by the denser cores. They felt if they used the same material that was used in SB it could have led to problems down the road. If you have some proof to prove this is BS please go ahead and share it with us otherwise a little time googling a subject before jumping to conclusions might be advisable.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/198/020/BRTky.jpg?1320962111

This is a discussion board and he posted a topic to discuss, nothing wrong with that. There's a small chance that Intel does try to cheap on this. Even though I don't believe it myself. But this thing is good to be discussed.

We're not 4Chan
-ViRGE

 

[Puppies04]

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/198/020/BRTky.jpg?1320962111

This is a discussion board and he posted a topic to discuss, nothing wrong with that. There's a small chance that Intel does try to cheap on this. Even though I don't believe it myself. But this thing is good to be discussed.

The accepted procedure is to refute a companies claims then make an accusation.

What keeps happening around here is people ignore what Intel has stated as fact and jump satraight onto the "Intel tried to save 4 cents on my $230 CPU by changing the TIM material. This has been discussed in at least 20 threads over the last month in this forum so excuse me if it gets a little boring hearing the same armchair experts spouting the same crap.

As I previously stated if someone has proof or even something that might be proof feel free to post it up here and I will be the first to call Intel out if it appears to be true.

But before you go looking keep this basic fact in mind, heat aswell as voltage degrades chips, if intel had to spend a few extra cents on TIM they would because A: it will reduce warranty replacements down the line and B: If IB chips do start degrading because intel save a few thousand bucks on TIM the cost to them could very well be in the millions because of the bad press generated.

This isn't some backyard business trying to cut corners, if they changed the TIM there is a damn good reason for it and as they gave what appears to be (to me anyway) a good reason as soon as they were asked I tend to trust them on this one.

 

[moonbogg]

You guys don't think it makes more sense that intel used paste to keep the OC performance of the chips limited? Yeah I know I have no friggin PROOF, but I can't get past common sense on this one. With solder instead of paste, Ivy would clock so damn high that everything would be instantly obsolete in it's wake. It wasn't to save money. I think it was to save Sandy Bridge-E.
Who would buy a 3930K when an ivy bridge could hit 5.5 on air easy? Oh, thats right it can't hit 5.5 on air easy because they used F-ing silly putty instead of proper solder.

 

[borisvodofsky]

You guys don't think it makes more sense that intel used paste to keep the OC performance of the chips limited? Yeah I know I have no friggin PROOF, but I can't get past common sense on this one. With solder instead of paste, Ivy would clock so damn high that everything would be instantly obsolete in it's wake. It wasn't to save money. I think it was to save Sandy Bridge-E.
Who would buy a 3930K when an ivy bridge could hit 5.5 on air easy? Oh, thats right it can't hit 5.5 on air easy because they used F-ing silly putty instead of proper solder.

Well, people have tried the best conventional cooling with IVY, none of which hit 5.5ghz.

So.... not exactly 3930k smashing. besides, 3930k is x79, which doesn't compete with Ivy, Sandy,

 

[ShintaiDK]

Oh, the great conspiracy theory. How original.

 

[skipsneeky2]

Perfectly content with the 4.4ghz my 3770k has yielded without little hassle,idk what the big deal is....chip runs a little warmer sure but its a big package wedged into a small area.

Think of it like someone shoving your head up your ass....it could fit but it takes plenty of effort before such a feat is pulled over but its possible,just like ivy was.

No pun intended to the Op but that's the best analogy i can find for the moment,i will update this post when i conjure up a better one.

 

[Meghan54]

Oh, the great conspiracy theory. How original.

Well, what did you honestly expect? Rational thought?

 

[Diogenes2]

You guys don't think it makes more sense that intel used paste to keep the OC performance of the chips limited? Yeah I know I have no friggin PROOF, but I can't get past common sense on this one. With solder instead of paste, Ivy would clock so damn high that everything would be instantly obsolete in it's wake. It wasn't to save money. I think it was to save Sandy Bridge-E.
Who would buy a 3930K when an ivy bridge could hit 5.5 on air easy? Oh, thats right it can't hit 5.5 on air easy because they used F-ing silly putty instead of proper solder.

By your reasoning, people who popped the lid and used direct contact on the silicon should have hit 6g easy..

I wonder why that didn't happen ?

 

[Maximilian]

For the 50th time, Intel have explicitly said that the reason behind the change in the thermal material on IB was down to the increased heat cycling caused by the denser cores. They felt if they used the same material that was used in SB it could have led to problems down the road. If you have some proof to prove this is BS please go ahead and share it with us otherwise a little time googling a subject before jumping to conclusions might be advisable.

Someone has a boner for intel

Be nice...
-ViRGE

 

[ShintaiDK]

Well, what did you honestly expect? Rational thought?

