Why all the Palin angst?

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PokerGuy

Lifer
Jul 2, 2005
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Originally posted by: ayabe
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

Care to justify that statement?

Palin has a journalism degree, not even a masters, isn't a constitutional scholar, has only traveled outside the country once, has never once thought about Iraq except to say that God wants us there.

Yes, she is exponentially less qualified than Obama on all fronts.

Wrong, those "fronts" in and of themselves don't have anything to do with being qualified. Neither Palin nor Obama have any experience handling situations of substance, experience with geopolitics, experience handling crises etc. They are both unqualified in terms of experience, one is running for VP, the other for President. I'd rather have an unqualified VP than an unqualified President.[/quote]

Your frothing at the mouth is so amusing :)

 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,133
38
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Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

Democrats thought he was qualified. McCain thinks she's qualified. Big difference.
 

chrisho

Member
Jun 17, 2008
63
0
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Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Is it truly because there is small chance that a conservative home-maker may finally break that last glass ceiling instead of a true feminist like Hillary?

Is that where all this anti-Palin anger is coming from?

Simple, because she has substance and the lead of the Democratic ticket doesn't.


It says a lot that they have to go after her personally, they can't get on her record and her experience. It amazes me how much they have to hide Obama's lack of experience yet have to go out of their way to minimize hers.

She is the ultimate feminist dream, except she has the wrong party affiliation. She had it all, a big family, a successful career, and even went on to be governor of a state all the while having the family. She can be a woman, look like a woman, and still lead!

LOL

McCain made a far better choice than Obama did, thats a big if, as in if Obama actually made the choice. I really think Biden is his Cheney. It was like he was assigned to him like Cheney was to Bush. The insider, the puppet master.

Face it, the bubbleheads are in an uproar because she isn't an insider. They didn't "Clear" her. All the choices the told McCain he should have made were never demanded of Obama.

She ran her kids hockey team, end of story.
 

jman19

Lifer
Nov 3, 2000
11,225
664
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Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
Originally posted by: jman19
Originally posted by: Don Vito Corleone
Originally posted by: Common Courtesy

To paraphrase a an old saying: "Doths that protest to loudly, have something to fear"

This is some bizarre paraphrasing of "the lady doth protest too much." You do know that "doth" is a verb (meaning "does"), not a noun, right?

CC certainly has an interesting take on the English language.

Punch drunk - Don Vito was able to decipher what I was implying.

As was I. Just found it amusing how badly you fouled that up.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

Care to justify that statement?

Palin has a journalism degree, not even a masters, isn't a constitutional scholar, has only traveled outside the country once, has never once thought about Iraq except to say that God wants us there.

Yes, she is exponentially less qualified than Obama on all fronts.

Wrong, those "fronts" in and of themselves don't have anything to do with being qualified. Neither Palin nor Obama have any experience handling situations of substance, experience with geopolitics, experience handling crises etc. They are both unqualified in terms of experience, one is running for VP, the other for President. I'd rather have an unqualified VP than an unqualified President.

Your frothing at the mouth is so amusing :)

Your stupidity is what is so amusing.
Next you'll be saying your St. Sarah and a recent med school grad are just as qualified to perform surgery.

Considering McCain's age and known medical history, his VP should be someone qualified for the Presidency. I would argue in this in any case, that any VP candidate should be qualified for the Presidency, but with McCain, his choice of this obviously unqualified Nehemiah Scudder makes that seem a bit more important.

And to CC, why are 'liberals' protesting Palin so much? Here's your answer.

As if any woman will do
Saturday, August 30, 2008
Susan Nielsen
The Oregonian

How dumb does John McCain think women are?

The Arizona senator picked Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his GOP running mate on Friday. She is flatly unqualified to be vice president. Her beliefs on abortion would offend any woman to the left of Clarence Thomas.

Yet McCain seems to believe that millions of women voters will coo indiscriminately over any female candidate who comes along. He wants disappointed Hillary supporters to stampede to his side, followed by all other women who are enthralled by Palin's life story.

This miscalculation could -- and should -- cost McCain the election.

Palin is a first-term governor and former mayor. She is popular in her home state, in large part because she tackled corruption in state politics and taxed oil companies in a way that directly benefits Alaskan residents.

She's also hugely appealing to women. While other mothers struggle to balance work and family on a humdrum level, she manages to become governor, have five children, stay married to a handsome fisherman and pose for a fashion magazine. Talk about having it all.

