why are people from taiwan so hateful towards china?

[gopunk]

i have a lot of friends whose parents came over to the states from taiwan, and this bugs the crap out of me. they're always spouting their beliefs about how miserable china is as if it were fact, when none of them have actually ever even been to china. i've been to rural and urban areas in both, and there's really not a huge difference, imo. i mean, i understand that china has its problems, but it seems like people from taiwan have a completely distorted view of china. and the vigor with which they hold these views makes it seem like a kind of fanaticism. even if their beliefs were true, that still wouldn't be enough to explain why they have such stronger feelings than others about it.

anyways, just wanted to rant and see if anybody had any insight. i suspect their parents have been brainwashing them or something.

 

[Linflas]

Totalitarian dictatorship that constantly rattles swords threatening to take over a country that has been independent since Mao took power and you have to ask?

 

[Trevelyan]

China IS going to take over Tawaiin again.

 

[FoBoT]

commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

 

[torpid]

History 101 FTW.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: Linflas
Totalitarian dictatorship that constantly rattles swords threatening to take over a country that has been independent since Mao took power and you have to ask?

well, that would explain why they might not like china... but that doesn't necessarily explain the distorted views of china. for example, i have a friend that thinks google.cn was a huge technological improvement for china.

 

[PowerMacG5]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

Lets put this in to perspective.

Do you think back in the 1700's that the colonist had bad feelings about Britain? Do you understand why they did? Do you think they bad mouthed Britain back then?

Good, now just change the time to the near-present, and the location to Taiwan, and you should understand.

 

[DaShen]

Ummm... China shoots missile over Taiwan every year at least a couple times. Not really a way to build trust. They also threaten to take Taiwan by force, which they will be able to do by 2010, since there military will outshine the US by that time.

Oh well, when they take over, they will treat Taiwan like Hong Kong. Economically free, so the ignorant people won't care, socially totalitarian, where the educated people will flee or get killed. But because it will still be prosperous, most younger Taiwanese won't care.

Hopefully, by that time civil unrest by the migrant workers the 60-70% of China who are being exploited will revolt, but with China's strong military and huge control of the press, I doubt that will cause that much trouble and social change. I mean most people in China under the age of 30 don't even really know about Tiananmen Square and Tank Man... and the horrible attracities that happened. And they are so brainwashed by propaganda and wealth that they could care less about social problems in their country.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: PowerMacG5

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

Lets put this in to perspective.

Do you think back in the 1700's that the colonist had bad feelings about Britain? Do you understand why they did? Do you think they bad mouthed Britain back then?

Good, now just change the time to the near-present, and the location to Taiwan, and you should understand.

except, as anybody from taiwan will tell you, taiwan has been independant from china for quite a while. i don't think that the hatefulness comes from oppression.

 

[Linflas]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Linflas
Totalitarian dictatorship that constantly rattles swords threatening to take over a country that has been independent since Mao took power and you have to ask?

well, that would explain why they might not like china... but that doesn't necessarily explain the distorted views of china. for example, i have a friend that thinks google.cn was a huge technological improvement for china.

Some improvement. An "information" search service that makes sure that certain inconvenient information never reaches the searcher.

 

[FoBoT]

because they used to be part of the whole thing and the commie part still considers them part of the whole thing

think of it like this. lets say florida is an island instead of a penisula.
what if florida during the civil war had not been brought back into the union for some reason, maybe due to florida being an island, it was a stalemate because an invasion of the island of florida would be too difficult with 1860's technology (something like that). the rest of the US still considers florida part of the united states, but the "Rebels" on the island of florida still think they won and they are the confederacy. the animosity between the people of florida and the united states would continue for a very very long time

it is an unresovled conflict

 

[GeneValgene]

chinese concentration camps for falun gong practitioners and selling their organs

more on organ harvesting

google forced to censor all mention of tiananmen square and falun gong from within china

cofounder of apex captured because of contract disputes, with no arbitration

millions of taiwanese slaughtered by chinese in the infamous 228 incident

nytimes article on 228

 

[Heisenberg]

Originally posted by: DaShen
They also threaten to take Taiwan by force, which they will be able to do by 2010, since there military will outshine the US by that time.