I know, I know. Im too optimistic and end up setting too high expectations. :|

 

[Smoblikat]

AND THE GOVERNMENT KILLED KENNY............i mean kenedy.

lol, Believeme, I love a good conspiracy too but intel used fluxless stuff on SB, and it worked perfect. if they thought it would be best they wouldve used it on IB too.

 

[skipsneeky2]

This thread is becoming a joke.....

 

[Meghan54]

This is a discussion board and he posted a topic to discuss, nothing wrong with that. There's a small chance that Intel does try to cheap on this. Even though I don't believe it myself. But this thing is good to be discussed.

True, this is a discussion board and topics are endless and open to discussion. But when the OP frames the "discussion" with buzz words like:

...use a cheap thermal paste between the CPU Die and integrated heat spreader...

...the crappy thermal paste compared to sandy bridge.

Then I see this "discussion" as no more than an attempt at trolling or trying to create a flame fest.

Point: has the OP even tested the thermal paste to determine if it is crappy or cheap? The OP tries to make it sound like someone at Intel just ran down to Radio Shack and bought a bunch of their cheapest white silicone paste and is just applying it with a butter knife.

Don't you think Intel, a company that's been making chips longer than half the posters on this forum have been alive, has an inkling of what they're doing? Or that Intel may have already done thermal testing with their thermal paste and found it to be quite satisfactory for long term use?


Naaahhh.....couldn't be.

 

[pantsaregood]

Isn't the fact that Ivy Bridge still runs hot with the IHS removed enough proof that not cheaping out on the thermal compound would've made no difference?

Also, SB-E hits 4.5-4.8 GHz on air regularly just like SB does - it is the same core, after all. A 5.5 GHz quad-core still won't compare to a six-core CPU clocked at 87% of the quad core's speed. A six-core CPU offers a theoretical performance improvement of 50% over an equally clocked quad-core. Increasing clock speed by 15% yields a theoretical performance increase of 15%.

 

[Xpage]

well durr we need to use the sandia cooler on ivy, IT'S A GOVERNMENT CONSPIRACY!!!!one!

Seriously though, I think intel would have good reason to change TIM, mostly because it wants as few returns as possible in case the old SB TIM cracks or strains the die and breaks something.

Intel is for profits first, if a chip is a good overclocker or not intel could care less either way

 

[2is]

Isn't the fact that Ivy Bridge still runs hot with the IHS removed enough proof that not cheaping out on the thermal compound would've made no difference?
.

It's hardly a fact though, there have been others who have replaced the TIM under the IHS and achieved decent results.

 

[pantsaregood]

"Decent results" is quite subjective. Most cases I've seen result in either no temperature drop or ~5C. Five degrees is a nice drop, but it pretty clearly indicates that Ivy Bridge runs hot for reasons other than a bad paste job.

Even direct die contact didn't drop temperatures much for most people.

Everyone has used an aftermarket heatsink for a first time before. Most people dump thermal paste all over the CPU for lack of knowledge of what to do. A bad paste job will spike temperatures by very large amounts - I've heard of 15 to 20 degrees. Ivy Bridge paste may be a mess, but not to the extent temperatures are being raised by such significant amounts.

 

[2is]

"Decent results" is quite subjective. Most cases I've seen result in either no temperature drop or ~5C. Five degrees is a nice drop, but it pretty clearly indicates that Ivy Bridge runs hot for reasons other than a bad paste job.

Even direct die contact didn't drop temperatures much for most people.

Everyone has used an aftermarket heatsink for a first time before. Most people dump thermal paste all over the CPU for lack of knowledge of what to do. A bad paste job will spike temperatures by very large amounts - I've heard of 15 to 20 degrees. Ivy Bridge paste may be a mess, but not to the extent temperatures are being raised by such significant amounts.

I'm not saying it doesn't run hot, nor am I supporting any conspiracy theories. Just pointing out that "fact" is a bold statement to describe one (or several) persons experience with de-lidding. If it was a fact it would be repeatable every single time, thus, it's only a fact as it relates to the individual.

 

[Denithor]

Ivy will go fast if you keep it cool.

http://www.gigabyte.com/press-center/news-page.aspx?nid=1126

EDIT: What I wonder about is whether Intel will use the TIM or the solder for their IB-E chips.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Ivy will go fast if you keep it cool.

http://www.gigabyte.com/press-center/news-page.aspx?nid=1126

EDIT: What I wonder about is whether Intel will use the TIM or the solder for their IB-E chips.

Yeah, but that scenario doesn't apply to the average joe who sees his 3570k at 4.6Ghz running upper 80s while his buddy with an old 2500k is above that with lower temps.

I never much cared for the overclock wars where all you have to do is get a validation

 

[moonbogg]

I bet Ivy-E uses solder. They used cheap paste to keep the overlcocker down and strengthen sales of sandy bridge-E.

 

[pantsaregood]

does no one see the significance of ivy bridge running hotter than sandy bridge even when delidded