But let's get real. This is a race for president, not a contest for which Veep you'd most like to personally emulate. McCain is 72, and the average life expectancy for a white American man is 76. If McCain were elected, it's quite possible that his vice president would need to take over.

Is Palin ready to govern the country and oversee the military? No.

Is she interchangeable with Hillary Clinton? Hardly.

Three years ago, Palin was mayor of a town called Wasilla, population 6,700. That's smaller than Stayton, Ore. (Haven't heard of it? Exactly.) She has no experience on the national stage. She has no experience grappling with global affairs. She is clearly smart and talented, as many small-town mayors and newly minted governors are. But sorry, two years as governor in a state with fewer people than the city of San Francisco doesn't cut it.

Also, Palin has said she's "as pro-life as any candidate can be." She's not kidding. In a prior campaign, she came out against abortion even in cases of rape and incest. That puts her at odds with the vast majority of Americans: Fully 85 percent of voters think women who are raped or molested should have the right to a legal abortion.

This extremist stance on abortion puts her about 10 planets away from Hillary Clinton, a longtime supporter of reproductive rights. It also reveals an ideological chasm between Palin and Clinton's most ardent fans, women who came of age before Roe v. Wade.

On Friday, Palin appealed directly to Clinton's female base. ". . . Hillary left 18 million cracks in the highest, hardest glass ceiling in America," she said to cheers, "but it turns out the women of America aren't finished yet and we can shatter that glass ceiling once and for all."

There's no question, it's thrilling to have a woman in the race again. (I say that as an Obama supporter.) There's no question some women will vote for McCain entirely because of Palin's gender. I'm sure the media will ferret out all 27 of them and make them seem like a mass movement.

But are women -- particularly moderate pro-choice women -- really as impressionable as McCain hopes? Will they support any woman, at any price, just because it would be soooo exciting to get one step closer to the Oval Office?

No way, no how.

Scratch that. I hope not.
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
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Originally posted by: alchemize
Too bad his followers don't follow his advice:

?We don?t go after people?s families. We don?t get them involved in the politics. It?s not appropriate and it?s not relevant. Our people were not involved in any way in this and they will not be. And if I ever thought there was somebody in my campaign that was involved in something like that, they?d be fired,? Obama said.

Obama also said: ?This shouldn?t be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin?s performance as a governor or potential performance as a vice president. So I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories.?


and he ;)
 

davestar

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2001
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i'll try to bring it back to basics and propose my little theory here. candidates can be described in 4 interdependent measures:

Positions - What is candidate X for and against?
Plans - How does candidate X want the government to be involved with those positions
Experience - Does candidate X have a history consistent with said positions? Has the candidate been effective in his/her previous positions, whether public or private?
Gravitas - Is candidate X a person of substance, who inspires confidence, who, for the lack of a better term, gives "the warm fuzzies" to the voting public?

Why has the left jumped all over Sarah Palin? Here's why:

Positions - 2/10 - She's far right. No surprises here.
Plans - 2/10 - We haven't heard too much, though she does support drilldrilldrill, overturning Roe v Wade, etc. Then again, she is the VP, so this isn't terribly important... unless she wants to pull a Cheney.
Experience - 2/10 - Mayor of a *small* town, governor of a small (population-wise) unrepresentative (of the US as a whole) state. Left that small town heavy in debt while relying on an administrator to do most of her day-to-day work. Supported heavy pork-barreling as long as it's convenient. Tried to fire people who got on her (or her sister's) bad side.
Gravitas - 2/10 - Is quick to make and punish political enemies. Is willing to put her family through public scrutiny at a time when any sane family would hunker down protectively. Given her mother's stance on abortion and abstinance, Bristol Palin is now a political playing card, no matter how the media treats the issue.

There's a few redeeming things about McCain (though there were more in 2000), but Palin is nothing but naked pandering to the far right and an insulting attempt to grab Clinton supporters - insulting because it reveals the McCain camp's belief that Clinton supporters are stupid enough to overlook McCain/Palin's stances and vote R.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,133
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Funny how Palin is scaring away the independents from McCain to Obama. McCain gambled and is losing. I swear, I haven't heard one good thing about her since her Friday introduction. Surely there must be something positive other than what was already said on Friday.

