Why get a Celeron 2? Why not wait a month for a Duron?

[brennan]

I've got a Soyo 6BA+III Slot1 mobo with a C366@550, and I'm looking to upgrade soon. I was gonna do the Celeron2 thing, but I'm thinking Duron. Here's my logic:

If I get a Celeron 2 566 and overclock it to 850, I'm spending like $190 for a pretested CPU, a Golden Orb, and a good slocket.

If I get a Duron 600 and an Asus A7V, I'm looking at like $100 for a retail CPU, $15 for a Golden Orb, and maybe $140 for the mobo, meaning $255 total. (Estimated prices) Then, as per Tom's Hardware's article, I o/c the thing to most likely around 850-900 MHz.

Celeron path, I sell my C366@550/slocket/HSF for like $60. That brings the cost for the C2 path down to somewhere near $130.

Duron path, I sell my whole CPU/mobo combo for maybe $110, bringing the total Duron upgrade cost down to $145.

So, I pay only about $15 extra for what appears to be a faster CPU, and MUCH faster if it overclocks particularly well. Plus, I get a better motherboard. So is there any good reason to go with the Celeron rather than the Duron? And of course, correct my numbers if they're wrong. And yes, my current memory is Athlon-compatible.

-brennan

 

[randomlinh]

IF it overclocks.... but still.. i'd rather wait for a duron too...then upgrade to a t-bird

But for me, i already have a 760mhz celeron and no money, so i'm waiting for a 1.2ghz t-bird.

Also, although i don't want to say it, AMD and new mobo's have always seemed to have some sort of problem. So I'd rather wait for some secodn gen boards to come out. If you can wait, it's best to. If not, stick to celery (and then there are those pro intel or pro amd that won't buy the competition because they are too stuborn.. BUT that's another story..)

 

[GC23]

No doubt about it , go for the Duron. Even if it doesnt overclock the Duron will out perforn the celeron 566@850. And if it does overclock to 950mhz it will kill the celeron 2. So the Duron is a win/win situation.

 

[da loser]

Be very quiet , I want my duron and a7v. j/k plenty to go around

Although i don't know about the $165 price, because lynncomp has it for $149, so i really expect it to be around $120-140. Good thing its Asus because more of the online superstores carry asus then abit, so possibly get it cheaper.


I'm not sure about the stability problems and what not. Since KT is the KX prett much. But i've never even used an athlon . on a side note, does this thing have agp pro? and can you use all the pci slots?

 

[HannibalX]

Celeron II is crap. Hasn't everyone seen the C2 700 reviews? Intel is smokin crack!

 

[brennan]

Inguyen: The 1st gen mobo issue is indeed something to be afraid of. Plus, waiting a while will likely mean that Socket A mobos with onboard RAID will be available.

And the T-Bird upgrade path is an important point - I mean, if I go Celeron, the only other upgrade I could ever do is to a FCPGA P3, which probably won't be at a decent price point for like 20 years. T-Bird, tho, is an attractive upgrade path.

In regards to rabid Intel/AMD people, well, some people just never learn.

GC23: That's my impression as well. And, Jesus, if it OCs to 950...(drool)

-brennan

 

[LXi]

Uh... no, I would say Intel is making a smart move. See, if you have a Celeron that performs like 95% of a P3, do you think the P3 would still sell? No. The Duron vs Thunderbird is a history repeat, a repeat of what Intel did when they introduced Medecino, or should I say, a mistake. Remember how the Celerons performed against P2s? Same thing.

 

[brennan]

Thanks for the price, da loser - I was estimating because I searched for A7V on Pricewatch and didn't get any hits. I edited the main post to reflect it. Looks even better now.

-brennan

 

[riceboi5]

Bren, get the C533, I paid $138 for the msi slocket, golden orb and chip shipped. It runs at 896Mhz, stable at 1.65v.

The Duron is great, but for many of us low budget bx users the c2 isn't bad at all...

 

[brennan]

Riceboi, where did you get it for that price? Was it retail or pretested? That's interesting, because it shaves $50 off the price I was figuring on.

