Why do people pay $20+K a year to go to mediocre private schools?

beer

Lifer
Jun 27, 2000
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I was reading a thread over in FS/FT where this guy was selling his computer due to 'financial trouble' because his tutition costs $26K. I fail to understand why someone would pay 2-3x as much to go to a private school which they can hardly afford and gives an education on-par (or worse) than a state school. Now, there are a few special cases in which I would understand going to a private school. One is that if you are going to a super-tier school, MIT, Stanford, Caltech, and some of the better ivy league schools, in which your alma mater would bring you great rewards when applying to graduate and postgrad. Or maybe you got a scholarship and your tuition is heavily discounted, 85-90%. Or if your family is rich and $100K really isn't all that much money, certainly not enough to put you into debt.

But the vast majority of people attending private schools do not attend due to the reasons above. People are paying $30K a year to go to small liberal arts and otherwise completely mediocre schools. Why do they do this when they are having to take in $100K in student loans? A school like Baylor, for example, doesn't even rank in any category, yet people pay $25K a year to live in a sh!thole town.

I mean, there are obvious reasons why smaller schools are better. And I know that I'm going to hear the same few, recycled reasons why a small or medium private school is better than a larger public school. Namely -

"I don't want to just be a number." This here is the biggest POS reason I've ever heard. First of all, only a select few of the freshman classes are held in auditorium-like classrooms. Basic English classes, general chemistry and programming, and histories, for example. 85% of the classes you will take over four years will be held in small classrooms where the professor will learn your name even if you don't go to office hours. And even in those bigger classes, you will only be a number if you choose to. All professors have office hours and most of the time they are idle or at the very least, not overly busy. You have to make a bit more of an effort in those classes if y ou want to be on a first-name basis with the professor, but it isn't all that difficult.

"People aren't as outgoing at large schools." This here is another unfounded rumor that small-town advoates like to make. Yea, it is true that if you are sitting on a shuttle bus, people won't actively start talking to you. Of course, the alternative is to be forced to socialize with people you really aren't all that interested in. You just need to seek out small campus organizations if you want to meet like-minded people.

Prestigious state universities and top-tier private schools have more research and more funding. 85% of all private schools have minimal research and professors that are completely average. Because of these two reasons, the TAs that will be working with you in recitiation and labs are barely average, as well. People go to school for four years and come out with a sub-par education with fewer social skills and $100K in debt. A family that makes $115K a year is expected to contribute $33K a year in college edudation - a sheerly ludicious amount.

Why?

EDIT: Typos
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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Uh, because some of us came from small schools and don't/didn't want anything to do with a campus of 30,000+ people.

Hell my hometown was 2,000 people. I had a graduating HS class of 48.

From a college I wanted a similar atmosphere. I wanted to be able to have easy access to a teacher if needed. I wanted to be able to compete in sports and not have to be an uber elite athlete able to compete at DII or DI levels. I wanted to be able to be active at a higher level in many campus activities and organizations.

It's all in what you are used to. If you didn't come from a small town or small high school you wouldn't understand.
 

beer

Lifer
Jun 27, 2000
11,169
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Originally posted by: amnesiac
If they're in that much financial trouble, shouldn't they be getting financial aid?

Read my last sentence of my post. Based upon what I know about FAFSA and my own experiences, a family that makes $115 or so a year is expected to contribute over $30K a year - in other words, almost all of your tution. That means no federal assistance. That amount of money is not really enough to fork over $30K a year out of.

Loans are still considered financial aid. But you still need to pay them back, and $100K is a lot, even at minimal interest. Most schools don't deviate too much on need-based aid from what the federal government recommends, and merit-based aid is one of the exceptions I addressed in my first paragraph.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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BTW - my private mediocre school was right at 20k a year, but after grants and scholarships I only ended up having to take out about $4,000 a year in loans. It was actually almost cheaper to go to a 20k a year private school since I had over $9,000 a year in grants and scholarships than it was to go to a state school.
 
Aug 14, 2001
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Sometimes to some people the cost is worth it I guess. If you're talking about mediocore private schools that aren't even ranked well, then I have no idea why people would pay a significant amount of money (if they don't get a decent amount of scholarships/grants/aid) to go to them. Maybe they want a more personal & smaller environment where they can get to know the professors better? I went to a decent (top 20) private undergraduate school and I had classes of about 12 students each. I don't think that something like that would be very common at very large schools.

Does the research availability really matter to undergrads? I doubt it. It's not like most of them will have a significant research experience, if any.

