why Rupublicans or Democats hate each other, or no?

[VladSlayer]

Greetings,

It - my first communication(connection) here (in the POLITICS AND NEWS), and I find these subjects very interesting. The disorder (confusion) which I feel, will be, why - there so a lot of hatred? In my country there is a lot of hatred in a policy(politics), but we have many bad people here, the big corruption, and the old problems which are coming back by times of Soviet Union.

I see many comments which suggest, that many do not think, that Democrats - real Americans, or - are traitors, or are afraid of the terrorist and want to surrender. Then there are many who speak it, Republicans hate cheerful people (I do not understand it, it reflects me, but it is good to anothers, well?), or want to kill all nice rare animals (nature), or to want to send all foreigners away now, or make the borrowing bigger for war (they also say the Republicans love the wartime). They also struggle about "the abortion", and a role the USA in a global policy(politics). But always, BIG hate, I think? Do I sense this correctly?

But a strange thing, that ALL, apparently, think ANOTHER - not the "REAL" AMERICAN. I explain my item? I confused, to be convinced. In Ukraine, even the bad spoiled (corrupt) person (man) of Ukraine - from Ukraine. It from the American immigrant - past?

I thank all for consideration of these questions. I only try difficultly to study. Please I regret about poor English language. I try difficultly, well?

Due to many friends, who explain (from "Private Message") terms, examples: "Dims" or "Halliburton" or "Bushies" or "New York Slimes" - I work for Ukraine newspaper - so amusing to me (but I do not do not) takes the sides, well?) - though I sometimes think that Bush not so good speaker. It is ok to tell?

Thanks for friends! Greetings!

Vladimir

 

[Forsythe]

I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Forsythe
I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

Yes but he does write better in English than most of us would in Ukranian!

 

[conjur]

Vlad, a lot of what you see, hear, and read is partisan politics: rhetoric and hyperbole flung from one side to the other and then back again. It's just a part of American politics and has been from the beginning and will always be here. Stereotypes and labels get applied in the hopes of winning support for one side over the other (for example, back in the late 80s, it became a theme of the Republicans to label the word "liberal" as something that was bad, you didn't want to be a "liberal" and it largely worked and has really stuck since then.)

The Democrats need to shed that stigma attached to the word and go back to their party's roots and shed the move toward the centrist line (Republican-lite). That will take a strong a Democratic leader which appears to be lacking at the moment which means the Republicans will likely retain control for a while (unless Americans wake up and realize they're being fed one line of propaganda after another and nothing of any real consequence is being done to better the life of the average American nor lower the massive amount of American debt nor move to alternative fuels nor protect the environment.)

Who knows what the future holds but one thing is clear, American politicians need to become willing to shed their corporate-whore status and worry about and focus on the people who actually voted them into office, not the corporations that funded their campaigns. And that goes for Republicans, Democrats, Green, Reform, etc.

 

[catnap1972]

Originally posted by: conjur

Who knows what the future holds but one thing is clear, American politicians need to become willing to shed their corporate-whore status and worry about and focus on the people who actually voted them into office, not the corporations that funded their campaigns. And that goes for Republicans, Democrats, Green, Reform, etc.

QFT

 

[Forsythe]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Forsythe
I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

Yes but he does write better in English than most of us would in Ukranian!

Good point!
I've even had scholling in Russian. For two years, and my russian doesn't even qualify as crap.

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: Forsythe

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Forsythe
I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

Yes but he does write better in English than most of us would in Ukranian!

Good point!
I've even had scholling in Russian. For two years, and my russian doesn't even qualify as crap.

Oh, it probably the good Russian, you humble, but sure it good!

Many "ATOT" THE anandtech friends, they say things in the Russian and make surprise on Vladimir! HO! Fun people.

About the politics things, here in UKRAINE, they say: "Long whiskers cannot take place of the brains." ALL Ukraine politics know this phrase. Good, ok?

Salutations!

Vladimir

 

[1EZduzit]

Hi Vlad.

I think the first thing you need to understand is that all Americans want what's best for America. The problem is that there is more then one way to get there and they want to go the way that they feel benifits them the most.

Take the deficit for example. America spent 20 years trying to get it's budget balanced. It was basically the Republican agenda and it was the issue that brought them into power. Then along comes our current Republican President and he wants tax cuts and these tax cuts benifit the wealthiest the most. Then he invades a country and that is costing us a ton of money that we don't have and it is running the debt up further. Still he wants tax cuts. Now Katrina comes along and the relief effort and reconstruction is going to run the budget deficit even higher, yet the Republican party still wants to cut taxes. They say that will be good for the economy??

