Why buy retail Windows?

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
I bought 2 OEM copies of Windows 7 x64 on release day.

With my gaming machine I've had 3 different motherboards and cpu's. (latestgoing from 980a chipset to 890fx chipset last week). With the htpc I've had a 780g that I upgraded to a 880g and from a 5000+ to the x3.

Everytime I've reloaded windows the first time on the new
Build, it won't pass online validation, but thengives you the option of phone validating or buying a new key. When you do the phone validation, it simply asks you at the end how many systems your using this key on and you say 1 and poof, Verified!

What's the point in retail versions?

I've done the same with using xp own on various builds.
 

sivart

Golden Member
Oct 20, 2000
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No support with OEM.
No upgrade path with OEM
OEM is suppose to be tied to a single motherboard and not transferred to another one.
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
No support with OEM.
No upgrade path with OEM
OEM is suppose to be tied to a single motherboard and not transferred to another one.

The first 2 points, who actually uses those?

And last, Microsoft activates them, not my problem
 

Nothinman

Elite Member
Sep 14, 2001
30,672
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The first 2 points, who actually uses those?

And last, Microsoft activates them, not my problem

I've seen enough threads about upgrades to know that some people use them, I have no idea if anyone actually call MS but I'm sure they exist.

And the last point is on you and only works because you're lying to the system. If you have no moral qualms with stealing then there's nothing we can do about that.
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
I've seen enough threads about upgrades to know that some people use them, I have no idea if anyone actually call MS but I'm sure they exist.

And the last point is on you and only works because you're lying to the system. If you have no moral qualms with stealing then there's nothing we can do about that.

How am I lying?

It asks you how many systems it's used on , I say 1.
 

Anarchist420

Diamond Member
Feb 13, 2010
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I've seen enough threads about upgrades to know that some people use them, I have no idea if anyone actually call MS but I'm sure they exist.

And the last point is on you and only works because you're lying to the system. If you have no moral qualms with stealing then there's nothing we can do about that.
You can't steal something that isn't physical.
 

hclarkjr

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,375
0
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isn't there something in license agreement that it is for 1 motherboard only and is tied to that board?
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
60,014
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Which is (was?) a violation of the OEM license.

I already went through my interpretation in another thread, but as I said there, it's up to MS to allow, or deny activation. There's billions of rules and laws that aren't strictly enforced through life. NOBODY rigidly follows those(as they shouldn't), so it's ridiculous to be pedantic about 1 of them.
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
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Well if it's tied to the board they shouldn't activate it

I'm not lying, answering there questions honestly, an they activate it


How am I strealin something from a company that they are approving?

It's there decision if they are going against there own rule, it's not like I'm downloading a crack, I'm using a paid for key that they decide to honor.
 
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hclarkjr

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,375
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so using that logic if i go to best buy and walk out the door with 7 retail without paying for it they should just let me go as it isn't a law i should obey? :awe:
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
I think they are flexible with oem keys to maybe try to keep people from pirating?

Who knows. I'm sure they rather see you use a key(on 1 system of course) rather than pirating.
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
so using that logic if i go to best buy and walk out the door with 7 retail without paying for it they should just let me go as it isn't a law i should obey? :awe:

You're missing the point. I called Microsoft and they approved it.


Your point is crazy exaggerating this.


I want you to tell me how I'm stealing something with full validation from Microsoft. I've even told them before I've upgraded and want to reuse they key and they still activate it.
 
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lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
60,014
10,514
126
so using that logic if i go to best buy and walk out the door with 7 retail without paying for it they should just let me go as it isn't a law i should obey? :awe:

No, that's a physical item, and you're actually taking physical money from BestBuy since they already paid for it. It's more like BestBuy had a 50% off sale on Win7, and it expired yesterday, but the manager decides to sell it to you for that price anyway ;^)
 

VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
56,587
10,225
126
Wait until MS starts charging per additional activation, after the first one is free. Get your CC ready. Mark this post, it will happen eventually.

(Note that this is along the same lines as EA now charging each new owner of a used sports game with online play, for the online access key.)
 

jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
Wait until MS starts charging per additional activation, after the first one is free. Get your CC ready. Mark this post, it will happen eventually.

(Note that this is along the same lines as EA now charging each new owner of a used sports game with online play, for the online access key.)

I could seer this for OEM (after say 2 reloads) ,retail I doubt.
 

mechBgon

Super Moderator<br>Elite Member
Oct 31, 1999
30,699
1
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I've seen enough threads about upgrades to know that some people use them, I have no idea if anyone actually call MS but I'm sure they exist.