Anyways, I agree with you somewhat. Going to a good private school and doing decent helps you out some if you're getting a job or going to a graduate school. However, if you go to a state school and do well, then you will get accepted into a good graduate school, too. In conclusion, if I lived in TX, I would go to UT Austin. If I lived in GA, I would go to GA Tech. If I lived in CA, I would go to any of the UC's and so on. In other words, it would be good to go to a decent state school and do well there while saving money.

Now if you live somewhere like AL...then you might want to consider going out of state.
 

Orsorum

Lifer
Dec 26, 2001
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Elemental, I have never really understood why someone would choose to go to such expensive private schools. I dated a girl in h.s. who is now going to a $20,000 a year private school; she's also going for five years. Not to mention that she's also planning on grad school for two years to become, you guessed it, a teacher!

To top it all off her family lives off of ~$40,000 a year. They took out $6,000 in loans for her first year alone.

What motivated her to do that as opposed to going to a school like WWU (which is one of the best teachers' schools in WA state), I will never understand. She threw out a lot of the crap excuses that you put up, and now that I've been at a large school (Univ. of WA) for a few years, I've also been able to debunk them.
 

iamwiz82

Lifer
Jan 10, 2001
30,772
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Originally posted by: ANY5546
The co-op program :(

you go to Kettering?

I pay $20k per year for my education because I am a white male who wanted a good education. I prefer my small school that gives me co-op experience. After i graduated(next year! :D) i will have had 4 years of real world experience. That is a huge selling point, IMHO.
 

LordMorpheus

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2002
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it depends on the school. Rice, MIT, Caltech, and the like are probably worth their tuition (Rice even more so 'cause its less than half the price of the other two.)because you come out of those into prestigious gradschools or relatively high paying jobs, and in the current job market a Rice engineering grad is probably more likely to get hired in his/her feild that a grad from, say, Rolla (not to say Rolla is a bad school, but it lacks the prestige factor). At MIT and Caltech you can go to gradschool and look at doing some ground-breaking research at Fermilab and professorship at a college if thats what you want (they pay you to do awesome stuff . .. only awesome if you are big into it, tho)


So . . . I can see why South Bumf*ck College of Custodianism would be overpriced at 20K, when you can get an equal education at North Bumf*ck College of Custodianism State for a quarter of the price, but when you get into the journalism/humanities/sciences a degree from a more prestigious private university often pays for itself many times over.
 

beer

Lifer
Jun 27, 2000
11,169
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Originally posted by: LordMorpheus
it depends on the school. Rice, MIT, Caltech, and the like are probably worth their tuition (Rice even more so 'cause its less than half the price of the other two.)because you come out of those into prestigious gradschools or relatively high paying jobs, and in the current job market a Rice engineering grad is probably more likely to get hired in his/her feild that a grad from, say, Rolla (not to say Rolla is a bad school, but it lacks the prestige factor). At MIT and Caltech you can go to gradschool and look at doing some ground-breaking research at Fermilab and professorship at a college if thats what you want (they pay you to do awesome stuff . .. only awesome if you are big into it, tho)


So . . . I can see why South Bumf*ck College of Custodianism would be overpriced at 20K, when you can get an equal education at North Bumf*ck College of Custodianism State for a quarter of the price, but when you get into the journalism/humanities/sciences a degree from a more prestigious private university often pays for itself many times over.


Did you at all read my inital post?
 

LS20

Banned
Jan 22, 2002
5,858
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baylor has a well respected medical school. outside of rice, i cant really think of other places in texas to go for it. all our family and church friends who are baylor grads are doing well. its baptist and its close to home so thats why my sister is going there. well, that, and she got the baylor presidential scholarship thing.
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
12,404
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Most states don't have good public universities... good in reputation, academics, etc. Outside of CA (UC Berkeley, UCLA, etc.), Texas (UT Austin), Michigan, Georgia (GA Tech), and a few other states, it might be worth it to go out of state. Going to an out of state public school can cost as much as going to a top private university, too.
 

LordMorpheus

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2002
6,871
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Originally posted by: Elemental007
Originally posted by: LordMorpheus
it depends on the school. Rice, MIT, Caltech, and the like are probably worth their tuition (Rice even more so 'cause its less than half the price of the other two.)because you come out of those into prestigious gradschools or relatively high paying jobs, and in the current job market a Rice engineering grad is probably more likely to get hired in his/her feild that a grad from, say, Rolla (not to say Rolla is a bad school, but it lacks the prestige factor). At MIT and Caltech you can go to gradschool and look at doing some ground-breaking research at Fermilab and professorship at a college if thats what you want (they pay you to do awesome stuff . .. only awesome if you are big into it, tho)


So . . . I can see why South Bumf*ck College of Custodianism would be overpriced at 20K, when you can get an equal education at North Bumf*ck College of Custodianism State for a quarter of the price, but when you get into the journalism/humanities/sciences a degree from a more prestigious private university often pays for itself many times over.