-brennan

 

[Becks]

566@850 from compuwiz I think is $155... - $60 from selling current cpu = $95

duron $275 you firgue in shipping with that? $275 - 130 = $145

So get a c2 be sent tomorrow get it in a few days and your done... vs spending $55 more and waiting who knows how many weeks... for a cpu that is faster.

I got my 600@900 a couple weeks ago... i'm an impacient bastard.


Lets say your not going to sell your mobo/cpu, $155 vs $275 and waiting...

Plus 850 = bout a 750 p3 and duron 900 bout equal to 900p3

I wouldn't have sold my mobo/cpu so 150mhz isn't worth $120 and waiting X weeks. I've had my c2 for 2 weeks now...

Also I only have a v3 and 750vs900 doesn't make much of a difference

 

[Shazam]

Get a Celeron2. This way, I can get a Duron

 

[damocles]

My only concern with the Duron (and Hell, im gonna buy one) is whether the motherboards will run perfectly straight away, or whether it is better to wait for revised versions, or until some updates appear.
Whenever any new chip/motherboard combos are released these forums are normally clogged with problems (which gets in the way of me and my day to day PC problems).
I cetainly wouldnt consider a Celeron2 over a Duron, or even over my current Celeron

 

[Double Trouble]

As much as I like the Duron, I simply don't trust the 'first generation' of any type of motherboard -- not the 815E, not the KT-133 etc. No way. I'll wait until the second or third generation comes out. A cheap celery to pop in my existing system (no other upgrades needed) is just what the doctor ordered to hold me over.

 

[damocles]

I agree with Tag. I think upgrading can be very addictive. I remember swapping my SLI rig for a TNT1 and regretting it. My current strategy is not to upgrade untill i need to (sadly my little celery is starting to look a bit sad). For me personally 60fps in most games is just fine (damn you UT . I dont need the extra 40fps.
I find being a step behind the crowd saves me a lot of $$ without too much of a performance sacifice. Of course if youhave the money....Go or it

 

[riceboi5]

Brennan_ , http://www.allstarshop.com
Great service and prices. It was OEM and not pre-tested, but so many people bought chips from them with great success, so thats why I did it also

The great thing with the c2 is that you can use your old PROVEN 440 BX Chipset board. As others have mentioned with the Duron who knows how those new mb's will be.

Tagej : I'm curious, does your name mean smart and fast ?

 

[Modus]

You guys, the launch of the KX133 chipset was extremely smooth; very few problems surfaced, and those that did were quickly ironed out with BIOS/driver/PCB revisions. As Anand and Tom and every other competent reviewer has pointed out, the stability of the VIA KX133 platform is above average.

Now, the KT133 is so similar to the KX133 it might as well be identical. The only thing changed is the CPU signal timing, so trivial a modification that ABIT and other manufacturers have implemented it in the BIOS of KX133 boards.

So basically, stability is not an issue with the Duron. The only really "new" chipsets arriving in the next few months are the DDR 266 parts from AMD, VIA, and ALi.

As far as the C2 vs. Duron thing is concerned, it's a no brainer. Even if you have a BX board already, you can always sell it and recoup the value. From a value standpoint, there is absolutely no reason to even consider anything but an AMD Duron CPU. No other competition, including the Thunderbird, can touch it.

Modus

 

[Tripleshot]

I have a Duron 600 and a T-bird 700 coming in to play with on the new MSI K7T pro board.Should be here Monday.I want to compare it to my Athlon 700 and PIII600E. I have winbench and the ZDNET disc's for benchmarking + UT.Is there any other benchmark gear I need?

 

[brennan]

Normally, I'd agree with the guys who advocate skepticism towrd the first-gen Socket A mobos. However, it seems to me that since this is really mostly an adaption of current Athlon mobos, we may see fewer problems; at least, Tom (Tom's Hardware) seemed pleased with the A7V.

That said, we didn't see really kick-ass Slot A mobos until the last gen before they were phased out (Asus K7V, Abit KA7 & KA7-100), which leads me to believe that I should really wait a couple months if I decide to go with the Athlon.