/falls off chair laughing

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: DaShen
Ummm... China shoots missile over Taiwan every year at least a couple times. Not really a way to build trust. They also threaten to take Taiwan by force, which they will be able to do by 2010, since there military will outshine the US by that time.

Oh well, when they take over, they will treat Taiwan like Hong Kong. Economically free, so the ignorant people won't care, socially totalitarian, where the educated people will flee or get killed. But because it will still be prosperous, most younger Taiwanese won't care.

Hopefully, by that time civil unrest by the migrant workers the 60-70% of China who are being exploited will revolt, but with China's strong military and huge control of the press, I doubt that will cause that much trouble and social change. I mean most people in China under the age of 30 don't even really know about Tiananmen Square and Tank Man... and the horrible attracities that happened. And they are so brainwashed by propaganda and wealth that they could care less about social problems in their country.

well i think i differ in my predictions for china and taiwan from you in just about every aspect, but the issue of trust and military threat doesn't directly explain the problem of extremely distorted views of china. unless we say that the distorted views are a natural result from the animosity... like how nations have traditionally sought to dehumanize their enemies.

 

[PowerMacG5]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: PowerMacG5

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

Lets put this in to perspective.

Do you think back in the 1700's that the colonist had bad feelings about Britain? Do you understand why they did? Do you think they bad mouthed Britain back then?

Good, now just change the time to the near-present, and the location to Taiwan, and you should understand.

except, as anybody from taiwan will tell you, taiwan has been independant from china for quite a while. i don't think that the hatefulness comes from oppression.

I know Taiwan has been independent for a while, but I am just trying to put it in perspective. How would you like it if England kept theatening to take back the US?

And you realize for quite a while after the revolution, Americans held hard feeling towards England, right? Americans would talk down about England and the English like no one's business. Do you understand yet? It's human nature to hold a grudge.

 

[JS80]

What's "Taiwan"? Are you guys talking about Chinese Taipei? (runs and hides)

 

[DaShen]

Originally posted by: Linflas

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: Linflas
Totalitarian dictatorship that constantly rattles swords threatening to take over a country that has been independent since Mao took power and you have to ask?

well, that would explain why they might not like china... but that doesn't necessarily explain the distorted views of china. for example, i have a friend that thinks google.cn was a huge technological improvement for china.

Some improvement. An "information" search service that makes sure that certain inconvenient information never reaches the searcher.

China is just following the idea that give a person just enough to make them content and nothing more. Don't give them real control.

Google, Yahoo, and CISCO did some terrible things in China. Now that China has that technology, there is nothing to stop them from reading your email. Arresting you for looking at news sites, blackmailing you if you have power for your internet interests... really shady stuff.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
because they used to be part of the whole thing and the commie part still considers them part of the whole thing

think of it like this. lets say florida is an island instead of a penisula.
what if florida during the civil war had not been brought back into the union for some reason, maybe due to florida being an island, it was a stalemate because an invasion of the island of florida would be too difficult with 1860's technology (something like that). the rest of the US still considers florida part of the united states, but the "Rebels" on the island of florida still think they won and they are the confederacy. the animosity between the people of florida and the united states would continue for a very very long time

it is an unresovled conflict

yes, but animosity doesn't necessarily result in a distorted view... does it?

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: DaShen
Ummm... China shoots missile over Taiwan every year at least a couple times. Not really a way to build trust. They also threaten to take Taiwan by force, which they will be able to do by 2010, since there military will outshine the US by that time.

Oh well, when they take over, they will treat Taiwan like Hong Kong. Economically free, so the ignorant people won't care, socially totalitarian, where the educated people will flee or get killed. But because it will still be prosperous, most younger Taiwanese won't care.

Hopefully, by that time civil unrest by the migrant workers the 60-70% of China who are being exploited will revolt, but with China's strong military and huge control of the press, I doubt that will cause that much trouble and social change. I mean most people in China under the age of 30 don't even really know about Tiananmen Square and Tank Man... and the horrible attracities that happened. And they are so brainwashed by propaganda and wealth that they could care less about social problems in their country.