Did you at all read my inital post?

and I agreed with you, just most of my post was adding my 2 cents about a different topic.

 

radioouman

Diamond Member
Nov 4, 2002
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As you have said indirectly, the reputation of the school would be a reason to choose a more expensive private school (MIT, Stanford, Caltech). However, in my case, I went to a decent state school for two years and chose to transfer to a regionally excellent private school so that I could live at home and commute. The reputation of the first school that I started at was "I didn't know that they had an engineering program... I thought that all they did was drink!" and this was a large state school. The second school (private) that I attended is known for their engineering program. I'm talking about known regionally (midwest) and doesn't compete with Ivy league schools.

Where I live, there are two good schools with well known engineering programs. One is a state school and the other is private. I chose the private school because it has a better reputation than the state school. (They also gave me a nice scholarship, so the difference in cost was not a factor since they were nearly equal.)

In the end, I had a real job in engineering a few weeks before I graduated, so it certainly paid off.
 

EXman

Lifer
Jul 12, 2001
20,079
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because the ones I know of are easier.

ie Transylvania Univ in Lex Ky you make your own cirricula (sp) know people that graduated taking no 400 level classes at all. And allot of people like that High School feel of small campuses.

I agree with you plus their sports teams SUCK!
 

erub

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2000
5,481
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Even coming from a private high school, this is something I still don't understand. I go to Texas A&M University, getting a degree in EE - all of the departments aren't the greatest here, but our engineering department is ranked pretty highly. I've never had a class with more than 100 people in my first two years, and just by going to class everyday the teacher will learn your name, if you make any effort. All the teachers pratically beg you to come by during office hours, or make an appointment with them, respond quickly to emails, and there are always accessible TAs when the professor's office hours aren't convienent.

If you join any student organizations, its really easy to meet people. Also dorms, cafeterias, classes, all very easy to talk to people - (A&M is known for its friendliness though, so this may not apply at all state schools). Plus there are 22,000 females here, so if you mess up with 1, 5, 10..okay 500, you still have plenty left to choose from :)
 

dboy

Golden Member
May 17, 2001
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I went to a small private university that was about the same size as my high school (~2000 students total). For me, there were several reasons. (fyi... I'm a 2001 BS Chemistry degree)

1. Belief system. Not trying to start a religious war here, but to me, a Christian school was important.
2. No issue of "mediocre vs. good" TAs. There WERE no TAs! In my general chem class freshman year, both lecture and lab were run by a PhD full professor. The largest class I had was probably gen chem, and it was about 100 students. Some of the advanced chem classes were 2-5 students. Most of my gen eds (history, lit, etc) were in the 20-40 student range.
3. The quantity of current, university funded research was small, but that didn't mean the profs were not top-notch. Of my main 3 chem profs, one worked years doing research for NASA, one worked several years at Sandia labs and currently (while teaching) does research on semi-conducting and conducting polymers for the Air Force at Wright-Patterson AFB in Dayton, OH. The third did and still does AF research at WPAFB.
4. I didn't pay 20K+ a year - the school I went to was excellent and was only ~15K. I could have had (and was offered) full ride + expenses at a couple different state schools, but turned them down.
5. To define "excellent" school - even though probably no one reading this has ever heard of it (Cedarville University in Cedarville, OH), they competed academically against much bigger schools and won. The engineering dept would regularly beat UMichigan, Ohio State, etc. Debate teams won national titles. Campus network won best in the nation for its size (computers in every dorm room, etc). Facilities were state of the art - how many schools that size have a scanning electron microscope? (granted, it was an ancient one, but it worked great).

There certainly are lots of mediocre small schools to which I would question the wisdom of attending them. However, in my case, I'd do it again with no hesitation whatsoever.
 

milagro

Golden Member
Jun 19, 2001
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Originally posted by: radioouman
As you have said indirectly, the reputation of the school would be a reason to choose a more expensive private school (MIT, Stanford, Caltech). However, in my case, I went to a decent state school for two years and chose to transfer to a regionally excellent private school so that I could live at home and commute. The reputation of the first school that I started at was "I didn't know that they had an engineering program... I thought that all they did was drink!" and this was a large state school. The second school (private) that I attended is known for their engineering program. I'm talking about known regionally (midwest) and doesn't compete with Ivy league schools.

Where I live, there are two good schools with well known engineering programs. One is a state school and the other is private. I chose the private school because it has a better reputation than the state school. (They also gave me a nice scholarship, so the difference in cost was not a factor since they were nearly equal.)

In the end, I had a real job in engineering a few weeks before I graduated, so it certainly paid off.

I'm bored so I'll guess Case Western or maybe Purdue..