GTaudiophile
Lifer
- Oct 24, 2000
- 29,767
- 33
- 81
Moreover I hope Blu-Ray goes the way of Beta and Mini Disc AND FAST! The format war needs to won by someone fast so that prices can fall.
- Feb 5, 2006
- 2,778
- 1
- 81
You have to admit, Sony did have some great innovations and products (PSX, PSP (w/ homebrew stuff)). But the crap they've been pulling off the past few months is no excuse. I'd want PS3 to fail, due to all that B.S. they're trying to shove down our throats (pay $600 for 'potential'!). But we need those innovators back. The ones that made the original PSX and Sony Walkman. Sony will fail for all their mis-deeds, but I wouldn't want them to go bankrupt. Sony has a good spot in this world, they just need to fire all those damn "yes sir, i agree with your decision to over promise and under deliver Sony products" people and go back to their roots.
Once you get an attitude that says "we rule the market no matter what," and you forget that you are owned by your consumer, you are on your way to failure.
Hopefully the PS3 release will be a wakeup call to Sony. They need to put their egos in check and stop BSing to cover their failures.
Is it normal in their society to say, "well if we are failing, then BSing and blatantly lying to our consumer will win them to our side!" Do they realize that you can only lie to a consumer so much before they start to distain you? (A point they are quickly reaching.)
What happened to valuing those who give you your money?! I have never seen a company treat their consumers as pawns to the degree Sony does. After all, we are stupid, and will submit to anything the mighty Sony may say is good and right.
One Sony Exec. is quoted as saying "...the first five million [people] are going to buy it [the PS3], whatever it is, even if it didn't have games." David Reeves, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment Europe.
That is the kind of thinking that will get you (or should get you) in trouble.
Beyond all this, the most saddening thing is - people will still buy the PS3!
No matter how much they are lied to, how much truth is covered up, how poorly they are treated as consumers, they will still shell out $600+ for this majestic piece of machinery that clearly deserves a place on their mantle as an object of supreme worship.
This is why I will not buy a PS3.
Give Sony a reality check! Buying the PS3 will encourage this behavior. Don't be seduced!
Hopefully the PS3 release will be a wakeup call to Sony. They need to put their egos in check and stop BSing to cover their failures.
Is it normal in their society to say, "well if we are failing, then BSing and blatantly lying to our consumer will win them to our side!" Do they realize that you can only lie to a consumer so much before they start to distain you? (A point they are quickly reaching.)
What happened to valuing those who give you your money?! I have never seen a company treat their consumers as pawns to the degree Sony does. After all, we are stupid, and will submit to anything the mighty Sony may say is good and right.
One Sony Exec. is quoted as saying "...the first five million [people] are going to buy it [the PS3], whatever it is, even if it didn't have games." David Reeves, CEO, Sony Computer Entertainment Europe.
That is the kind of thinking that will get you (or should get you) in trouble.
Beyond all this, the most saddening thing is - people will still buy the PS3!
No matter how much they are lied to, how much truth is covered up, how poorly they are treated as consumers, they will still shell out $600+ for this majestic piece of machinery that clearly deserves a place on their mantle as an object of supreme worship.
This is why I will not buy a PS3.
Give Sony a reality check! Buying the PS3 will encourage this behavior. Don't be seduced!
We'll see what the future holds. Do you have any idea how much stronger, dynamic, agile and efficient Cell is than that crap in the XB360? The current pre-release in-game renderings of many PS3 games rival or flat-out stomp what's already out for the XB360. Imagine what'll happen when Crysis comes out for both systems and it chugs along @ 20 FPS on the 360... /end "Loaded, biased, speculative paragraph"
Maybe you haven't realized it, but the technology in PS3 is the same type of innovation as what you mentioned, just drawn on a much higher technological scale. Sony still has those innovators, but not all their new creations can be picked up for $20 @ Walgreens... Sure, they're putting their butts on the line by throwing all the eggs in one basket (that seems to be precariously resting under a rack of meat tenderizers), but if a company just compromises and gives up trying to realize the true, unadulterated vision of what they see their product as being able to achieve, well... you'll just end up with something like the Wii
And, just to see if my prediction was true, I read/skimmed just about every damn post in this thread. Sadly, I realized that it was. My prediction was this : "Nobody (or hardly anyone) realizes that it's not Sony/M$/Nintendo that is responsible for all the amazing games that end up being released for these systems; IT'S THE INDIVIDUAL DEVELOPERS!"