I personaly disagree, but that is politics. Each side tries to convince each other that they are right and that is when you see the anger come to the surface. Generally, the Republicans want more of a capaitalistic society and the Democrats want more of a socialized society. Those 2 choices don't really represent the average American viewpoint the best, but right now we only have 2 viable parties in this country. That forces Americans to elect the "lesser of two evils" and that in and of itself creates a lot of the anger you see displayed when politics are discussed.

Hope that helps you understand us better.

 

[VladSlayer]

Red Dawn
I see this cinema, long years ago, GOOD! But Russians (I live Ukraine, but From Moscow when child), find cinema Red Dawn, not real - all Russians know the Cubans lazy and not inclined to the fight, so not help in real invasion of the Amerika!

Thanks!

Vladimir

 

[Tab]

I don't hate republicans or democrats, I just hate stupid people.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Forsythe
I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

Yes but he does write better in English than most of us would in Ukranian!

Having spent three years in Kiev and having taken Russian a couple hours each week, I can report that it is a difficult language. I will also say that Ukrainians are the kindest people on the face of the earth when it comes to being patient with non Ukrainian or Russian speakers. I shopped in Centralia, The Sposk, Mega Mart, the Podil market and many others. I shopped for produce, meat and Russian optical devices. Never was I treated as anything but a neighbor.

What the OP is missing is that in America, we pretty much split down the middle. For years, many here didn't know and could have cared less what the different parties stood for or didn't. Lately, with the onset of the opportunities to communicate given us by technology, we are having a great time defining our differences across a very large playing field. Differences that were once hardly understood now stand in stark relief and become larger than life issues. Like Conjur said, Americans have always done that, but I add that we never had such a fine tool, to do it with in the past. Ukraine is grappling with a totally new world of responsibility and has numerous parties that represent the varying views of its citizens. Here, we pretty much have settled into one trench or the other and only crawl out if someone threatens all of us. In the former Soviet Union, such discourse was pretty much discourages. Ukraine became independent in 1992. They have come a great distance in a few short years and have made incredible progress!

Vladimir, welcome to the fray and take anything posted by a liberal with a grain of salt. Not the salt and bread welcome to my home kind, but the what are you really saying kind. In Ukraine?s current state of development, liberal ideas are going to seem awfully inviting. The old authoriterian concepts of the Soviet are what you are trying to move from. I think that we have overshot here in the last 30 to 40 years and may have to move back just a little bit, but it won't be much.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Originally posted by: Forsythe

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Forsythe
I'm afraid to say that this is a fairly hard post to read. But i didn't really try that hard
Besides, being in this forum actively is sure to improve your english.

Yes but he does write better in English than most of us would in Ukranian!

Good point!
I've even had scholling in Russian. For two years, and my russian doesn't even qualify as crap.

Oh, it probably the good Russian, you humble, but sure it good!

Many "ATOT" THE anandtech friends, they say things in the Russian and make surprise on Vladimir! HO! Fun people.

About the politics things, here in UKRAINE, they say: "Long whiskers cannot take place of the brains." ALL Ukraine politics know this phrase. Good, ok?

Salutations!

Vladimir

Sometimes new thoughts can't take the place of long, bitter experience. The gray beard concept is one of long, bitter experience. If it didn't work forty years ago and won't work now, why repeat bad history. When your kids are looking at this new idea of communism in 2040 and you tell them it isn't such a good idea, they will say "Long whiskers cannot take the place of the brains." You have to remember that those whiskers got so long because of the brains and the ability to use them to survive. They also tell pregnant women to eat white clay to help the baby. Never understood that one.

Dobra Vecha!

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Hi Vlad.

I think the first thing you need to understand is that all Americans want what's best for America. The problem is that there is more then one way to get there and they want to go the way that they feel benifits them the most.

Take the deficit for example. America spent 20 years trying to get it's budget balanced. It was basically the Republican agenda and it was the issue that brought them into power. Then along comes our current Republican President and he wants tax cuts and these tax cuts benifit the wealthiest the most. Then he invades a country and that is costing us a ton of money that we don't have and it is running the debt up further. Still he wants tax cuts. Now Katrina comes along and the relief effort and reconstruction is going to run the budget deficit even higher, yet the Republican party still wants to cut taxes. They say that will be good for the economy??

