why dont display manufacturers use all japan made caps or take pride in using them?

[Anarchist420]

that's what i want to know. i think it would be a major selling point if they used japan made industrial grade caps and better circuit boards (although that isnt quite as important with digital signals as it was back in the day with analog signals). they could offer a longer warranty, advertise more longevity (at least in top of the line items that the maker is sure wont be very obsolete very quickly) while they could continue to use the caps they use now for other things and give a shorter warranty than is standard now.

perhaps it wouldnt be worthit, but the problems are that we wont know that until it is tried and that the display makers and especially the panel makers are 90% incompetent. they could be doing what EIZO does where they use processing, but then put additional circuitry in it that reduces processing lag to less than 1ms. i mean, game mode in most tvs is a joke as it is still pretty laggy. they could be using RGB LED arrays (they actually arent that expensive and they increase contrast and color uniformity a lot) or at least GB-r LED arrays rather than side or edgelit GB-r LEDs or W-LED (which is usually edge). they could use variable signal rates with non-TN panels but they dont. they could use native RGB 10 panels more. they could use receivers that allow for higher signal rates without frame skipping (drivers can limit frame rate so there wont be excessive blur), but they dont. they could always use direct current for brightness at least for 20% and above but they usually dont. they could use less reflective clear panels for most products (if i am not mistaken, it is possible because Asus just made a monitor that was a clear panel but did something to reduce reflectiveness), but they dont (although to their credit haze factors are a lot lower than they used to be).

it is just like the amplifier and AVR makers. i mean, i bought my HK-3490 for $279 3-4 years ago (retail price $450). today, you cant get anything close to its stereo output power, frequency response/warmth, low crosstalk, and DAC for less than 5x what it retailed for 2 years ago. the HK AVR 3700 only does ~3/5 of what it is rated at, despite listing all the details and it costs a staggering $1k. i mean, these things could practically be made out of your garage for a fraction of what they cost, yet these hugh multinational corporations just feed us a bunch of shit, dont pay their laborers anything, they overcharge us for it, and then they ask for more trade agreements, regs, and patents.

anyway, i am happy and very thankful that i have my HK3490 and that it is perfect (to me at least), but it is just maddening that so few other people will be able to get as much enjoyment for such a good price.

 

[BrightCandle]

Because it costs more, its really that simple. Its not really like monitors are extremely unreliable right now, they have by and large been very reliable for me. The really good quality caps are all about overclocking and high current draw situations and monitors just aren't any of those things, they are basic electronics with relatively small amounts of processing and power consumption. I doubt it would make much difference to the life of the device.

 

[Anarchist420]

Because it costs more, its really that simple. Its not really like monitors are extremely unreliable right now, they have by and large been very reliable for me. The really good quality caps are all about overclocking and high current draw situations and monitors just aren't any of those things, they are basic electronics with relatively small amounts of processing and power consumption. I doubt it would make much difference to the life of the device.

thank you

 

[mindless1]

Because it costs more, its really that simple.

Agreed. It's far far down on the list of things the average consumer thinks about when buying a TV.

The really good quality caps are all about overclocking and high current draw situations and monitors just aren't any of those things, they are basic electronics with relatively small amounts of processing and power consumption. I doubt it would make much difference to the life of the device.

False. Good quality caps are important for any switching power circuit which all TVs have had for decades. It need not be a particularly high performance or power output to benefit from good capacitors. No matter how basic or complex, if there is a switching power circuit that will benefit from high quality capacitors. The less power it uses the lower the uF value of the capacitor (ignoring switching frequency), but there's a wide array of capacitor models between the top shelf part for an application and one that would be expected to fail prematurely.

It is one of the most common early failure points for TVs and monitors, although in major brand, expensive TVs you will tend to find better capacitors than in cheap computer monitors, but not always. As for the monitors I have repaired over a dozen myself and AFAIK they all still work today, having reached an average lifespan over double what they were when the initial capacitor failure happened.

To me that's not all bad. Some of those monitors were given to me free so for a half hour of my time and less than $5 worth of capacitors I had plenty of monitors to go around.

 

[lamedude]

Gigabyte is going to read this and start making Ultra Durable TVs.

 

[alcoholbob]

A lot of high end amps and subwoofers that cost thousands of dollars use crappy caps as well. In reality we don't really know why some of these companies try to save a few bucks and then risk massive RMA costs.

 

[alcoholbob]

it is just like the amplifier and AVR makers. i mean, i bought my HK-3490 for $279 3-4 years ago (retail price $450). today, you cant get anything close to its stereo output power, frequency response/warmth, low crosstalk, and DAC for less than 5x what it retailed for 2 years ago.

Sure you can, for $1395? You can get a Yamaha RX-A3010 for that price on Amazon, which outperforms the HK-3490 in 2-channel by quite a large margin.

 

[krumme]

Low cost Caps today is much better quality than 10 years ago.

 

[biostud]

So that your equipment will die within 3-5 years and you'll buy new equipment.

 

[poofyhairguy]

They don't make them like they used to.

 

[GrumpyMan]

They want more profit and they don't want to have your equipment last 20 years. There is no money in that. I've replaced the caps on my Samsung TV a few years ago due to the crappy cheapos they put in. Still works great now though. It still left a bad taste in my mouth. Will I ever buy another Samsung? Don't think so, even though they should have some great TVs out there for sale now I'm sure. So what has Samsung really won in my case? Certainly not my loyalty to the brand, that's for sure.

 

[Oyeve]

They want more profit and they don't want to have your equipment last 20 years. There is no money in that. I've replaced the caps on my Samsung TV a few years ago due to the crappy cheapos they put in. Still works great now though. It still left a bad taste in my mouth. Will I ever buy another Samsung? Don't think so, even though they should have some great TVs out there for sale now I'm sure. So what has Samsung really won in my case? Certainly not my loyalty to the brand, that's for sure.

Same here. My old 32" samsung blew a cap after 3 years, some google-fu and 50 cents later I got it working again. But for how long? This was 4 years ago.

 

[krumme]

So that your equipment will die within 3-5 years and you'll buy new equipment.

There is tons of bad mechanics that is worse problem. Quality in general is far worse - or made to last shorter - than +20 years ago when things was build to last. Capacitors is not the problem relative to other problems. Is it even possible to get a motherboard today not build with solid capacitors? - and btw most non-solid capacitors is of acceptable quality.

 

[krumme]

I remember in my old Volvo 940 (1995) model in the control box there was used extremely durable film capacitors. Rifa and Elna of the finest quality. I guess not a single controlbox from that model ever failed, but it was damn expensive components. It seems nobody wants to pay for that anymore.

 

[BrightCandle]

As a rule people don't really open up monitors and look at how they are built. For quite a while HardOCP was opening up PSUs and looking at the actual components but I haven't seen anyone take apart a monitor to look at it. The first one I saw in ages was pcper taking apart the Asus monitor to replace the controller with a gsync module. I was kind of shocked to find that there wasn't a whole lot of electronics in there, but more importantly it was taped to the back of the screen with electrical tape. There weren't screws holding it in place, just tape. Its amazing that holds together long enough to survive multiple transits or moving about.

There are definitely quality issues inside of monitors that reduce their lifespan, and I think if we started seeing the inside of these monitors we might see improvements in the internal design. But unless a review site starts going after it the manufacturers will assume its out of sight and hence do everything they can to aggressively reduce the prices to maximise their profits and their competitive price.

Lots of people still buy the very cheap monitors, despite all the objective ways we know they are bad from an image perspective. I suspect the insides are pretty bad as well.