Why oh why are people so damn stupid?

[Amused]

On the Discovery Home and Leisure channel they are talking about metal homes.

The guy is claiming using wood depletes natural resources.



When was the last time you saw someone grow a metal tree?

Why is it the very real fact that the vast majority of our wood is farmed, renewable, and is depleting nothing is not known by the majority, nor is it spoken of on stupid shows like this? Why is it the fact that we have more trees in the US today than we did 200 years ago never is exposed on these damn shows?

Now I'm not saying metal homes aren't a good idea. (they're more expensive, but they don't get termites). I'm just pissed at the amount of misinformation out there.

This reminds me of the time I heard Al Gore claim water is a nonrenewable resource.

If you tell a lie often enough, people will believe it...

 

[erikiksaz]

What about rubber? I remember seeing a tv show where houses were being built from car tires. I figgur it would keep the house cool/warm when it needs it most.

 

[hoihtah]

the most environment safe way to build a house is how the eskimos do it.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: erikiksaz
What about rubber? I remember seeing a tv show where houses were being built from car tires. I figgur it would keep the house cool/warm when it needs it most.

Have you ever seen a tire yard fire?

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: hoihtah
the most environment safe way to build a house is how the eskimos do it.

I tried that. I ended up homeless every spring.

 

[shiner]

Stupidity is a renewable resource

 

[Wallydraigle]

Think of all the energy it takes to produce the metal needed to build a house. That energy has to come from somewhere. All the coal fumes from your metal house going into the air can't be good. And if it's under insulated it costs more to heat and cool. If you think about it log homes are probably the most efficient way of constructing a home without using up resources. Or those sod houses, but you would still have to build a structure inside it I guess. It would be well insulated though. Caves still use no resources to build

 

[LongCoolMother]

we here in california wouldnt want a metal house. when the earthquakes come...we will be in big doodoo.

 

[HiveMaster]

Why is it the very real fact that the vast majority of our wood is farmed, renewable, and is depleting nothing is not known by the majority, nor is it spoken of on stupid shows like this? Why is it the fact that we have more trees in the US today than we did 200 years ago never is exposed on these damn shows?

Yeah and we have more Indians than we did 200 years ago so why do people talk about the bad white man wiping out Indians?

Jesus, another Rush clone spouting nonsense.

200 years ago, we had rich, diversified forests with trees hundreds of years old, all part of a rich ecoculture. Now we have row planting, tiny, young trees, and a simplified forest ecosystem that supports far fewer species, due to clear cut logging over the last 75 years.

Your thinking goes straight to the great conservative lies being told: we have more trees than ever before (but the forests are now crap due to clear cutting), we have more indians than we did before (indians made up 100 percent of the population, and we killed off 90% of them and put the rest in "reservations"), we have more jobs than we ever did before (but most of them pay little better than minimum wage and in 2002 more adults than ever work more than one job to make ends meet).

The easiest way to tell a lie is to say an incomplete truth. Rush is great at that. You should be a better person than that.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: HiveMaster

Why is it the very real fact that the vast majority of our wood is farmed, renewable, and is depleting nothing is not known by the majority, nor is it spoken of on stupid shows like this? Why is it the fact that we have more trees in the US today than we did 200 years ago never is exposed on these damn shows?

Yeah and we have more Indians than we did 200 years ago so why do people talk about the bad white man wiping out Indians?

Jesus, another Rush clone spouting nonsense.

200 years ago, we had rich, diversified forests with trees hundreds of years old, all part of a rich ecoculture. Now we have row planting, tiny, young trees, and a simplified forest ecosystem that supports far fewer species, due to clear cut logging over the last 75 years.

Your thinking goes straight to the great conservative lies being told: we have more trees than ever before (but the forests are now crap due to clear cutting), we have more indians than we did before (indians made up 100 percent of the population, and we killed off 90% of them and put the rest in "reservations"), we have more jobs than we ever did before (but most of them pay little better than minimum wage and in 2002 more adults than ever work more than one job to make ends meet).

The easiest way to tell a lie is to say an incomplete truth. Rush is great at that. You should be a better person than that.

Whine whine whine. I can't do anything about old growth areas that are gone. But what I CAN do is dispell the myth that even a signifigant minority of our wood products come from old growth trees. A very tiny minority comes from old growth.

The fact remains that wood IS a renewable resourse and does NOT deplete natural resourses. Mining metal, on the other hand, DOES deplete natural resources. That was my point... but of course, you were too blinded by your political agenda to see that.

 

[Wallydraigle]

Originally posted by: HiveMaster

Why is it the very real fact that the vast majority of our wood is farmed, renewable, and is depleting nothing is not known by the majority, nor is it spoken of on stupid shows like this? Why is it the fact that we have more trees in the US today than we did 200 years ago never is exposed on these damn shows?

Yeah and we have more Indians than we did 200 years ago so why do people talk about the bad white man wiping out Indians?

Jesus, another Rush clone spouting nonsense.

200 years ago, we had rich, diversified forests with trees hundreds of years old, all part of a rich ecoculture. Now we have row planting, tiny, young trees, and a simplified forest ecosystem that supports far fewer species, due to clear cut logging over the last 75 years.

Your thinking goes straight to the great conservative lies being told: we have more trees than ever before (but the forests are now crap due to clear cutting), we have more indians than we did before (indians made up 100 percent of the population, and we killed off 90% of them and put the rest in "reservations"), we have more jobs than we ever did before (but most of them pay little better than minimum wage and in 2002 more adults than ever work more than one job to make ends meet).