I personaly disagree, but that is politics. Each side tries to convince each other that they are right and that is when you see the anger come to the surface. Generally, the Republicans want more of a capaitalistic society and the Democrats want more of a socialized society. Those 2 choices don't really represent the average American viewpoint the best, but right now we only have 2 viable parties in this country. That forces Americans to elect the "lesser of two evils" and that in and of itself creates a lot of the anger you see displayed when politics are discussed.

Hope that helps you understand us better.

OK.

bUT disorder:
Americans want best for America
Debt bad for America, yes?
EDIT: i FIX: Why (NOT) ALL American want NO debt? Why less taxation assesment?

AND, you say (I know you help, thankS!), but confused on:
"Each side tries to convince each other that they are right and that is when you see the anger come to the surface."
OK, but why anger? I make example: I have problem with neighbor, because we no agree border to our property. So I say "Yuri, you dumb, traitor! You don't know what that is, stupid!?"
NO! I speak to him, "Yuri, friend, there confusion, you come to dinner, we make good, ok? HOw Dimitri (I pretend, don't know this Yuri, but in example Dimitri his son), how woman? I hear loud noise other night, you still strong man, like Bull! How to stay so young, must make public this great secret!" So Yuri feel good, he say later, ok, Vladimir, we fix border, it ok.

I see shouting words, and angry, but where "persuasion (correct word?)"?

If they say to me, Vladimir, you answer the question instead of using idiotic side remarks to dodge it." or "Vladimir, you are such a fvcking troll." or "Vladimir, What would you be b!tching about if GWB was not in control? Cause lord knows you'd all still be b!tchin." - I don't make feel cooperation and kindness to neighbor. I make these example from REAL communications here (AT). But you understand? People make expectation of persuasion like this?

I don't know.

Thanks friends! Come speak, Vladimir and other friends (your friends, sure!) in "OT" - we have funny communications there, not serious like here. One good one about what happen when no toilet paper, but they take away, too bad talk. But good communications now about "why woman go with old man" and "Two twins and you..." - this REALLY funny!

Welcome, and thanks!


Vladimir!

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Hi Vlad.

I think the first thing you need to understand is that all Americans want what's best for America. The problem is that there is more then one way to get there and they want to go the way that they feel benifits them the most.

Take the deficit for example. America spent 20 years trying to get it's budget balanced. It was basically the Republican agenda and it was the issue that brought them into power. Then along comes our current Republican President and he wants tax cuts and these tax cuts benifit the wealthiest the most. Then he invades a country and that is costing us a ton of money that we don't have and it is running the debt up further. Still he wants tax cuts. Now Katrina comes along and the relief effort and reconstruction is going to run the budget deficit even higher, yet the Republican party still wants to cut taxes. They say that will be good for the economy??

I personaly disagree, but that is politics. Each side tries to convince each other that they are right and that is when you see the anger come to the surface. Generally, the Republicans want more of a capaitalistic society and the Democrats want more of a socialized society. Those 2 choices don't really represent the average American viewpoint the best, but right now we only have 2 viable parties in this country. That forces Americans to elect the "lesser of two evils" and that in and of itself creates a lot of the anger you see displayed when politics are discussed.

Hope that helps you understand us better.

OK.

bUT disorder:
Americans want best for America
Debt bad for America, yes?
EDIT: i FIX: Why (NOT) ALL American want NO debt? Why less taxation assesment?

AND, you say (I know you help, thankS!), but confused on:
"Each side tries to convince each other that they are right and that is when you see the anger come to the surface."
OK, but why anger? I make example: I have problem with neighbor, because we no agree border to our property. So I say "Yuri, you dumb, traitor! You don't know what that is, stupid!?"
NO! I speak to him, "Yuri, friend, there confusion, you come to dinner, we make good, ok? HOw Dimitri (I pretend, don't know this Yuri, but in example Dimitri his son), how woman? I hear loud noise other night, you still strong man, like Bull! How to stay so young, must make public this great secret!" So Yuri feel good, he say later, ok, Vladimir, we fix border, it ok.

I see shouting words, and angry, but where "persuasion (correct word?)"?

If they say to me, Vladimir, you answer the question instead of using idiotic side remarks to dodge it." or "Vladimir, you are such a fvcking troll." or "Vladimir, What would you be b!tching about if GWB was not in control? Cause lord knows you'd all still be b!tchin." - I don't make feel cooperation and kindness to neighbor. I make these example from REAL communications here (AT). But you understand? People make expectation of persuasion like this?

