whoa - I just discovered ATA100

[Acanthus]

the fastest consumer drive, the WD 36GB raptor (revision 2) only transfers around 56MB/sec. Not even enough to satuate ATA-66.

 

[Thoreau]

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Or a prime example of an 8MB buffer vs 2MB.

 

[Palek]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that if you have two hard drives that are together capable of pushing over 66MB/s of data, you ARE holding them back if you connect them to a SINGLE ATA66 controller! In other words, let's say you have two hard drives each capable of 50MB/s transfer speeds. That is 100MB/s added up, which is much faster than what ATA66 can provide. So you CAN max out an ATA66 controller with two hard drives, can't you?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Palek
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that if you have two hard drives that are together capable of pushing over 66MB/s of data, you ARE holding them back if you connect them to a SINGLE ATA66 controller! In other words, let's say you have two hard drives each capable of 50MB/s transfer speeds. That is 100MB/s added up, which is much faster than what ATA66 can provide. So you CAN max out an ATA66 controller with two hard drives, can't you?

No, because if both drives are on the same channel, you can't access them at the same time anyway.

That's one of the advantages of putting your swap file(if you need one😉) on a seperate drive, it provides better throughput.

 

[ThisIsMatt]

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

 

[Palek]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: Palek
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that if you have two hard drives that are together capable of pushing over 66MB/s of data, you ARE holding them back if you connect them to a SINGLE ATA66 controller! In other words, let's say you have two hard drives each capable of 50MB/s transfer speeds. That is 100MB/s added up, which is much faster than what ATA66 can provide. So you CAN max out an ATA66 controller with two hard drives, can't you?

No, because if both drives are on the same channel, you can't access them at the same time anyway.

Are you sure about that? The controller can access only of the hard drives on the channel at any given time, however it can do that at the data rate of ATA133, or 133 MB/s. If you did not take buffering into account, the actual maximum transfer per channel would be somewhere between the unbuffered peak transfer rates of the two drives (depending on access distribution between the two) like you said, but once you include buffering, it is possible to achieve a maximum channel transfer rate larger than the transfer speed of either drives by effectively switching back and forth between master and slave (I'm not in California so I can use those words, HA!). Since it is necessary to place the data in the buffer first, and because switching carries an overhead, obviously the resulting speed will not be the exact sum of the transfer speeds of the two drives, but it will improve substantially. Or at least I would think so... I could be wrong...

That's one of the advantages of putting your swap file(if you need one😉) on a seperate drive, it provides better throughput.

You mean a separate channel, right?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Palek

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: Palek
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that if you have two hard drives that are together capable of pushing over 66MB/s of data, you ARE holding them back if you connect them to a SINGLE ATA66 controller! In other words, let's say you have two hard drives each capable of 50MB/s transfer speeds. That is 100MB/s added up, which is much faster than what ATA66 can provide. So you CAN max out an ATA66 controller with two hard drives, can't you?

No, because if both drives are on the same channel, you can't access them at the same time anyway.

Are you sure about that? The controller can access only of the hard drives on the channel at any given time, however it can do that at the data rate of ATA133, or 133 MB/s. If you did not take buffering into account, the actual maximum transfer per channel would be somewhere between the unbuffered peak transfer rates of the two drives (depending on access distribution between the two) like you said, but once you include buffering, it is possible to achieve a maximum channel transfer rate larger than the transfer speed of either drives by effectively switching back and forth between master and slave (I'm not in California so I can use those words, HA!). Since it is necessary to place the data in the buffer first, and because switching carries an overhead, obviously the resulting speed will not be the exact sum of the transfer speeds of the two drives, but it will improve substantially. Or at least I would think so... I could be wrong...

That's one of the advantages of putting your swap file(if you need one😉) on a seperate drive, it provides better throughput.

You mean a separate channel, right?

Yeah, seperate channel.

You're probably correct, but since we very rarely(at least in the scheme of things) read from the buffer, the point is pretty moot. That's why you don't really see much of an overall performance increase when you go to better interfaces, the only thing that changes is the burst speed.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

 

[0roo0roo]

of course u see a speed difference, ur new drive is loads faster. denser data = more read per rotation to begin with. id oubt your old hd maxed out ata66 to begin with.

 

[huesmann]

Originally posted by: beatmix01
2 words

serial-ata


wait for it.... wait for it...

What for?

 

[FelixDeCat]

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

 

[Beau]

Originally posted by: beatmix01
2 words

serial-ata


wait for it.... wait for it...

Already got it 😛

 

[yoda291]

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

 

[ThisIsMatt]

Originally posted by: yoda291

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

No he's not, because it does. Mine starts at over 67MB/s 😛

 

[FelixDeCat]

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: yoda291

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

No he's not, because it does. Mine starts at over 67MB/s 😛

See. Told you so.

 

[Shawn]

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: yoda291

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

No he's not, because it does. Mine starts at over 67MB/s 😛

and who says your benchmark software is reporting the data correctly?

 

[ThisIsMatt]

Originally posted by: iloveme2

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: yoda291

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

No he's not, because it does. Mine starts at over 67MB/s 😛

and who says your benchmark software is reporting the data correctly?

How about you suggest one the we can agree upon, then?

 

[RaynorWolfcastle]

ThisisMatt, no offense but I trust StorageReview's numbers over yours. StorageReview says 60.5 MBps on the MaXLine Plus II so I'm betting what ever software you're using is incorrectly getting the data at the beginning of the disk (there's some caching going on, maybe?).

 

[Sunner]

Here you go ThisIsMatt.

Hitachi's best vs Maxtor's best vs WD's best.
In the consumer space that is.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: yoda291

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat

Originally posted by: Eli

Originally posted by: ThisIsMatt

Originally posted by: PCMarine
Sorry to rain on your parade, but today's 7200 RPM IDE drives in no way reach above ATA66's sustained transfer rate of 66 mb/s. So jumping from ATA66 to ATA100/ATA133 is purely a marketing gimmick until faster hard drives are released. The "noticeable difference" which you "sensed" was a prime example of the placebo affect.

*Edit* damn too late

Umm, my 80gig maxtor reads over 66MB/s and bursts at over 80MB/s (not even sure how high since it goes off the chart).

No it doesen't.

Maxtor's top of the line drive, the 250gb MaXLine Plus II starts at 60.5mb/sec and ends 34.5. My Hitachi(IBM) 7K250 starts at 60.4mb/sec and ends at 32.9.

Now, if we're talking about Western Digital's 10000RPM Raptor,... It starts out at 72.2mb/sec and ends at 54.1mb/sec. :Q

Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

Actually, Eli is right.

No he's not, because it does. Mine starts at over 67MB/s 😛

No... It doesen't.

Not unless there's something you aren't telling us...

Originally posted by: FelixDeKat
Yes it does. Get a clue Eli.

See. Told you so.

pwn3d.

 

[manly]

Originally posted by: RaynorWolfcastle
ThisisMatt, no offense but I trust StorageReview's numbers over yours. StorageReview says 60.5 MBps on the MaXLine Plus II so I'm betting what ever software you're using is incorrectly getting the data at the beginning of the disk (there's some caching going on, maybe?).

I generally agree with you and Eli, but it is possible to momentarily burst at faster than 66 MB/s from the drive's onboard buffer. What StorageReview benches is sustained transfer rate, and as you guys noted, there is no ATA drive on the market that comes close to saturating ATA/100.