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Why does anyone complain about the US voting age?

S

ShawnD1

Lifer
As the republicans have pointed out, you're not required to prove who you are. With that in mind, why does anyone care what the voting age is? Some high school kids want to show how Grown Up and Mature they are, and they want to have the right to vote. Did someone forget to tell them that they can already vote? People on the other side of the fence say things like the voting age should be 21 or 25. They could raise it to 50 and it would do nothing since everybody could just show up and say they are 50.

This is not a parody. This is a real question.
 
For the most part the 18-21 crowd for the last 30 years can reliably depended upon to do one thing on election day - play hacky sack, get stoned, and forget it's election day. They've never been a force in elective politics but I think that's about to change and not in a way the liberal mavens of this country would like.
 
ky54 said:
For the most part the 18-21 crowd for the last 30 years can reliably depended upon to do one thing on election day - play hacky sack, get stoned, and forget it's election day. They've never been a force in elective politics but I think that's about to change and not in a way the liberal mavens of this country would like.
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Heh. Whistlin' past the graveyard.

Perhaps you'd care to expound on the effects of demographic shift & ongoing concentration of wealth and income as it relates to the prospects for young people. Maybe about their perceptions wrt the party that wants to cut student loans, cut aid to education,"Broaden the tax base", cut govt jobs, promote offshoring of capital ... insist that they jump through hoops to vote at all...
 
piasabird said:
I think only Married land owners should get to vote.
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Hmmm let's see. Marriage in modern society in an institution where men get royally fucked and often lose everything, including their children. Yes, the people who voluntarily sign up for that are clearly not drug addicts.

17 year olds.
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And 80 year olds. "God damn young people don't know how to vote. They always want facts and stuff. Back in my day the candidate would say the department of defense had over 150 confirmed members of the communist party and we believed it without question."
 
piasabird said:
I think only Married land owners should get to vote.
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Good Thomas Paine quote on that:
"When a broodmare shall fortunately produce a foal or a mule that, by being worth the sum in question, shall convey to its owner the right of voting, or by its death take it from him, in whom does the origin of such a right exist? Is it in the man, or in the mule? When we consider how many ways property may be acquired without merit, and lost without crime, we ought to spurn the idea of making it a criterion of rights."
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ShawnD1 said:
Hmmm let's see. Marriage in modern society in an institution where men get royally fucked and often lose everything, including their children. Yes, the people who voluntarily sign up for that are clearly not drug addicts.


And 80 year olds. "God damn young people don't know how to vote. They always want facts and stuff. Back in my day the candidate would say the department of defense had over 150 confirmed members of the communist party and we believed it without question."
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Not sure that is true. It would be great if young people wanted facts. I am generalizing now but looking at TV ads, there don't seem to be any facts about the products that are advertised. Usually, the commercial has nothing to do with the product but yet sells millions. Most commercials are targeted at young people. I never did understand this but that is why I am not in Marketing.
 
JockoJohnson said:
Not sure that is true. It would be great if young people wanted facts.
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Young people are growing up with the expectation that facts are readily available. Even before internet, I remember being able to find stuff in Microsoft Encarta very quickly. Type in a word and information is there. A lot of old people, both libs and conservatives, have still not adapted to this. One example is the budget situation in my province. Neither of my parents had any idea what the budget looked like; they grew up at a time when people just didn't know things like that. They both thought it was doing good and they thought it would make sense to cut taxes accordingly. 5 seconds of google searching shows that we're seeing record deficits at this time.


Usually, the commercial has nothing to do with the product but yet sells millions. Most commercials are targeted at young people. I never did understand this but that is why I am not in Marketing.
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That's called pavlovian conditioning. When there's no clear understanding of how things work, brains constantly search for correlations. It's hot all day then suddenly there is a strong wind and the air temperature is dropping - you know that it's about to rain even if you don't understand how wind and rain are related. In advertising, this conditioning is done by building strong positive emotions then associating those emotions with the product. When you see the product in the store, the brain will feel positive emotions.
 
Jhhnn said:
Heh. Whistlin' past the graveyard.

Perhaps you'd care to expound on the effects of demographic shift & ongoing concentration of wealth and income as it relates to the prospects for young people. Maybe about their perceptions wrt the party that wants to cut student loans from the federal government, cut aid to education from the federal government,"Broaden the tax base", cut govt jobs, promote offshoring of capital ... insist that they jump through hoops to vote at all...
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Fixed. I'm sick of this nonsense where people presume that the federal government is the only vehicle for these things. It's the vehicle of choice for those lucky enough to be in the demographics selected to be eligible for them. It's a huge middle finger to the rest of us, just like the rest of the crap you posted. The Republicans won't do a damn thing to change it and I am not a Republican in any way, shape, or form. You live in a fantasy world where both parties are different, where the money for all of your programs grows on trees, and where everyone sucks at math as much as you do. Here in reality, things cost money. You can't simply give away everything to get elected while having fewer and fewer people pay taxes - at least if you believe in math. As a Mathocrat, I summarily reject your premise that any of the items you listed are inherently bad.
 
ShawnD1 said:
As the republicans have pointed out, you're not required to prove who you are. With that in mind, why does anyone care what the voting age is? Some high school kids want to show how Grown Up and Mature they are, and they want to have the right to vote. Did someone forget to tell them that they can already vote? People on the other side of the fence say things like the voting age should be 21 or 25. They could raise it to 50 and it would do nothing since everybody could just show up and say they are 50.

This is not a parody. This is a real question.
Click to expand...


I would rather see:

The driving age raised to 18 along with the drinking and smoking ages!
 
A better question is why have a voting age at all, except maybe to establish the formal date when a child should physically cast his own vote. We don't (and shouldn't) abridge the rights of the mentally handicapped or knowingly ignorant adults, so what right do we have to stop children of any age from voting (or their parents voting in proxy for them) since those children have more at stake in the election than any 80 year old? They're the ones who will inherit our debts, infrastructure, education systems, etc.

Regarding the OP, your only 'not required to show who you are' because a statistically insignificant amount of times does anyone ever vote as someone else and the issue get raised. Voter fraud is a non-issue, while voter suppression and disenfranchisement is historically a very very serious and common issue, so we err on the side of letting people vote. The only reason to change that now is that the poors, young, and immobile old who might be restricted by these laws from voting more often vote Democratic than Republican.

CycloWizard said:
Here in reality, things cost money. You can't simply give away everything to get elected while having fewer and fewer people pay taxes - at least if you believe in math. As a Mathocrat, I summarily reject your premise that any of the items you listed are inherently bad.
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It's only "fewer and fewer people pay[ing] taxes" because fewer and fewer people have a vastly larger percentage of the total money and total income. I doubt there's anyone who would disagree that it would be fantastic if everyone in the country payed taxes, if that meant everyone was making enough money to be able to afford it. The way to broaden the number taxed is to broaden the median wealth in the country.
 
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ShawnD1 said:
That's called pavlovian conditioning. When there's no clear understanding of how things work, brains constantly search for correlations. It's hot all day then suddenly there is a strong wind and the air temperature is dropping - you know that it's about to rain even if you don't understand how wind and rain are related. In advertising, this conditioning is done by building strong positive emotions then associating those emotions with the product. When you see the product in the store, the brain will feel positive emotions.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the explanation. I never thought of it that way. I usually never pay attention to commercials. Can't say I feel emotions one way or another when I see products but good to know that is why they do it.
 
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