Maybe in 25 years they will reach parity in some areas, definately not in 4. Their naval construction program alone is still decades behind the US.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: PowerMacG5

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: PowerMacG5

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

Lets put this in to perspective.

Do you think back in the 1700's that the colonist had bad feelings about Britain? Do you understand why they did? Do you think they bad mouthed Britain back then?

Good, now just change the time to the near-present, and the location to Taiwan, and you should understand.

except, as anybody from taiwan will tell you, taiwan has been independant from china for quite a while. i don't think that the hatefulness comes from oppression.

I know Taiwan has been independent for a while, but I am just trying to put it in perspective. How would you like it if England kept theatening to take back the US?

And you realize for quite a while after the revolution, Americans held hard feeling towards England, right? Americans would talk down about England and the English like no one's business. Do you understand yet? It's human nature to hold a grudge.

i feel like i'm repeating myself a lot here... i can hold a grudge, but it doesn't mean that i'm going to have a bunch of false beliefs about the target of that grudge. but you're right, i guess that would explain the vigor with which they attack china. i guess i never really viewed the chinese threats as all that realistic.

 

[gopunk]

Originally posted by: GeneValgene
chinese concentration camps for falun gong practitioners and selling their organs

more on organ harvesting

google forced to censor all mention of tiananmen square and falun gong from within china

cofounder of apex captured because of contract disputes, with no arbitration

millions of taiwanese slaughtered by chinese in the infamous 228 incident

nytimes article on 228

and this relates to my op... how?

 

[GeneValgene]

Originally posted by: GeneValgene
chinese concentration camps for falun gong practitioners and selling their organs

more on organ harvesting

google forced to censor all mention of tiananmen square and falun gong from within china

cofounder of apex captured because of contract disputes, with no arbitration

millions of taiwanese slaughtered by chinese in the infamous 228 incident

nytimes article on 228

i am taiwanese...read the above. this stuff scares me!

 

[DaShen]

Originally posted by: gopunk
well i think i differ in my predictions for china and taiwan from you in just about every aspect, but the issue of trust and military threat doesn't directly explain the problem of extremely distorted views of china. unless we say that the distorted views are a natural result from the animosity... like how nations have traditionally sought to dehumanize their enemies.

Chinese people are cool :thumbsup:

Chinese Government, one party rule, is corrupt and inhumane. It is just that Chinese people aren't able to find out the seedy crap that China does. The US lets us find the information, but they don't publicize it to the general population because it does not fit our economic or political motivations. The US doesn't want public outcry against one of there major trade partners.

****************

Originally posted by: GeneValgene
chinese concentration camps for falun gong practitioners and selling their organs

more on organ harvesting

google forced to censor all mention of tiananmen square and falun gong from within china

cofounder of apex captured because of contract disputes, with no arbitration

millions of taiwanese slaughtered by chinese in the infamous 228 incident

nytimes article on 228

Seriously people, read some of this stuff. This isn't the half of it.

 

[cambre]

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: PowerMacG5

Originally posted by: gopunk

Originally posted by: FoBoT
commie vs. non-commie and you wonder what it is all about?

if that were the reason, why are they so much more fanatical about it than other non-commies (i.e., the rest of the united states, other asian-americans like koreans and japanese).

Lets put this in to perspective.

Do you think back in the 1700's that the colonist had bad feelings about Britain? Do you understand why they did? Do you think they bad mouthed Britain back then?

Good, now just change the time to the near-present, and the location to Taiwan, and you should understand.

except, as anybody from taiwan will tell you, taiwan has been independant from china for quite a while. i don't think that the hatefulness comes from oppression.

Taiwan is only 'independent' because of US backing. Same thing with South Korea and South Vietnam. If the US decided not to get involved, Taiwan would be dropped like a prom dress.

Taiwan considers itself to be the real China. I guess whatever makes them sleep better at night.