Why does intel gimp some of their CPU lines?

[ShintaiDK]

I certainly regret buying a 4770K. In hindsight I would have picked a 4771, which has TSX with which I would like to play.

That being said, I certainly like my 4770K

But what will you use TSX for, before your next upgrade?

Even MS SQL 2014 that is one of the applications that will gain most from TSX, still havent support.

Many people simply seek the checkbox for "what if case". Back when SLI was chipset locked. nVidia earned huge amount of money to tax people for exactly this reason. Much less than 1% of the people paying the ~50$ SLI tax ever ended up getting SLI.

x64 on early K8s is another example. Hopelessly obsolete before proper software support. Yet for some it was almost life and dead to have that exact feature checkbox.

 

[Nothingness]

But what will you use TSX for, before your next upgrade?

Even MS SQL 2014 that is one of the applications that will gain most from TSX, still havent support.

I don't care what MS SW supports or not, I want to play with transactional memory in my own code.

Many people simply seek the checkbox for "what if case".

Don't try to apply your generalization to me, thanks

x64 on K8s in 2002 was also a "must have". But when x64 arrived, it was hopelessly obsolete.

What do you mean? When first AMD x64 chips went available at end of 2003, Intel was lagging behind in both performance and features.

 

[ShintaiDK]

You missed the point completely. Its pointless for the overall consumer to add TSX for K models. Since software adoption is so far behind. Same applies to x64 back then.

And people making commercial code would avoid doing so on OCed CPUs.

 

[Phynaz]

Once upon a time,all chips were "unlocked" and you could do whatever you wanted with them if you knew how.

Once upon a time you couldn't buy a CPU for $100. Your point?

 

[Nothingness]

You missed the point completely. Its pointless for the overall consumer to add TSX for K models. Since software adoption is so far behind. Same applies to x64 back then.

I was answering mrmt question who was asking for personal experience, not for SW adoption or wide generalizations from armchair analysts.

And people making commercial code would avoid doing so on OCed CPUs.

My CPU isn't OC, I never OC. Which makes my choice all the more stupid.

 

[Edgemeal]

But what will you use TSX for, before your next upgrade?

Retracted, Apologies.

</Back to Lurking>

 

[ShintaiDK]

Before haswell release weren't you the one telling EVERYONE to wait because they would get the new instructions like TSX that were going to give us huge gains in games and desktop software?

If not, I'm sorry, but you always seem to post such pro Intel stuff its hard to take anything you post seriously anymore.

</Back to Lurking>

Check your facts before you attack someone.

 

[mrmt]

I certainly regret buying a 4770K. In hindsight I would have picked a 4771, which has TSX with which I would like to play.

That being said, I certainly like my 4770K

So despite not approving their business decision, you still ended up buying Intel and is actually happy with your product.

Sounds to me like a good business decision for Intel.

 

[Edgemeal]

Check your facts before you attack someone.

D: My bad, you basically said he opposite.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=33692882&postcount=17

You do seem to have a fetish with Intel like I've never seen anywhere else tho.

 

[Nothingness]

So despite not approving their business decision, you still ended up buying Intel and is actually happy with your product.

Sounds to me like a good business decision for Intel.

Partly yes. Intel makes the best CPU for my needs, but that doesn't mean I agree with every decision they make and in particular I strongly disagree with the segmentation they do on the instruction set, and I'll keep on being vocal about that :biggrin:

 

[NTMBK]

But what will you use TSX for, before your next upgrade?

Even MS SQL 2014 that is one of the applications that will gain most from TSX, still havent support.

And do you know what would speed up software adoption? If Intel enabled TSX on more of their processors. The more processors out there with the feature, the more incentive there is to utilise it in your software.

 

[ShintaiDK]

And do you know what would speed up software adoption? If Intel enabled TSX on more of their processors. The more processors out there with the feature, the more incentive there is to utilise it in your software.

You have to understand the market segment for TSX first. All Xeons ship with TSX.

 

[NTMBK]

You have to understand the market segment for TSX first. All Xeons ship with TSX.

Meh, in my eyes any heavily multithreaded software with multiple threads writing to a common data structure are the market segment for TSX. Plenty of game engines fall into that thread- and I bet all these multithreaded Mantle/DirectX 12 drivers would find it useful. It's not just for databases, though obviously it's very useful there.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Meh, in my eyes any heavily multithreaded software with multiple threads writing to a common data structure are the market segment for TSX. Plenty of game engines fall into that thread- and I bet all these multithreaded Mantle/DirectX 12 drivers would find it useful. It's not just for databases, though obviously it's very useful there.

You need to readup on what TSX actually does.

 

[Nothingness]

You have to understand the market segment for TSX first. All Xeons ship with TSX.

Not all chips that ship with TSX are Xeon.

 

[NTMBK]

You need to readup on what TSX actually does.

It's lock elision. i.e. useful when multiple threads can be potentially writing into and reading from a common datastructure.

 

[mrmt]

You need to readup on what TSX actually does.

NTMBK is right, TSX is a feature that might be a lot useful in the consumer space, and Intel is delaying adoption by removing the feature of its cheapest processors.

 

[zir_blazer]

TSX is actually another feature along with VT-d that gets removed from K series Processors, some regular Core i5 does have it. However, for TSX I don't know of actual, currently available applications that may use it. I hear there was a QEMU fork that was going to use TSX (Which may improve virtualization performance even further), but the project seems dead. Even then, if anything interesing appears that requires TSX, most enthusiasts will be missing the train because they're with K series Processors.

I still insist that current "enthusiasts" are not power users anymore. Actually, based on available features, Intel sees them as mere overclockers.

 

[Nothingness]

However, for TSX I don't know of actual, currently available applications that may use it. I hear there was a QEMU fork that was going to use TSX (Which may improve virtualization performance even further), but the project seems dead

All I found was a project to simulate TSX on QEMU. But I agree TSX might help on QEMU and that's in fact on it I wanted to test its use