Why are Trump supporters ok with The Donald violating the Logan Act?

[Jaskalas]

From where does this authority arise for the president elect?

The Logan Act would basically make it illegal to speak to foreign people.
This thread is cheering on an assault on the 1st Amendment.

 

[werepossum]

I would say that I cannot believe some people are so fucking stupid as to deny that LITERALLY EVERY Presidential candidate and President-Elect meets with foreign leaders, but this election cycle has destroyed my disbelief in any level of stupidity and hypocrisy. Rest assured that if I still possessed such a meter, this "outrage" would register quite high.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/07/18/obama.trip/index.html?iref=nextin

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama is in Afghanistan on a multistop overseas trip for meetings with international leaders but with an eye on the U.S. presidential race back home.

Sen. Barack Obama is expected to visit several world leaders over the next few weeks.

Obama's trip, which includes visits to Iraq, Jordan, Israel, Germany, France and the United Kingdom, is intended to bolster his foreign policy credentials before U.S. voters.

"This is the campaign trail via satellite -- pictures for the rhetoric back home," CNN's Candy Crowley said, adding that the trip was intended to demonstrate that Obama was up to the job of taking a lead role on the international stage.

"The question is, is he tough enough to stand up for America but graceful enough to improve [its] image?" Crowley said.

Watch what Obama needs from this trip »

In a recent Washington Post/ABC News poll, 48 percent of registered voters said Obama would make a good commander in chief, compared with 72 percent for his Republican rival, John McCain.

Obama's Trip
Sen. Barack Obama is stepping onto the world's stage. During his trip to Asia, the Middle East and Europe, Obama will visit, in order:

• Jordan
• Israel (with a trip to the West Bank)
• Germany
• France
• The United Kingdom

Obama is now in Afghanistan and plans to visit Iraq.
"The message to voters back home is that he is focused on being a strong and effective commander in chief who is going to rehabilitate our image across the world," Democratic Sen. Evan Bayh said.

But a spokeswoman for McCain said Thursday that Obama's trip was politically motivated.

"It's about politics. It's a way for Obama to try and compete on foreign policy," Jill Hazelbaker said.

Obama arrived Saturday in Afghanistan. He is also scheduled to visit Iraq with two Senate colleagues, Democrat Jack Reed and Republican Chuck Hagel.

McCain has visited both countries and accuses his rival of naivete for suggesting that Iraq had distracted the United States from the growing conflict in Afghanistan.

Watch how the candidates are battling over Iraq »

"To say that Iraq is somehow disconnected from Afghanistan shows, again, incredible naivete," McCain said this week.

A video released by the McCain campaign also accused Obama of "flip-flopping" over his plans to withdraw troops from Iraq. The campaign also aired its first negative advertisement of the season, hitting Obama on foreign policy issues.

A diplomatic source told Time magazine that King Abdullah II of Jordan would urge Obama, if elected, to make Arab-Israeli peace talks a higher priority than has been the case under President Bush.

But obviously he was meeting only to discuss grandchildren and golf, amirite?

 

[Vic]

Because all that is Trumpism can be summed up in 5 simple words: Two wrongs make a right.
So it doesn't matter what Trump does, because Obama.. or Hillary. They all kill children.. or at least, they thought about it, right? So of course, it's perfectly ok when Trump does it..

 

[Griffinhart]

If we're going to be honest here. It is likely that the Act is, in fact, unconstitutional. The fact that no one has ever been prosecuted for it is also important as well as the long standing tradition of candidates communicating with world leaders. Both Clinton and Trump did so this year with Clinton even daring Trump to meet with leaders.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/trump-clinton-egypt-fattah-el-sisi/index.html

So, if someone REALLY feels Trump can and should be taken down for this, they should also be calling for the same thing for Hillary and Obama.

 

[theeedude]

Trump supporters are OK with him taking away their own health insurance. That's all you need to know.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

So President-elect Trump airs his opinions, gets and gives some congratulatory phone calls, makes a few comments on his upcoming job and somehow it's the same as fucktard Obama taking a world tour and talking to world leaders before he was even elected.

Trump supporters are OK with him taking away their own health insurance. That's all you need to know.

I'm a Trump supporter and he's not taking away my health insurance and you are a liar. Nothing new, nothing unexpected and it's all you need to know about the rabid anti-Trumpers.

 

[Raizinman]

Sour Grapes

 

[fskimospy]

I would say that I cannot believe some people are so fucking stupid as to deny that LITERALLY EVERY Presidential candidate and President-Elect meets with foreign leaders, but this election cycle has destroyed my disbelief in any level of stupidity and hypocrisy. Rest assured that if I still possessed such a meter, this "outrage" would register quite high.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/07/18/obama.trip/index.html?iref=nextin

But obviously he was meeting only to discuss grandchildren and golf, amirite?