The easiest way to tell a lie is to say an incomplete truth. Rush is great at that. You should be a better person than that.

I don't know why you brought the Indians into a thread about metal housing, but that's true about the old growth trees supporting more biological diversity. It's also true that younger trees filter more polution from the air and do the good things that trees do. There's no reason why there can't be a balance between young and old trees. Most of the trees we use today come from farms, and not old growth forests. There's no good reason to cut down old growth trees nowadays. We still have vast wilderness areas. I believe we have more wilderness than Africa even. The problem is that wilderness areas are so far from where people live (and that's why they're wilderness areas) so it seems like there are none. We're doing okay, I think. We can't have our cars and computers and digital cameras and everything else we enjoy in our modern society, and still live in a lush and pristine forest. More people are growing more conscious of the value of old growth forests.

 

[HiveMaster]

Recycled metal now comprises a large portion of metal products sold in this country. Don't try to tell me that once you create a tin can, that tin is gone forever.

And if you know the difference between mature forests and "tree farms," you understand why saying "we have more trees here than 200 years ago" is at best, horrible spin.

I do not KNOW we are not harvesting mature forest trees. How do you know this?

 

[Wallydraigle]

Another thing, much of the coal that goes into producing steel for metal homes comes from strip mines. Maybe you've never seen a strip mine, but I've spent a lot of time in them. It's a big hole in the ground. Nothing grows there. Even in the desert there can be quite a bit of life, but strip mines are barren. Stripped land won't heal for thousands of years. Even if it's reclaimed the ground is worthless for most anything. Even clear cutting is better than strip mining. It's awful.

 

[Wallydraigle]

You don't get it. Even to recycle metal it still takes vast amounts of energy, mainly from coal.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: lirion
You don't get it. Even to recycle metal it still takes vast amounts of energy, mainly from coal.

NOt always the case.
Aluminum takes alot less energy to recycle than to start with raw bauxite *sp*

 

[Wallydraigle]

You still have to burn coal to recycle. You have to clear land to get the coal. Sure, it's better to recycle than to start from scratch, but it still takes energy. If you're clearing land to get the coal to produce metal, why not skip a step and just use the wood instead? At least then you can plant more trees on it. Stripped land will be worthless for the future of the human race. It's the same argument vegetarians use. It's more efficient to use the land to farm trees, over and over again, than to mine coal, once.

 

[JellyBaby]

we have more trees than ever before (but the forests are now crap due to clear cutting

One wonders if the dwelling in which this poster resides was constructed with wood. If so, did he certify the wood came from an "acceptable" source and not an ancient forest? If not, how can he require others to follow a path that he himself does not endorse by his own actions?

 

[FoBoT]

hmm, we can grow as many trees as we want to

there is a finite amount of iron/metals that are able to be practically mined

hmmm..

 

[Cyberian]

Recycled metal now comprises a large portion of metal products sold in this country. Don't try to tell me that once you create a tin can, that tin is gone forever.

Now I'm curious.
Could you tell us what portion of metal is recycled?

 

[Howard]

Text

A good read, I should think.

 

[HiveMaster]

Living in a wood structure in South Florida is suicide...my dwelling is concrete and steel rods.

You don't get it. Even to recycle metal it still takes vast amounts of energy, mainly from coal.

I am not saying that using metals in the matter talked about in the first post is good.

Energy is produced by many different sources, not just coal. And energy is expended to get metals from the ground in the first place.

 

[PG]

When was the last time you saw someone grow a metal tree?

LOL

It's a bit off topic from this thread, but yet similar, so what the heck.

A few years ago I was watching the "Real World", and some guy had a dog and he was vegitarian. It wa time to eat and someone asked him what he fed the dog. He said that he fed the dog a vegitarian diet as well. He specifially said, "Well, dogs are herbivores you know".

Right, that's why dogs and wolves hunt in packs. It's hard to sneak up on those wily corn and wheat fields.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: HiveMaster
Recycled metal now comprises a large portion of metal products sold in this country. Don't try to tell me that once you create a tin can, that tin is gone forever.

Metal locked in a house is not renewable unless you tear down the house. Wood in a house IS renewable by growing and harvesting more trees.

Tell me, do you whine when people eat produce? Why not? It's grown and harvested in exactly the same way trees are. Why there is this emotional connection to trees, but not other plants is beyond me.

And if you know the difference between mature forests and "tree farms," you understand why saying "we have more trees here than 200 years ago" is at best, horrible spin.

Tree farms may not support as much wildlife, but they filter more air. And the protected forests in America outnumber any in any other country.

I do not KNOW we are not harvesting mature forest trees. How do you know this?

Because I actually know what I'm talking about instead of bleating emotionally based propaganda from a position of ignorance. I never said they aren't harvesting ANY old growth forests (nice try). I said the vast majority of construction lumber comes from tree farming. Old growth stuff is mainly used for fine furniture and such. You don't need 200 year old trees to make 2x4s and plywood.

 

[Amused]

Originally posted by: HiveMaster
Living in a wood structure in South Florida is suicide...my dwelling is concrete and steel rods.

You don't get it. Even to recycle metal it still takes vast amounts of energy, mainly from coal.

I am not saying that using metals in the matter talked about in the first post is good.

Energy is produced by many different sources, not just coal. And energy is expended to get metals from the ground in the first place.

Because of the no nukes idiots, the vast majority of energy in this country comes from coal or oil fired power plants.

 

[PistachioByAzul]

Misinformation is believing humanity is actually making "progress" instead of just consuming ourselves to death. Factory farming is a joke...there is such a thing as biodiversity.