BTW, am I the only person who thinks that she wears the pants in her home? Her husband looks effeminate.
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
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Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think there is genuine concern McSenile nominated a total nobody out of right field who has no qualifications at all to be President simply to try to win an election, and the consequences, if he dies, be damned. It's damn sad and pathetic.

Unlike Obama?

Palin might not be the most qualified but she is substantially more qualified than Obama.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
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Originally posted by: alchemize
Too bad his followers don't follow his advice:

?We don?t go after people?s families. We don?t get them involved in the politics. It?s not appropriate and it?s not relevant. Our people were not involved in any way in this and they will not be. And if I ever thought there was somebody in my campaign that was involved in something like that, they?d be fired,? Obama said.

Obama also said: ?This shouldn?t be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin?s performance as a governor or potential performance as a vice president. So I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories.?

Didn't read the thread, did you? Of course you didn't. Palin's daughter and family are barely mentioned at all in these 5 pages so far. The most references I've found are in ProJo's sig line. It's everything else about her that we are discussing. But thanks for chiming in.
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
1
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Originally posted by: Don Vito Corleone
Speaking as a Democrat, I am loving the whole thing. She is a questionable choice at best, and it's apparent she wasn't thoroughly vetted - more of an impulse buy, like the National Enquirer and gum in the supermarket. I have posted this in another thread, but it reminds me of President Bush's choice of Harriet Miers for the Supreme Court. When the dust settles Palin will be a liability to her ticket, not an asset, and she will provide a whole lot of entertainment in the process.

Have you seen who is at the top of the Democratic ticket, I think that is the definition of liability.
 

davestar

Golden Member
Oct 21, 2001
1,787
0
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Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think there is genuine concern McSenile nominated a total nobody out of right field who has no qualifications at all to be President simply to try to win an election, and the consequences, if he dies, be damned. It's damn sad and pathetic.

Unlike Obama?

Palin might not be the most qualified but she is substantially more qualified than Obama.

Putting the label "executive" on her VERY limited experience does not make her more qualified than Obama.
 
Oct 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Is it truly because there is small chance that a conservative home-maker may finally break that last glass ceiling instead of a true feminist like Hillary?

Is that where all this anti-Palin anger is coming from?

The angst comes from the possibility that a brainless religious mystic Christian wacko moron could become president. She might make a great president for Jesusland or some other Christian theocracy, but not for the U.S.


 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
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Originally posted by: Perknose
-snip-
A person who NOW says she is against earmarks, but who, as mayor of a town of 6,000 or so people, hired a paid lobbyist to go to Washington to suck off the federal teat and came away with 28 million dollars worth of earmarks, out of our tax money?

I don't confuse the poeple who ask for tax money with those who give it away.

Requesting != granting

IMO, it's Congresses fault for giving it away, I do not blame those who requested it.

Nor do I see how (successfully) asking for funds is any type of a indicator of giving (earmarks) freely.

As mayor or governorshe'd be stupid not to garner what she could for her city/state. We should all know by now that whatever she declined to accept for her city/state would have had zero impact on the natuional deficit. The money would have just been given to some other earmak/project.

Fern
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
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Originally posted by: Ballatician
Has anyone posted about her church's views? I read some story about her anti-Jewish preacher and seeing how important Jeremiah Wright was in people judging Obama, I'm surprised it hasn't been made a bigger deal.

Interesting. It seems her pastor, Larry Kroon, invited David Brickner of Jews for Jesus to speak in front of the Wasilla Bible Church (Palin's regular church) just 2 weeks ago, where he said that terrorist attacks on Jews are God's judgment for their failure to embrace Christianity. And it is known that Palin was present for the sermon. It's a bit thin, but worrying none the less.

Text
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
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Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think there is genuine concern McSenile nominated a total nobody out of right field who has no qualifications at all to be President simply to try to win an election, and the consequences, if he dies, be damned. It's damn sad and pathetic.

Unlike Obama?

Palin might not be the most qualified but she is substantially more qualified than Obama.

Seriously. I mean Alaska's next to Russia and Canada...she has to have developed keen foreign policy knowledge by osmosis!
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
1
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Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?