The Celly @850 (higher if I'm lucky) for $140 like tomorrow (next paycheck actually) is mighty tempting tho. I think it's becoming a matter of whether I want to upgrade within a couple of weeks or wait until maybe mid-late August. Dammit, you people were supposed to decide this for me, not confuse me further. Now I have to think and make decisions for myself.

-brennan

 

[Scifione]

Wow! I have found some smart post for a change.

Value uses and bargon hunters are sometimes treated like second class PC users, but we might just have a few things to say about anyone that would spend 1k on a "top of the line CPU." We know that chip makers are working on something better for them to spend another 1k on at the same time they are paying 1k for that "top of the line CPU." A fool and his money are soon parted!


The Duron and its motherboards can be found now. It is just a question of "Is it in stock," and do you want the Asus A7V (I would, or an ABIT equivilant over clocking motherboard). One positive thing about the socket A upgrade path is that when AMD's Mustang comes out it should replace the T-bird as the desktop high end chip, and thus the Mustang will push the T-bird prices down. Also Mhz plays a role in what the high end chip is preceaved to be.

For me it is not a question. I will be waiting because I don't have the money now, but when I do the Duron will be in my system (If that T-bird looks good for the $$$ I will by it).

 

[Scifione]

Oh ya! Forgot to say something. As for the first gen motherboards for the Duron, I don't consider them fully first gen because the of the chip sets. The KT133 has nothing innovative about it, and thus it should not be plagued by the "innovation = problems" bug. The AMD 750 = same old same old/ nothing new. One reason to avoid first gen board is because they have a feature called "designed obsolescence." Designed obsolescence is when you design a produce that is less than what the technology allows so you can quickly release a produce to replace it and make more money. Companies do it all the time. That's why you see product with new features that is not too different than the old product. One very good example is Abit KA7 to KA7-100. I AM NOT TRYING TO TRASH TALK ABIT! They are not the only one that do it.

 

[Scifione]

Ya! Happy days are here! That last post made me a "member."

 

[Modus]

Tripleshot,

Those apps/games are pretty favorable toward Intel CPU's. To round it out, I would throw in Descent 3 (secret.dem), Q3A of course, and maybe Expendable. For apps, try RC5, 3D Studios, specView, or anything else professional. And make sure to use the latest Content Creation 2000 along with the 4.23 VIA 4 in 1 drivers (they include the 4.03 AGP driver).

Modus

 

[brennan]

Well, I think I'm going to bite the bullet and go with the Celly 533 and overclock it. Here's why:

First off, my original prices for the C533 combo were way high - Riceboi got his from AllStar for $138 shipped for the CPU, slocket, and Golden Orb, and his OCs to 897. I confimed this price; that's damn cheap. The Duron will be probably around $260 for CPU/mobo/G.Orb, shipped. I guess I'm considering any money I'd get back from selling parts to be gravy right now, so I'm not figuring that in the price. Hell, I sell my old C550 for $50, I'll buy $50 worth of beer. Currently, my video card is a TNT2. That extra $120 I'd pay for the Duron could buy me a GeForce MX when it comes out, and frankly I'd put a C850/GF MX against a D900/TNT2 anytime.

Second, the Duron isn't widely available, and NO mobos are available for it right now that are worth getting. Abit just announced their mobo today, so I figure it'll be at least a month or two before really quality Socket A mobos are out there.

Finally, I may be able to do a major upgrade early next year, at which time dual Athlon/Duron mobos that have onboard RAID (as in the Abit KA7-100) and use DDR RAM may be available. It doesn't make much sense to me to do a major upgrade now, when I can do a cheaper upgrade now and a very significant upgrade 6-8 months from now. The C533@850/Ge Force will absolutely carry me until then.

I guess it all comes down to price, and I didn't realize how cheaply the Cellys could be had for, nor just how well they overclock.

-brennan

 

[HannibalX]

"C850/GF MX against a D900/TNT2 anytime"

That sounds kind of foolhearty, but it's your money.