Sure, there's extremely heavy involvement of the three companies in a lot of the games that come out for their systems, but aside from a select few, most of the "Innovation" of such brilliant games such as (just as a few select examples) FF7, Medal of Honor, Half Life 1&2, etc. stems from the talent, creativity and pure hard work of the independent studios, not the in-house MS/Sony ones. There are obviously titles such as the Gran Turismo series that have been fabricated mostly by the respective platform's parent company, but these are by large the exception, not the rule.
Lastly, there are tons of studios out there that are practically foaming at the mouth for a platform and media that can realize the fullest of their widely underused resources. Imagine the XB360 as being, let's say, a 2.4GHz P4 with 1GB of RAM and a 6800GT, and having that be the most powerful possible PC out there, yet trying to develop something like F.E.A.R for the gaming community. The PS3 will be (as I cross my fingers...) something more along the lines of an dual-core Opteron @ 3.0+Ghz with 2GB of extremely fast DDR, Crossfire X1950's, and a RAID 0 array of lightning fast Ultra320 SCSI drives. Yes, that's a bad comparison, but a potentially viable one. Yes, that is also another jab at the 360's inferior hardware
Give the developers a year, let alone two or three, and the 360 games will still be stagnating in performance, while the PS3 games will be looking and running better and better
Errata : $600 for a PS3 which (should be) a great gaming system *and* a Blu-ray player, or how much!? for a standalone?
If you're an HDTV buff that has already spent easily twice that on a reasonably sized LCD/Plasma, then I doubt $600 is gonna make your family starve...
P.S. - Halo 3? Pssh, wait for Crysis to come out. And to all the Bungie fanboi's, QQ
Fingolfin269
Lifer
- Feb 28, 2003
- 17,948
- 34
- 91
That was quite possibly the post that should be linked when referring to 'fanboyism at its finest'. Wiki?
Wow. I'd imagine that a Lifer, especially one as usually well 'spoken' as you, would render a less ignorant opinion than this, but meh, what'dya know? ...
- Feb 5, 2006
- 2,778
- 1
- 81
Originally posted by: evilsaint
We'll see what the future holds. Do you have any idea how much stronger, dynamic, agile and efficient Cell is than that crap in the XB360? The current pre-release in-game renderings of many PS3 games rival or flat-out stomp what's already out for the XB360. Imagine what'll happen when Crysis comes out for both systems and it chugs along @ 20 FPS on the 360... /end "Loaded, biased, speculative paragraph"
Maybe you haven't realized it, but the technology in PS3 is the same type of innovation as what you mentioned, just drawn on a much higher technological scale. Sony still has those innovators, but not all their new creations can be picked up for $20 @ Walgreens... Sure, they're putting their butts on the line by throwing all the eggs in one basket (that seems to be precariously resting under a rack of meat tenderizers), but if a company just compromises and gives up trying to realize the true, unadulterated vision of what they see their product as being able to achieve, well... you'll just end up with something like the Wii
And, just to see if my prediction was true, I read/skimmed just about every damn post in this thread. Sadly, I realized that it was. My prediction was this : "Nobody (or hardly anyone) realizes that it's not Sony/M$/Nintendo that is responsible for all the amazing games that end up being released for these systems; IT'S THE INDIVIDUAL DEVELOPERS!"
Sure, there's extremely heavy involvement of the three companies in a lot of the games that come out for their systems, but aside from a select few, most of the "Innovation" of such brilliant games such as (just as a few select examples) FF7, Medal of Honor, Half Life 1&2, etc. stems from the talent, creativity and pure hard work of the independent studios, not the in-house MS/Sony ones. There are obviously titles such as the Gran Turismo series that have been fabricated mostly by the respective platform's parent company, but these are by large the exception, not the rule.
Lastly, there are tons of studios out there that are practically foaming at the mouth for a platform and media that can realize the fullest of their widely underused resources. Imagine the XB360 as being, let's say, a 2.4GHz P4 with 1GB of RAM and a 6800GT, and having that be the most powerful possible PC out there, yet trying to develop something like F.E.A.R for the gaming community. The PS3 will be (as I cross my fingers...) something more along the lines of an dual-core Opteron @ 3.0+Ghz with 2GB of extremely fast DDR, Crossfire X1950's, and a RAID 0 array of lightning fast Ultra320 SCSI drives. Yes, that's a bad comparison, but a potentially viable one. Yes, that is also another jab at the 360's inferior hardware
Give the developers a year, let alone two or three, and the 360 games will still be stagnating in performance, while the PS3 games will be looking and running better and better
Errata : $600 for a PS3 which (should be) a great gaming system *and* a Blu-ray player, or how much!? for a standalone?
