Why the **** do we have dealers: Tesla

[ElFenix]

But then by your logic, the managers of these "outlets" would be as rich as bud adams and red mccombs, wont they? if not then how come Ford will be spending the same? I guess then warren buffett will get that much richer? You logic is sadly flawed.

why would that be the case and how does that at all follow from what i posted? whose logic is flawed here?

 

[Brovane]

What benefit do they offer?

None.

The Auto manufacturers wanted dealers back when they auto market was first forming 1920's etc because they didn't want to deal with the end customers. They could produce the vehicles and sell them to dealers. The manufacturers got paid and the dealers dealt with the end customers and made a profit. The dealers got laws passed to make sure the auto manufacturers didn't undercut them when the car manufacturers got larger and maybe didn't need the dealers anymore. It is really a great example of crony capitalism.

 

[dainthomas]

My Tundra had an issue with some air injection component or another. It caused the computer to put it into limp mode.

A mechanic I took it to said it would be 2k to fix. I said f that and took it to the dealer. They let me know about a service bulletin, gave me a free loaner, and had it fixed for free in a couple days. Turns out it was faulty and Toyota had issued the service bulletin stating exactly what the issue was with this obscure part, and that they extended the warranty on that part to 125k miles (my truck had just over 100k).

So I'd say what you get with a dealer is a much higher level of expertise with your particular vehicle than you'll see at a general mechanic. Even if I'd known about the service bulletin without the dealer telling me, I probably would have had to pay out of pocket and get reimbursed. And forget about the loaner.

 

[Fern]

What benefit do they offer?

None.

Tesla is thought to produce/sell about 18,000-20,000 vehicles per years.

The others produce/sell many millions.

Stop and think a minute how Ford, GM etc would operate without dealers given their huge numbers.

What works for boutique auto manufacturer isn't going to work for them.

Where the h3ll are they going to keep an inventory of millions of cars?

How will people be given access to all their models for test drives etc.?

How would they process the millions of state registrations or license plate applications etc.

How would recalls and warranty services be done without dealers?

Silly comparison and if Tesla weren't so tiny they'd have dealers too.

I bought my last vehicle (Toyota Taco) the same way people buy Tesla's: I ordered it online. So, IMO, this whole line of discussion is moot unless one is a fanboi of the Tesla company itself. In all 50 states Tesla's can be purchased online. The primary difference is that Tesla wants to own dealerships. The very dealerships you seem to dislike.

This isn't really about stopping Tesla, it's about stopping the big auto makers from gobbling up existing dealerships. It's about protecting small businesses from big business.

Fern

 

[tynopik]

Where the h3ll are they going to keep an inventory of millions of cars?

How will people be given access to all their models for test drives etc.?

How would they process the millions of state registrations or license plate applications etc.

How would recalls and warranty services be done without dealers?

company-owned shops

is this a difficult concept to understand?

 

[tynopik]

Middlemen make the world go around. Do you expect that if a surgeon made his own surgical instruments he could or even would lower the price for his services?

404 Middleman not found

 

[amdhunter]

Additionally, they employ a ton of people both directly and indirectly and in good paying jobs. But that doesn't seem to be very important to many people these days. I guess as long as it's not your job going bye-bye it's all good.

After Koepell Volkswagen in Queens told me that I needed a brand new transmission in a 7 month old car with 2500 miles that they MAGICALLY FIXED WHEN I CALLED VW CORPORATE and then Paragon Honda in LIC Queens quoted me $2500 to fix an SRS light that was on since day 1 and said SRS light on dash is "NORMAL OPERATION" dealerships can suck my ass.

As a matter of fact, every dipshit that works in those two dealerships could explode on Christmas day with their families looking on in horror and I'd be happy. SCREW dealerships. IF THEY ALL GOT FIRED, I'd laugh and piss in a cup so they have something to drink on the holidays.

Funny enough, Koepell Mazda has been good to me, but I still don't trust them after they lied about a shift link cable and tried to get me to pay for a new transmission that was caused by abuse. And they share name only, different dealerships and service.

All they do is prey on people who don't know any better. It took 10 minutes to fix my shift linkage and the SRS light was just a sensor and a seat that was improperly installed from factory AND was a NSHTA recall. But they never told me about the recall.

I'm enraged by dealerships.

 

[uclabachelor]

Having worked in dealerships most my life they benefit in many ways:

They make test driving a vehicle easy as they are local.
If you need any special parts for your vehicle, they are there.
Service often requires proprietary tools and training for warranty or non-warranty repairs.
A dealer will usually trade quicker for their model cars.

Whatever type of vehicle you drive, try and imagine what it would be like to travel 300 or 400 miles to get warranty service for a transmission or engine repair.

Everything you've said can be applied to any dealership, whether they are privately owned, owned by a publicly traded company, or owned by the vehicle manufacturer.

If Tesla wants to front the money for a dealership they own, why should they be disallowed? If anything, I would trust a Tesla owned dealership to perform work on my car over a privately owned one.

 

[zerocool84]

My Tundra had an issue with some air injection component or another. It caused the computer to put it into limp mode.