Well at least we know you are fucking stupid enough to rant about how dumb everyone else is for bringing up the Logan Act while obviously having no idea what's in it. Hahaha.

There is no prohibition on meeting with foreign leaders. If you have literally any evidence that those meetings were an attempt to influence their US policy then by all means present it!

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Well at least we know you are fucking stupid enough to rant about how dumb everyone else is for bringing up the Logan Act while obviously having no idea what's in it. Hahaha.

There is no prohibition on meeting with foreign leaders. If you have literally any evidence that those meetings were an attempt to influence their US policy then by all means present it!

I'm pretty sure that was his exact point.

 

[IronWing]

I would say that I cannot believe some people are so fucking stupid as to deny that LITERALLY EVERY Presidential candidate and President-Elect meets with foreign leaders, but this election cycle has destroyed my disbelief in any level of stupidity and hypocrisy. Rest assured that if I still possessed such a meter, this "outrage" would register quite high.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/07/18/obama.trip/index.html?iref=nextin

But obviously he was meeting only to discuss grandchildren and golf, amirite?

Discussing foreign policy with foreign leaders isn't the issue. Only if one attempts to undermine U.S. foreign policy while talking with foreign leaders does it become a Logan Act issue. See Jane Fonda in Vietnam or Bush Sr. talking to the Iranians in 1980.

However, I am also of the opinion that the act is very likely unconstitutional.

 

[fskimospy]

I'm pretty sure that was his exact point.

Trump has been doing considerably more than that in regards to Israel. If that was his point then that's even worse because it means he doesn't understand the Logan Act OR what has been going on.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Trump has been doing considerably more than that in regards to Israel. If that was his point then that's even worse because it means he doesn't understand the Logan Act OR what has been going on.

I guess I don't either. What has been going on with respect to Israel and Trump? All I can find is a campaign promise about moving the US embassy to Jerusalem, without any explicit reference to communication with Israeli officials.

 

[fskimospy]

I guess I don't either. What has been going on with respect to Israel and Trump? All I can find is a campaign promise about moving the US embassy to Jerusalem, without any explicit reference to communication with Israeli officials.

Trump has been basically conducting a parallel foreign policy around Israel since the security council resolution on settlements was passed.

Frankly I don't care if he does that and I think the Logan Act is unconstitutional anyway, I just found werepossum once again calling other people stupid while not knowing what he was talking about funny.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Trump has been basically conducting a parallel foreign policy around Israel since the security council resolution on settlements was passed.

Frankly I don't care if he does that and I think the Logan Act is unconstitutional anyway, I just found werepossum once again calling other people stupid while not knowing what he was talking about funny.

Would still appreciate specifics. Apparently after the UN resolution, Israel is now pissed and taking the initiative to contact Trump with relevant evidence for the purpose of making the Obama administration look bad/dishonest. He didn't initiate any contacts, Trump has always been pro-Israel to varying degrees afaik (it's obligatory for Repubs), so as long as Israel or Trump sit on it until he's officially President (and imo the idea that a President-elect is not at all a public official is silly anyways) and then goes through the proper channels of disseminating said evidence, I don't really see how it's a violation.

 

[werepossum]

Well at least we know you are fucking stupid enough to rant about how dumb everyone else is for bringing up the Logan Act while obviously having no idea what's in it. Hahaha.

There is no prohibition on meeting with foreign leaders. If you have literally any evidence that those meetings were an attempt to influence their US policy then by all means present it!

Oh no, I'm quite sure that Democrats only ever talk about golf and grandchildren. I even said so. Influencing policy is clearly something that is strictly limited to Republicans.

I swear, strap some magnets to your ass and surround you with copper wire and we'd all be off coal AND petroleum. Seriously, dude, you need to take one for the planet.

 

[fskimospy]

Oh no, I'm quite sure that Democrats only ever talk about golf and grandchildren. I even said so. Influencing policy is clearly something that is strictly limited to Republicans.

I swear, strap some magnets to your ass and surround you with copper wire and we'd all be off coal AND petroleum. Seriously, dude, you need to take one for the planet.

Ah got it, this is another one of those things where you have exactly zero evidence but are certain it's true and anyone who disagrees is a liar. How silly of me to doubt you! Lol.

