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Why should we bring children into the world?

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,812
192
106
I thought about putting this in off topic, but since the discussion will revolve around the current political situation, I decided to put it here.

If we go back 100, 200, 500, 1000 years we had rampant disease, periodic starvation, wars,,, and people still reproduced.

Today, we live in an oppressive society that is overly regulated.

The US is deep in debt, and has no solution in sight.

Seems every nation and their brother and sister has nuclear weapons.

Cost of living has outpaces wages.

With all of this and more, why would anyone want to bring a child into the world?

Even basic stuff, such as home ownership is a fading dream for most people.

College education cost a fortune.

There was once a time when a person could finish high school, then go to work in a shipyard, steel mill, car factory,, and earn a good living. But those days are far behind us.

Why would I want to bring a child into the world, only to watch that child struggle with college, struggle to buy a home, struggle to find a job,,,.

As humanity progresses, shouldn't things get easier? Shouldn't getting an education get cheaper and easier? Shouldn't owning a home get cheaper and easier? Its as if humanity reached a pinnacle in the 1970s, and it was downhill from there.

Wages have stagnated since the 1990s, while cost of living has skyrocketed, especially the cost of home ownership.
 
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Todd33

Diamond Member
Oct 16, 2003
7,842
2
81
Biological imperative. People don't "choose" to have children, they are hardwired to do and rationalize it like it is a choice.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,812
192
106
Biological imperative. People don't "choose" to have children, they are hardwired to do and rationalize it like it is a choice.
We are not dogs or cats that breed without thought, well some people do.

Humans in general are supposed to be able to think past tomorrow. With a good deal of our economy based off the housing market and the stock market, what are people supposed to do for jobs?

I know lots of people who made a conscience decision not to have children. Two guys I went to school with, we lived like 4 streets apart were both married, and never had children. There are lots of people I went to school with that never had kids. I work with 3 women that never had kids.
 
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IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
61,140
13,984
136
The short answer is "we shouldn't", too many people already.

<snip>
Today, we live in an oppressive society that is overly regulated.
Oh please. :rolleyes: You are still pretty much free to do whatever you want as long as you respect the rights of those around you. The US is still a free society.
The US is deep in debt, and has no solution in sight.
The solution is to kill your grandparents, not to avoid having children.
Seems every nation and their brother and sister has nuclear weapons.
Good, they're are an effective deterrent to all out war.
Cost of living has outpaces wages.
So unionize and vote your interests. The rich don't just give it away.
Even basic stuff, such as home ownership is a fading dream for most people.
The housing market is rebalancing with housing prices falling to come closer to median income affordability. Median income is stagnant as the rich keep the benefits of improved worker productivity to themselves. Again, workers have to fight for what they want.
College education cost a fortune.
College financing has become a scam. Legislatures have abandoned the public universities to the loan sharks. The universities have abandoned their missions to seek enrichment for their administrators and faculty at the expense of the students. Until voters decide to do something about it, the system will continue to bloat until it fails.
There was once a time when a person could finish high school, then go to work in a shipyard, steel mill, car factory,, and earn a good living. But those days are far behind us.
Protectionism worked. It just didn't work for the right people. With strong unions pushing politicians to maintain tariffs Americans enjoyed better wages. Once the workers forgot how they got the benefits they did and allowed the unions to fade the rich bought up the politicians and we got international labor arbitrage and a death spiral for American wages.
Why would I want to bring a child into the world, only to watch that child struggle with college, struggle to buy a home, struggle to find a job,,,.
Don't cry. Organize!
As humanity progresses, shouldn't things get easier? Shouldn't getting an education get cheaper and easier? Shouldn't owning a home get cheaper and easier?
The rich stole the American dream and the workers helped them do it. Vote your interests, not your fears, and certainly not your hatreds.
 

Todd33

Diamond Member
Oct 16, 2003
7,842
2
81
We are not dogs or cats that breed without thought, well some people do.

Humans in general are supposed to be able to think past tomorrow. With a good deal of our economy based off the housing market and the stock market, what are people supposed to do for jobs?
People, especially women, who decide to not have children are rare, no matter what what economic circumstances. We are driven to want kids, not just have sex. Most of the "thought" is just rationalizing the biology which is the ghost in the machine. Free will is not so free.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,368
740
126
One shouldn't, family planning and contraceptive should be mandatory. People should need permit to have babies, unless you can prove that you can take care of it financially and provide a stable family, then you do not get permit and after your 1st mistake you should be castrated. Having babies to make money or having babies and then trowing them at the mercy of social services should be a crime punishable by death.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
2,038
23
81
Its really not a question to ask Americans or other Westerners: Population growth in the West is negative, people are having to few kids in the west as it is. The places that should answer that question is the 3rd world where 9 kids is as standard as having 1 or 2 kids are here. And those are the places that are propping up our declining population with immigration, if we really want the population to stabalize and for the environment to last...Then ask the 3rd world why its ok to have 7-10 kids per family when the world is already overpopulated.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,812
192
106
Its really not a question to ask Americans or other Westerners: Population growth in the West is negative, people are having to few kids in the west as it is. The places that should answer that question is the 3rd world where 9 kids is as standard as having 1 or 2 kids are here. And those are the places that are propping up our declining population with immigration to, if we really want the population to stabalize and for the environment to last...Then ask the 3rd world.
One sad fact, the poor are outbreeding the middle class and the rich.