I don't know.

Thanks friends! Come speak, Vladimir and other friends (your friends, sure!) in "OT" - we have funny communications there, not serious like here. One good one about what happen when no toilet paper, but they take away, too bad talk. But good communications now about "why woman go with old man" and "Two twins and you..." - this REALLY funny!

Welcome, and thanks!


Vladimir!

I was amazed that on Krashatic street, on thee weekends, everyone drinks beer and vodka. They do that all day, the street is open to pedestrian only traffic on the weekends. Never a fight! Never even witnessed an argument. That was amazing! We are not nearly so meek and most of us wouldn't want to be.

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: Condor
When your kids are looking at this new idea of communism in 2040 and you tell them it isn't such a good idea, they will say "Long whiskers cannot take the place of the brains."
Dobra Vecha!

HO! Big truth!

????????????! ???????!

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: Condor
I was amazed that on Krashatic street, on thee weekends, everyone drinks beer and vodka. They do that all day, the street is open to pedestrian only traffic on the weekends. Never a fight! Never even witnessed an argument. That was amazing! We are not nearly so meek and most of us wouldn't want to be.

RUSSIAN PROVERB: First vodka goes as the stake, second as the falcon, and third as the little bird.

Yes, good funny people here. We have good fun, yes?

Thank you.

Vladimir

 

[Forsythe]

Vlad, you have to be one of the best members of P&N i have ever seen.

 

[1EZduzit]

Americans want best for America
Debt bad for America, yes?
Why ALL American want NO debt? Why less taxation assesment?

Who likes owing money?? Who likes paying taxes?? Nobody, but we all like spending money though don't we.

I see shouting words, and angry, but where "persuasion (correct word?)"?

Good point. America IS a capitalistic society and almost everyone is selling something. If people aren't buying what your selling, you tend to get frustrated.

I make these example from REAL communications here (AT). But you understand? People make expectation of persuasion like this?

Some people do that pretty regularly. Part of the problem is that the regulars know each other well enough to know which side of the issue they are on. Part of it is just people's ego's. Part of it is people taking themselves too seriously.

I personally believe that to avoid dissapointment late in life, the best thing to do is fail young.

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Americans want best for America
Debt bad for America, yes?
Why ALL American want NO debt? Why less taxation assesment?

Who likes owing money?? Who likes paying taxes?? Nobody, but we all like spending money though don't we.

Yes, sorry, I make the edit late, mean, "Why NOT ALL American want NO debt? Why (they want) less taxation assesment? (which makes the more debt?)
Some Americans say, oh, debt ok, or debt not make important, yes? Some think not bad, right? But here, we have BAD debt, and everyone agree, debt VERY bad for economy (of course, Americans make HUGE economy, so they know). I just curious, if ok, or no?

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Originally posted by: Condor
When your kids are looking at this new idea of communism in 2040 and you tell them it isn't such a good idea, they will say "Long whiskers cannot take the place of the brains."
Dobra Vecha!

HO! Big truth!

????????????! ???????!

The cyrillic alphabet was the part that I really never could get about Russkie. Sorry, I tried. I had to accept the fact that I am not a linguist.

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Yes, sorry, I make the edit late, mean, "Why NOT ALL American want NO debt? Why (they want) less taxation assesment? (which makes the more debt?)
Some Americans say, oh, debt ok, or debt not make important, yes? Some think not bad, right? But here, we have BAD debt, and everyone agree, debt VERY bad for economy (of course, Americans make HUGE economy, so they know). I just curious, if ok, or no?

I think most Americans don't want huge debt. That is the ironic part of our current political situation. The GOP party who came into power under Reagan calling for a balanced budget is now the party running up a huge national debt and still wants to eliminate and reduce taxes. They have control of the goverment and they are spending money like someone who knows they are dying and want to have as much fun as they can until their credit card is cancelled.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Originally posted by: Condor
I was amazed that on Krashatic street, on thee weekends, everyone drinks beer and vodka. They do that all day, the street is open to pedestrian only traffic on the weekends. Never a fight! Never even witnessed an argument. That was amazing! We are not nearly so meek and most of us wouldn't want to be.

RUSSIAN PROVERB: First vodka goes as the stake, second as the falcon, and third as the little bird.

Yes, good funny people here. We have good fun, yes?

Thank you.