 

[werepossum]

From Griffinhart's link: http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/trump-clinton-egypt-fattah-el-sisi/index.html

Clinton's meeting with Poroshenko, in the eyes of her aides, attempted to highlight the differences between the Democratic and Republican nominee on policy toward Moscow. Clinton's campaign and other Democrats have accused Trump of cozying up to Putin, who has built his foreign policy on thwarting US goals and failing to confront Moscow over its annexation of Crimea in Ukraine.
Clinton's adviser said that she believed that Washington needed to do more to stand up to Russian "aggression" in Ukraine and to allow the Kiev government to defend itself.
Currently, the Obama administration has offered logistical help to Ukraine's armed forces but has fallen short of lethal assistance as some Republicans have championed. The official did not say, however, whether Clinton would move toward lethal aid but said that she would take a look at any requests from the Ukrainians.
Clinton's meeting with Sisi will make waves in the Middle East because of the recent estrangement between the Egyptian President's government and the Obama administration.
Clinton, according to an aide in the room, "emphasized the importance of respect for rule of law and human rights to Egypt's future progress" and "discussed ways to deepen counterterrorism cooperation, particularly in the fight against ISIS."

As I said, for Democrats it's clearly golf and grandchildren all the way down. Oh, to some on the far right it might look like specifically advocating change in current American policy might possibly have something to do with, um, altering policy. But those amazingly gifted, totally unbiased individuals like eskimospy can easily understand that this meeting is totally about golf and grandchildren, like ALL Democrat meetings.

 

[werepossum]

Discussing foreign policy with foreign leaders isn't the issue. Only if one attempts to undermine U.S. foreign policy while talking with foreign leaders does it become a Logan Act issue. See Jane Fonda in Vietnam or Bush Sr. talking to the Iranians in 1980.

However, I am also of the opinion that the act is very likely unconstitutional.

Luckily we can easily determine whether the discussion is attempting to undermine U.S. foreign policy, for verily, our Lord has given us these magic letters.

 

[fskimospy]

From Griffinhart's link: http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/trump-clinton-egypt-fattah-el-sisi/index.html

As I said, for Democrats it's clearly golf and grandchildren all the way down. Oh, to some on the far right it might look like specifically advocating change in current American policy might possibly have something to do with, um, altering policy. But those amazingly gifted, totally unbiased individuals like eskimospy can easily understand that this meeting is totally about golf and grandchildren, like ALL Democrat meetings.

I love how you quoted an article where Clinton refused to say if she would alter US policy as an example of someone saying they would change US policy. Bonus points for self ownage and your usual declarations of others' malign intent.

Never change, werepossum!

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Oh no, I'm quite sure that Democrats only ever talk about golf and grandchildren. I even said so. Influencing policy is clearly something that is strictly limited to Republicans.

I swear, strap some magnets to your ass and surround you with copper wire and we'd all be off coal AND petroleum. Seriously, dude, you need to take one for the planet.

Aren't you afraid the massive magnetic imbalance might flip our poles and cause the end of the world as we know it?

 

[OrByte]

Trump changed his rhetoric with regards to Russia meddling in the US elections because his language was borderline insurrection against the interests of the US:


18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection
Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

You people better believe he has lawyers advising him to STFU about Russia.

Right up to Obama's press conference on Dec 16, 2016 Trump was denying to the world that Russia was involved with the hack. And remember when Trump was urging Russian Hackers to hack Clinton's email? During early December he was on Fox News all the time claiming how ridiculous the idea is of Russia hacking and that Obama is just playing politics, blah blah blah.

Ever since Obama held his press conference Trump has been largely quiet. Saying things like moving on and blah blah blah. He definitely changed his tune.

So those of you that think the Logan Act, or the US Code for Rebellion or insurrection are outdated or unrealistic, or some sort of fringe-type of wishful thinking..... think again.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Trump changed his rhetoric with regards to Russia meddling in the US elections because his language was borderline insurrection against the interests of the US:


18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection
Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)

You people better believe he has lawyers advising him to STFU about Russia.

Right up to Obama's press conference on Dec 16, 2016 Trump was denying to the world that Russia was involved with the hack. And remember when Trump was urging Russian Hackers to hack Clinton's email? During early December he was on Fox News all the time claiming how ridiculous the idea is of Russia hacking and that Obama is just playing politics, blah blah blah.

Ever since Obama held his press conference Trump has been largely quiet. Saying things like moving on and blah blah blah. He definitely changed his tune.

So those of you that think the Logan Act, or the US Code for Rebellion or insurrection are outdated or unrealistic, or some sort of fringe-type of wishful thinking..... think again.

Uh yeah.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/25057...py-ejections-in-wake-of-election-hacking-row/