For the middle class and the rich its an economic advantage to only have one, maybe two children. The cost of daycare, clothing, school supplies,,, plays a factor in planning how many children the couple will have.

For the poor, its an economic advantage to has as many kids as possible. The more children the family has, the more benefits they draw.
 
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DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,368
740
126
Its really not a question to ask Americans or other Westerners: Population growth in the West is negative, people are having to few kids in the west as it is. The places that should answer that question is the 3rd world where 9 kids is as standard as having 1 or 2 kids are here. And those are the places that are propping up our declining population with immigration, if we really want the population to stabalize and for the environment to last...Then ask the 3rd world why its ok to have 7-10 kids per family when the world is already overpopulated.
Its a matter of quality not quantity. The reason why BHO was elected president and will be again this year is not a good one.
 

utahraptor

Senior member
Apr 26, 2004
919
13
81
It depends if think humanity has a future that is bright or dim. If you believe that some day we will have a Star Trek like utopia then it is the current generations job to suffer through and pop out children who may some day make the technology to get there a reality. If you believe that our future is apocalyptic then you should not have children.
 

Hugo Drax

Diamond Member
Nov 20, 2011
5,649
47
91
Why do computers have EFI or Bios ROM?

Its part of the Human brain BIOS configuration, God is too lazy to press F2 and change the settings right now, he is having too much fun watching us act like fools.
 

Agent11

Diamond Member
Jan 22, 2006
3,535
1
0
Because it is your biological imperative and the most popular way of achieving immortality.

Also there is kind of a primal instinct involved. Like an animal marking it's territory. Only the territory is the human genome and the pungent musk is your DNA.
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,670
6
0
One sad fact, the poor are outbreeding the middle class and the rich.

For the middle class and the rich its an economic advantage to only have one, maybe two children. The cost of daycare, clothing, school supplies,,, plays a factor in planning how many children the couple will have.

For the poor, its an economic advantage to has as many kids as possible. The more children the family has, the more benefits they draw.
Plus you have to pay taxes to feed the children the poor produce, and incarcerate the ones the do a poor job of raising.

One shouldn't, family planning and contraceptive should be mandatory. People should need permit to have babies, unless you can prove that you can take care of it financially and provide a stable family, then you do not get permit and after your 1st mistake you should be castrated. Having babies to make money or having babies and then trowing them at the mercy of social services should be a crime punishable by death.
:thumbsup:
 
Feb 24, 2001
14,551
4
81
Children used to be assets. As soon as they were able, they were put to work. Tilling the field, making clothes, etc.

With industrialization and mass production, they are no longer needed. They have shifted from assets to liabilities. They no longer contribute to the household, only are an expense.

Just from a western financial perspective. Plus they are shit monsters.
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
I wonder how long someone brings "how eugenics and Hitler IS BAD OK" into the argument.

That said producing babies without the means of giving them a decent life is one of most unethical things to do, regardless of the appeals to tradition/emotion. I also remembered reading about how some hospital or fertility clinic in Canada that tried to make a HIV positive woman to conceive. Really? That is FVCKING disgusting.
 
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bononos

Diamond Member
Aug 21, 2011
3,718
68
91
I thought about putting this in off topic, but since the discussion will revolve around the current political situation, I decided to put it here.

If we go back 100, 200, 500, 1000 years we had rampant disease, periodic starvation, wars,,, and people still reproduced.

Today, we live in an oppressive society that is overly regulated.

The US is deep in debt, and has no solution in sight.

Seems every nation and their brother and sister has nuclear weapons.

Cost of living has outpaces wages.

With all of this and more, why would anyone want to bring a child into the world?

Even basic stuff, such as home ownership is a fading dream for most people.

College education cost a fortune.

There was once a time when a person could finish high school, then go to work in a shipyard, steel mill, car factory,, and earn a good living. But those days are far behind us.

Why would I want to bring a child into the world, only to watch that child struggle with college, struggle to buy a home, struggle to find a job,,,.

As humanity progresses, shouldn't things get easier? Shouldn't getting an education get cheaper and easier? Shouldn't owning a home get cheaper and easier? Its as if humanity reached a pinnacle in the 1970s, and it was downhill from there.

Wages have stagnated since the 1990s, while cost of living has skyrocketed, especially the cost of home ownership.
*Music from Dream is Collapsing*
 

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