He is a Democrat so the same standards don't apply.
 

seemingly random

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 2007
5,277
0
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Originally posted by: Atomic Playboy
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
No one questions if Obama is being a bad dad by bringing his two young children to the White House.
No one questioned if JFK was a poor father for bringing newborn JFK Jr to the White House.
No on questioned if Biden was being a bad dad when he suddenly became a single dad and decided to take his Senate seat instead of spending more time with his kids. In fact, he claims he was encouraged to take his Senate seat.

But now a female wants to take her young family to Washington and it is "OMG what a horrible mother she is!!!!"

Are you daft? The only reason people attacked her parenting was because her teenage daugter got pregnant out of wedlock. It has fuck all to do with her going off to Washington... I'm not even endorsing that viewpoint, mind you; I don't think parents can ever have full control of their offspring, certainly not at 17. But you are completely misrepresenting the (stupid) argument that people made, turning it into an unabashedly false accusation of sexism. If Obama's child was pregnant out of wedlock, maybe you'd have a basis for comparison. Then again, Obama doesn't favor abstinence-only education...
Surely this cad wouldn't misrepresent someone else's words. No, can't be - he has too much integrity and class for this kind of tactic...
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
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Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

An unqualified Democrat is better for the country than any of the stay the course GOP at this point.
No kidding. You think if Bush with his 7+ year of experience as President was able to run again he'd win? Experience of doing the job badly or of supporting failed policies isn't a positive.


Wasn't the same argument made 4 years ago?

I have a feeling he would stand a good chance against the citizen of the world.
 
Oct 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: Farang
Because it wasn't a harmless pander, McCain did not pick the most qualified person and instead he picked a woman solely so he could go after the woman vote and accuse the other side of sexism (which they are quick enough to do you know they'd planned it all along). A key theme of Obama's stump speech isn't "Let's elect the first black President" but her main theme is electing a woman to the Vice Presidency. I don't believe a vagina is relevant qualification for that office.

Right on. It's like making McCain's candidacy a joke. There were better candidates for the position.
 

ayabe

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2005
7,449
0
0
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?


He is a Democrat so the same standards don't apply.

Yeah, my litmus test goes a bit beyond being pro-choice.

You should try it sometime, you know broaden your standards, you might be a little more disappointed in your leaders.

Edit: And if we all do this together, we might not get fucked this time.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

He is a Democrat so the same standards don't apply.

I'm sorry, where did Palin get her Juris Doctorate at? What prominent law journal was she the senior editor of? Where did she teach constitutional law? How many bestselling books has she published? How many nationally-televised debates has she participated in? How many prominent 'household name' candidates did she defeat in a primary race for the White House?

And finally, what flavor was the kool-aid you drank? :roll:
 

Budmantom

Lifer
Aug 17, 2002
13,103
1
81
Originally posted by: davestar
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I think there is genuine concern McSenile nominated a total nobody out of right field who has no qualifications at all to be President simply to try to win an election, and the consequences, if he dies, be damned. It's damn sad and pathetic.

Unlike Obama?

Palin might not be the most qualified but she is substantially more qualified than Obama.

Putting the label "executive" on her VERY limited experience does not make her more qualified than Obama.


What has Obama been in charge of?
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: PokerGuy
Originally posted by: ayabe
Well let's start at the top.

She's just flat out unqualified

Well, if she's "flat out unqualified" to be the VP, then Obama -- who is equally unqualified -- is not a suitable candidate for president, right?

An unqualified Democrat is better for the country than any of the stay the course GOP at this point.
No kidding. You think if Bush with his 7+ year of experience as President was able to run again he'd win? Experience of doing the job badly or of supporting failed policies isn't a positive.

If Bush was able to run again I am sure he would win.

The Electoral College vote remains the same as 2000, 2004 and now.

In fact it may be even more red than 2004 especially if McCain wins Ohio.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
You should ask the American voters. Since Palin was selected on Friday McCain has dropped like a iron log in shallow water;

http://www.realclearpolitics.c...s_obama-225.html#polls
http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08.htm

The links you posted do not back up that assertion. The real clear politics aggregation of polls are all over the map, with an overall average placing Obama a mere +5.8 points above McCain.

Given the nation's discontent with the Bush Administration, and Obama's almost celebrity like following, one would think that he would command a more dominant lead...especially considering the post-DNC convention bounce and the alleged misgivings about the Palin decision.

Palin is fresh political meat and the latest media target...her speech will largely decide how the public perceives her appointment moving forward.

It's still a long road to November.