A mechanic I took it to said it would be 2k to fix. I said f that and took it to the dealer. They let me know about a service bulletin, gave me a free loaner, and had it fixed for free in a couple days. Turns out it was faulty and Toyota had issued the service bulletin stating exactly what the issue was with this obscure part, and that they extended the warranty on that part to 125k miles (my truck had just over 100k).

So I'd say what you get with a dealer is a much higher level of expertise with your particular vehicle than you'll see at a general mechanic. Even if I'd known about the service bulletin without the dealer telling me, I probably would have had to pay out of pocket and get reimbursed. And forget about the loaner.

And yet again this makes zero argument for dealers. The same would have happened if Toyota themselves did the same thing. They make the cars, they fix the cars, the same level of expertise.

 

[Fern]

company-owned shops

is this a difficult concept to understand?

They're still dealerships. Is that hard to understand? The Op is specifically complaining about dealerships.

As far as the one company owning all of them, is it difficult to see where that leads? And I'm speaking to the many small businesses (dealerships) across the country that already exist. They'd be crushed out of business and taken over by the much larger manufacturers. I don't see how that's any improvement.

Why would anyone consumer care who owns the dealership? If you know him/her and don't like them, go to another one. Of course, if you don't like a dealership's policies you'll be SOL if the (one) company owns them all. Think complaints will matter then? I don't.

Fern

 

[Fern]

I don't get this enthusiasm for conglomeration of (local) dealerships; to have them owned by the big car manufacturers.

Why the love for 'monopolies'?

Fern

 

[OverVolt]

Probably because internal combustion engines require more maintenance than a battery pack and coil of copper?

 

[tynopik]

They're still dealerships. Is that hard to understand? The Op is specifically complaining about dealerships.

Bull Shit

He was comparing other car companies to Tesla. Obviously he saw a difference between Tesla's company stores and the dealerships of all other car companies.

As far as the one company owning all of them, is it difficult to see where that leads?

Lower prices, more consistent service and less sleaze?

They'd be crushed out of business and taken over by the much larger manufacturers.

good

I don't see how that's any improvement.

You must be the only one.

Why would anyone consumer care who owns the dealership?If you know him/her and don't like them, go to another one.

I have to ask: Are you really this clueless or are you just trolling?

Of course, if you don't like a dealership's policies you'll be SOL if the (one) company owns them all. Think complaints will matter then? I don't.

Is there only one car manufacturer around? If you don't like Chevy's policies, go buy a Ford. Or a Chrysler. Or a Honda. Or a Toyota. Or a Fiat. Or a Mini. Or a Kia. Or a Hyundai. Or a Tesla. Or a BMW.

 

[tynopik]

I don't get this enthusiasm for conglomeration of (local) dealerships; to have them owned by the big car manufacturers.

Why the love for 'monopolies'?

Because too many local dealers are total slimeballs. Having a consistent corporate policy is a good thing.

Because dealers are the definition of middlemen, existing to suck more money out of you. The manufacturer has to make a profit on the car and then the dealer has to make a profit on the sale. If the manufacturer owned the entire sales chain, they could sell the same car for less and still make the same profit.

 

[Belegost]

Because too many local dealers are total slimeballs. Having a consistent corporate policy is a good thing.

Because dealers are the definition of middlemen, existing to suck more money out of you. The manufacturer has to make a profit on the car and then the dealer has to make a profit on the sale. If the manufacturer owned the entire sales chain, they could sell the same car for less and still make the same profit.

This.

Independent retailers make sense when they provide a service to the customer that could not be served through direct manufacturer sales. For instance the grocery store; it would be very inconvenient to need to go to 20 different manufacturer stores to buy the ingredients for dinner, by aggregating the products from different manufacturers into one location the grocer provides convenience to customers, and hence earns their profit.

However, I can't find a service an independent auto dealer provides that a direct manufacturer sales/service outlet could not provide. A manufacturer center would be able to staff knowledgeable salespeople, would be able to provide financing options, would be able to provide post-sales service including repairs.

So what value does the independent dealer add that makes them worth their profit?

 

[WaTaGuMp]

who else is gonna up sell you on the undercoating and fake plastic wooden shift knob?

There are plenty of places to get custom accessories. Head to Pep Boys, you can get chrome naked ladies for your mud flaps, flame stickers and even Turbo emblems for cars that don't even have a Turbo.

 

[ElFenix]

Because too many local dealers are total slimeballs. Having a consistent corporate policy is a good thing.

Because dealers are the definition of middlemen, existing to suck more money out of you. The manufacturer has to make a profit on the car and then the dealer has to make a profit on the sale. If the manufacturer owned the entire sales chain, they could sell the same car for less and still make the same profit.

The price isn't going to be much, if any, lower - it's already the market clearing price and the retailer business has significant costs of capital.

 

[Brovane]

I don't get this enthusiasm for conglomeration of (local) dealerships; to have them owned by the big car manufacturers.

Why the love for 'monopolies'?