If you're an HDTV buff that has already spent easily twice that on a reasonably sized LCD/Plasma, then I doubt $600 is gonna make your family starve...
P.S. - Halo 3? Pssh, wait for Crysis to come out. And to all the Bungie fanboi's, QQ
Your "PC" comparison is one of the most biased comments I've ever seen. Looks like they got to you too with all their hype
this is exactly what I was talking about in my first post, they don't even care about their fans, they just lie lie lie. I bet you the cell procesor is far from the "superchip" they claim it is. Plus we all know games gain more from VGA then CPU power.And here's something you should think about. Even if the PS3 can output slightly better graphics then the xbox 360, does it merit a price tag of almost 2x more for that little bit more? (I think the 360 will price drop befroe the ps3 comes out) I think most would agree not. I know you can say all you want about blu-ray, but I believe most people are not interested in having blu-ray forced on them when all they want is a ps3.
Sure they put there butt on the line, but if they knew what they were getting themselves into, I think they wouldn't do it the way they did. What happened was they got greedy, and now they are gonna have to pay. Litterally.
I recently saw some resistence video's, IMO the game looks like crap, graphic wise and gameplay wise. Sony is in trouble this time around, I do like what I hear about free "Playstation Live" so that should help them out a little.
Anyway, I hope sony learns from it's mistakes, and starts thinking more about the people and less of the money.
-SZ
Originally posted by: SpeedZealot369
Your "PC" comparison is one of the most biased comments I've ever seen. Looks like they got to you too with all their hype
And here's something you should think about. Even if the PS3 can output slightly better graphics then the xbox 360, does it merit a price tag of almost 2x more for that little bit more? (I think the 360 will price drop befroe the ps3 comes out) I think most would agree not. I know you can say all you want about blu-ray, but I believe most people are not interested in having blu-ray forced on them when all they want is a ps3.
Sure they put there butt on the line, but if they knew what they were getting themselves into, I think they wouldn't do it the way they did. What happened was they got greedy, and now they are gonna have to pay. Litterally.
I recently saw some resistence video's, IMO the game looks like crap, graphic wise and gameplay wise. Sony is in trouble this time around, I do like what I hear about free "Playstation Live" so that should help them out a little.
Anyway, I hope sony learns from it's mistakes, and starts thinking more about the people and less of the money.
-SZ
Ok, so the PC comparison is below the belt (AMD ftw!), but I still think that it'll hold true. There are FPS drops and instances of stuttering in a few 360 games as it is, and a couple aftermarket accessories companies have even released cooling systems for it! If a *console* system is getting too hot OOTB and not performing right, you have issues.
For what it's worth, i'm basing my opinion of Cell and the 'power' of the PS3 on previews and news snippets from gaming magazines that usually involve developers that are currently attempting to stretch the limits of it's computing and graphical power; i'm not just going on the info from Sonys paper pre-launch. I would have to imagine the 8 or 9 different cores processing all sorts of different information as per which core can sort through each type more efficiently as being *extremely* powerful, just like the new chips that AMD is proposing, with the modular cores to handle different computing needs all at once.
And GPU > CPU is not always the best scenario for a ton of power. Console games especially, with much less overhead in terms of not nearly as many CPU cycles being used up by bloatware like Windows running in the background, not to mention much simpler physical interfaces, can use the main CPU of the machine to a much greater advantage than a PC CPU with an extremely fast chipset, an on-die memory controller, dual cores, or any of the advents out there that help us get even more power out of them.
Fingolfin269
Lifer
- Feb 28, 2003
- 17,948
- 34
- 91
Just because someone releases a cooling system accessory for a console does not mean that console needs one. Some people just think that if an accessory is out there then there is a good chance they need it. I have never had an overheating issue with my 360 but I give it plenty of breathing room so maybe that is the difference. Consoles are becoming more and more like PCs so you have to start treating them as such.
Heat = less life so if you reduce the heat you also reduce the chance of the console breaking down prematurely.
The Xbox 360 does run pretty hot I should say (I owned one for a few weeks) and I think it does need a better cooling system. Wait until all the dust settles in, after that it will only get hotter.