Vladimir

Oh yes! Every Saturday, I go to see Sasha in Centralia market. He always has vodka and radishes and sausage. I have to have at least three vodkas. You know that having only one is taboo, two is an even numbner and is not allowed and you can bow out gracefully on the third. The issue was that the glasses were pretty big and I usually was driving! The vodka and radishes were great, the sausage not so much. Good times and excellent people. Most Americans don't realize that much of our pedigree comes from that part of the world. I didn't until I walked the streets of Kiev and realized just how Ukrainian most Americans look.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: VladSlayer

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Americans want best for America
Debt bad for America, yes?
Why ALL American want NO debt? Why less taxation assesment?

Who likes owing money?? Who likes paying taxes?? Nobody, but we all like spending money though don't we.

Yes, sorry, I make the edit late, mean, "Why NOT ALL American want NO debt? Why (they want) less taxation assesment? (which makes the more debt?)
Some Americans say, oh, debt ok, or debt not make important, yes? Some think not bad, right? But here, we have BAD debt, and everyone agree, debt VERY bad for economy (of course, Americans make HUGE economy, so they know). I just curious, if ok, or no?

See, the real deal is that both parties spend like fools. The argument is about what the money is spent on. Democrats want it spent on social programs and Republicans want it spent on strength. Whe Democrats who want it spent on society, need more, they just take it through taxes and give a little less back. They call that balanceing the budget. Republicans spend it on military and science. They are pretty disgusted with our very capitalistic juices being taxed away, so they lower taxes to increase commerce and figure the payoff is that there are more jobs and less need for social programs. Couple that with the fact that liberals seem to have no concept of economics and you get a lot of confusion on that side. The fact is that economics is such a huge field that no one knows it very well at all. Both perspectives are probably equally correct, just time will have to pass before we know for sure. The variables change daily. Economics of the 1800's don't work today and todays economics won't work in 3010.

 

[Deudalus]

Yes, sorry, I make the edit late, mean, "Why NOT ALL American want NO debt? Why (they want) less taxation assesment? (which makes the more debt?)

The less money you take from people via taxes the more money people have.

The more money people have the more money people spend.

If you send the government a check they make money. If you spend money at a store the government also makes money.

People with common sense realize that spending money at a store, to buy a product, to drive the economy, which leads to more jobs, and those people filling those new jobs spending their new found money, which all indirectly goes to the government; is much better for our economy than simply sending the government your money and hoping they do the right thing with it.

 

[VladSlayer]

Originally posted by: Condor
I didn't until I walked the streets of Kiev and realized just how Ukrainian most Americans look.

Ho! Except for the cow woman! We have some good woman, but all go to Paris, or the New York model business. Or they marry the fat old rich man. But for me, there is only the cows! I do have fantasy about the Prime Minister, Yulia Tymoshenko (actually she fired thursday, but you understand, yes?).

This is good looking Ukraine woman! I know, that I would have date with she if it ever asked me (but certainly, I - only the timeworker in the small newspaper, it impossible to go with the power olden sexual women, yes). I would like to tell sometime very much my imagination with the Prime minister and sectretary, Natascha (I do not know the name of secretary, I only have made, it up to does my imagination of more real). In imagination of imagination I am a real journalist (not just labor worker at newspaper), which goes to take interview from the Prime minister, and to me speaks sectretary to wait. It late in the afternoon. When Yulia leaves, she speaks secretary, please no more purposes today, I would like to speak with a Vladimir private.

Natascha speaks, Yulia, you are very intense, you would like me to wipe shoulders for you while you speak interview? Yulia speaks, yes that very good idea. As I start to ask Yulias questions of the formal education, in Soviet times, and about entry in politics, then Natascha ??????????? shoulders, and Yulia become very softened. As Natascha begins ????????????? front (there is tightness in a breast), I hear, that small whipsers of pleasure, silent as the mouse would make. She does not want that I know, that she is wakened, but I can see awakening through Yulia's blouse! Wow!

Well, you understand, that I feel awakening also, and a fast impulse beside! What calls to ask in question? The disorder! I am upset and should make a pause of interview? Natascha speak, Vladimir, you would like, that I have wiped shoulders also? Breath is difficult that what? Wow!!!!!!!!!!

I regret, very mad work, well will proceed later? It is a pity, it is good? Then on Friday in the afternoon Yulia, she declared herself the candidate of opposition to the president, Victor Yushchenko, and now things are really mad.

We have been borrowed all ?????? with changing news, you understand?

I come back soon friends to P&N.

Good relations to all.

Vladimir