And the last point is on you and only works because you're lying to the system. If you have no moral qualms with stealing then there's nothing we can do about that.

This.

Whether Microsoft's activation system will activate it, is completely irrelevant to the agreement you make when you accept the EULA. So if you understand the intent of an OEM license, then it boils down to whether your honor's worth $115 or not, I guess.

Further reading: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/mssmallbiz/...rade-is-an-upgrade-what-you-need-to-know.aspx Different licensing topic, but the moral of the story is that just because a loophole exists and it technically can be done, doesn't make it legit.

Unfortunately, it looks like it is time to have this conversation again though. Over the past several days there have been various posts, etc. across a variety of social media engines stating that some &#8220;hack&#8221; shows that a Windows 7 Upgrade disc can perform a &#8220;clean&#8221; installation of Windows 7 on a blank drive from a technical perspective. Of course, from the posts I saw, they often forgot to mention a very basic, yet very important piece of information&#8230; &#8220;Technically possible&#8221; does not always mean legal.
 
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jacktesterson

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2001
5,493
3
81
I don't feel I'm stealing if they approve of It with a live Microsoft telephone rep.

My 2 cents.


If they decline it, I'll buy another copy.


Sone people in here acting like they've never downloaded a song or eat a piece of candy at a bulk store or something before.

Guess I'm just evil, not according to Microsoft though :)
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
33,088
11,271
136
This.

Whether Microsoft's activation system will activate it, is completely irrelevant to the agreement you make when you accept the EULA. So if you understand the intent of an OEM license, then it boils down to whether your honor's worth $115 or not, I guess.

Further reading: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/mssmallbiz/...rade-is-an-upgrade-what-you-need-to-know.aspx Different licensing topic, but the moral of the story is that just because a loophole exists and it technically can be done, doesn't make it legit.

How is it a loophole?

Microsoft knows he's got an OEM copy (dont they have different s/n?).
They know he's reinstalling it.
He's just putting it on one machine.

Noting he's doing is against the law, its between Microsoft and him. He's giving them all the information they require and its up to them if the activate it for him.
 

Manticorps

Member
Jan 27, 2006
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0
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I've had manufacturers fix stuff for free after the warranty expired, they knew it was expired and fixed it anyway. I sleep just fine at night.

Seems to me that it is Microsoft's choice whether to reactivate or not. They have the facts:
1. Items were Changed
2. It is an OEM copy of windows 7

Since this is an OEM copy of windows 7, Microsoft has the option to refuse to reactivate it. They chose to reactivate it, while knowing it was an OEM copy and components had been changed. Microsoft doesn't see a problem with reactivation so I don't know why some of you do. It's not like he was hacking anything or deceiving anyone.
 

mechBgon

Super Moderator<br>Elite Member
Oct 31, 1999
30,699
1
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How is it a loophole?

The loophole is that the activation system isn't asking the pertinent question: is this substantially the same computer that the software was tied to? And the definitive item, barring a failure, is generally recognized to be the system's motherboard. This is what we agree on when we OK the EULA for the discounted OEM license. If I agree to that, I have no business asking for reactivation on a new system. What they'd say if I did ask isn't relevant to the agreement I made.

Changing other components may trip the reactivation routine, but is within the envelope of the OEM-license scenario. For example, if you double your RAM, throw in a quad-core processor, and replace your DVD burner with a Blu-Ray unit, that all may add up to a reactivation prompt, since those items contribute to the activation hash. That's kosher.

I understand that it probably seems arbitrary. The motherboard's probably worth less than the stuff I mentioned in the previous paragraph, so why should it be the definitive item? *shrug* But they have to draw the line somewhere, or they're basically giving you Windows for less than half-price with a free ticket to upgrade forever. And you know that's not the intent of an OEM license, that's what retail licenses are for.

OEM licenses are transferrable with the hardware they're tied to, so one solution would be to sell the old motherboard along with the system's case (which the COA should've been stuck onto, as much as I hate that) and the original disc. Then pick up a new license for the new build, and you're good. Definitely a hassle, but compliant with the terms of the license agreement.

I recognize that many peoples' ability to accept this, is seriously clouded by the fact that a new license costs money, even if it's not that much money. But the original question was "Why buy retail Windows?" and the answer is "Because I want to maintain a legit license while upgrading to my heart's content, plus I want to be able to sell the license off by itself someday."
 
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KeypoX

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2003
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upgrade was only 50 at release and can be installed and reinstalled, how much is oem?