Wow, that was one of the biggest loads of crap I've ever seen on this forum. A bunch of rhetoric, baseless comparisons and the repeated mention of a game the lead designer says will not run on ANY next-gen hardware.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
Originally posted by: evilsaint
We'll see what the future holds. Do you have any idea how much stronger, dynamic, agile and efficient Cell is than that crap in the XB360? The current pre-release in-game renderings of many PS3 games rival or flat-out stomp what's already out for the XB360. Imagine what'll happen when Crysis comes out for both systems and it chugs along @ 20 FPS on the 360... /end "Loaded, biased, speculative paragraph"
Maybe you haven't realized it, but the technology in PS3 is the same type of innovation as what you mentioned, just drawn on a much higher technological scale. Sony still has those innovators, but not all their new creations can be picked up for $20 @ Walgreens... Sure, they're putting their butts on the line by throwing all the eggs in one basket (that seems to be precariously resting under a rack of meat tenderizers), but if a company just compromises and gives up trying to realize the true, unadulterated vision of what they see their product as being able to achieve, well... you'll just end up with something like the Wii
And, just to see if my prediction was true, I read/skimmed just about every damn post in this thread. Sadly, I realized that it was. My prediction was this : "Nobody (or hardly anyone) realizes that it's not Sony/M$/Nintendo that is responsible for all the amazing games that end up being released for these systems; IT'S THE INDIVIDUAL DEVELOPERS!"
Sure, there's extremely heavy involvement of the three companies in a lot of the games that come out for their systems, but aside from a select few, most of the "Innovation" of such brilliant games such as (just as a few select examples) FF7, Medal of Honor, Half Life 1&2, etc. stems from the talent, creativity and pure hard work of the independent studios, not the in-house MS/Sony ones. There are obviously titles such as the Gran Turismo series that have been fabricated mostly by the respective platform's parent company, but these are by large the exception, not the rule.
Lastly, there are tons of studios out there that are practically foaming at the mouth for a platform and media that can realize the fullest of their widely underused resources. Imagine the XB360 as being, let's say, a 2.4GHz P4 with 1GB of RAM and a 6800GT, and having that be the most powerful possible PC out there, yet trying to develop something like F.E.A.R for the gaming community. The PS3 will be (as I cross my fingers...) something more along the lines of an dual-core Opteron @ 3.0+Ghz with 2GB of extremely fast DDR, Crossfire X1950's, and a RAID 0 array of lightning fast Ultra320 SCSI drives. Yes, that's a bad comparison, but a potentially viable one. Yes, that is also another jab at the 360's inferior hardware
Give the developers a year, let alone two or three, and the 360 games will still be stagnating in performance, while the PS3 games will be looking and running better and better
Errata : $600 for a PS3 which (should be) a great gaming system *and* a Blu-ray player, or how much!? for a standalone?
If you're an HDTV buff that has already spent easily twice that on a reasonably sized LCD/Plasma, then I doubt $600 is gonna make your family starve...
P.S. - Halo 3? Pssh, wait for Crysis to come out. And to all the Bungie fanboi's, QQ
sounds like you are talking out of your ass sony fanboy. you really shouldn't have mentioned crysis, crytec has already stated all three consoles are not strong enough.
http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/11651/Cry...-Gen-Consoles-Are-Too-Weak-for-Crysis/
quote:
Speaking at the Games Convention in Leipzig, Bernd Diemer, senior game designer of Crytek, explained that next-generation consoles don?t offer enough computational power to run Crysis, German publication Heise reported.
Although Crysis will support both current and the next version of DirectX, Crytek claims that only DirectX 10 allows the game to run as it was intended by the developers because the next-generation DirectX API, which will ship along with Windows Vista, allows more effects and more objects to be drawn on the screen with a smaller computational cost for the hardware.
Diemer explained that ?next generation consoles like the Xbox 360 and the PlayStation 3 do not offer the sufficient power? to assure the quality of gameplay Crytek demand for Crysis.
Crytek reiterated at GC 06 that currently, Crysis in only in development for Windows. We haven?t lost hope that we?ll eventually see an Xbox 360 version of this first-person shooter.
egads..man, gaming magazines? no wonder
more on the processors without the hype
(scroll down)http://forum.xbox365.com/ubb/ultimatebb...ubb=get_topic;f=66;t=000578;p=1#000009
and really, don't forget the ps3 is trying to run 1080p using 512mb total ram. half video, half system. its not a jump at all from the xbox which has to pull off less. and no, there are not 9 processing cores
and no, the spe's aren't really full processors either. whether programmers will make full use of 3 full cores like the xenon is questionable. with development costs skyrocketing and game development being spread over multiple consoles they just aren't going to spend that kind of time and money optimizing. if i don't benifit from something now, its a waste of money. if in a few years they finally figure out how to use all the vector units/cores then well sure it might be impressive for its generation. but by then you'll be able to play an xbox 720 that will truely be next generation, and all the ps3 improvement will do is help it not look quite as dated. from your pc comparisons it seems like you are just another victim of the sony hype machine. guess they do it because it works.TRENDING THREADS
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