Fern

How is it a monopoly? You could still choose between different car manufacturers. Do you even know the definition of a monopoly? Let me help you - Monopoly the exclusive possession or control of the supply or trade in a commodity or service. The commodity is a car.

 

[OverVolt]

I suppose also because of factory defects. Gas powered cars have way more moving parts in them. So the big manufacturers pawn that customer service problem off on dealerships.

 

[TridenT]

Tesla is thought to produce/sell about 18,000-20,000 vehicles per years.

The others produce/sell many millions.

Stop and think a minute how Ford, GM etc would operate without dealers given their huge numbers.

What works for boutique auto manufacturer isn't going to work for them.

Where the h3ll are they going to keep an inventory of millions of cars?

How will people be given access to all their models for test drives etc.?

How would they process the millions of state registrations or license plate applications etc.

How would recalls and warranty services be done without dealers?

Silly comparison and if Tesla weren't so tiny they'd have dealers too.

I bought my last vehicle (Toyota Taco) the same way people buy Tesla's: I ordered it online. So, IMO, this whole line of discussion is moot unless one is a fanboi of the Tesla company itself. In all 50 states Tesla's can be purchased online. The primary difference is that Tesla wants to own dealerships. The very dealerships you seem to dislike.

This isn't really about stopping Tesla, it's about stopping the big auto makers from gobbling up existing dealerships. It's about protecting small businesses from big business.

Fern

Ok.

Ok.

They'd operate just fine. They don't need private dealerships to sell their cars. They can run their own storefront business just like Tesla does. (FFS, they run their own major commercials then they can run their own shitty storefronts too)

On their manufacturer storefront and/or they can do what Tesla does... just ship the customer their car when it's done. (Oh, btw, you do know that manufacturers have fucking huge lots where they store thousands to tens of thousands of cars right?)

Again, your premise is flawed. You assume no storefront exists. Tesla has a storefront, they have repair/maintenance facilities. They don't have as many as other manufacturers because they're a relatively uncommon car. (You know, just like any other exotic car???)

LOLOLOLOLOL, Are you fucking kidding me? Ever heard of the DMV?

Again, storefronts. You're assuming no storefront whatsoever. Besides, you can do a recall without a storefront. Go to a auto repair shop. They can replace the part. Manufacturer pays the cost and supplies the part.

There is no need for a private dealership at this point (It's incorrect terminology to even call what I am talking about a dealership anyway. It's just a storefront for the manufacturer. In the same way that Apple has its Apple Stores and Microsoft has its Microsoft Stores. What you want is there to be "Mac Stores" because you just think, "HOW WILL THEY EVER SUPPLY ALL THIS SHIT DIRECTLY? IT'S IMPOSSIBLE WITHOUT A MIDDLE MAN!"). I don't buy cars from dealerships specifically because they're a PITA and they're middlemen. In general, they do poor work on car repairs, make you pay way too much, and are very sleazy.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Ok.

Ok.

They'd operate just fine. They don't need private dealerships to sell their cars. They can run their own storefront business just like Tesla does. (FFS, they run their own major commercials then they can run their own shitty storefronts too)

On their manufacturer storefront and/or they can do what Tesla does... just ship the customer their car when it's done. (Oh, btw, you do know that manufacturers have fucking huge lots where they store thousands to tens of thousands of cars right?)

Again, your premise is flawed. You assume no storefront exists. Tesla has a storefront, they have repair/maintenance facilities. They don't have as many as other manufacturers because they're a relatively uncommon car. (You know, just like any other exotic car???)

LOLOLOLOLOL, Are you fucking kidding me? Ever heard of the DMV?

Again, storefronts. You're assuming no storefront whatsoever. Besides, you can do a recall without a storefront. Go to a auto repair shop. They can replace the part. Manufacturer pays the cost and supplies the part.

There is no need for a private dealership at this point (It's incorrect terminology to even call what I am talking about a dealership anyway. It's just a storefront for the manufacturer. In the same way that Apple has its Apple Stores and Microsoft has its Microsoft Stores. What you want is there to be "Mac Stores" because you just think, "HOW WILL THEY EVER SUPPLY ALL THIS SHIT DIRECTLY? IT'S IMPOSSIBLE WITHOUT A MIDDLE MAN!"). I don't buy cars from dealerships specifically because they're a PITA and they're middlemen. In general, they do poor work on car repairs, make you pay way too much, and are very sleazy.

/facepalm The stupidity in this thread is sad.

 

[tential]

But who was choice?

 

[rh71]

dealerships are fine, as long as no salesmen are allowed to sell. Even if you know your numbers and did your research they will still try to scam you out of some money.

 

[mikeford]

Dealers have paid off politicians for years, and have no organized opposition, so don't expect to see dealers bypassed any time soon. If anything government has become more anticonsumer in the last two decades siding against consumers in price fixing, copy protection, and monopolies.

 

[Sonikku]

Additionally, they employ a ton of people both directly and indirectly and in good paying jobs. But that doesn't seem to be very important to many people these days.

What do you have against capitalism? What are ya, a nanny state socialist?