Discussion Which was worse, the riots in July or the Riot in January?

Which was worse, the Riots in July or the Riot in January?

  • July was worse...people lost their businesses.

    Votes: 19 43.2%
  • January was worse...people lost (faith?)...

    Votes: 25 56.8%

  • Total voters
    44

ultimatebob

Lifer
Jul 1, 2001
25,134
2,446
126
The fact that it was a single riot (so far, anyway) and not multiple riots in multiple cities like with George Floyd and Brianna Taylor easily answers this question for me.
 
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Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,986
1,388
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Let see, just from one city alone (Minneapolis) has about 1,500 buildings burned and/or destroyed from the riots during the summer. Not including other cities.


Minneapolis, St. Paul businesses face rising costs to demolish buildings damaged in riots - Minneapolis / St. Paul Business Journal (bizjournals.com)

Months after riots and fires damaged buildings in Minneapolis and St. Paul, business and property owners are absorbing a new blow: The costs of demolishing ruined structures and clearing their sites could be far more than their insurance will cover.

So much for "but...but..but...insurance will take care of it". Uh huh.

And before some of you put your own words as mine, wrong is wrong, it does not matter who does it.
 
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Nov 8, 2012
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Let see, just from one city alone (Minneapolis) has about 1,500 buildings burned and/or destroyed.


Minneapolis, St. Paul businesses face rising costs to demolish buildings damaged in riots - Minneapolis / St. Paul Business Journal (bizjournals.com)



So much for "but...but..but...insurance will take care of it". Uh huh.

And before some of you put your own words as mine, wrong is wrong, it does not matter who does it.

That and "The insurance companies will pay for it" is something that can only come from the mind of an incredibly moronic individual.

1) Deductibles are costly for anyone with half a brain.
2) Insurance doesn't magically replace everything. Also the bureaucracy of the insurance game is a headache to the point of people needing to get lawyers to prove their inventory of items that have to be replaced.
3) Insurance rates go up across the entire area to cover it.

So really, insurance isn't covering anything. It's all being absorbed and paid for by all the businesses in the area.
 

Roger Wilco

Diamond Member
Mar 20, 2017
4,119
6,151
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This week's "riot" was a premeditated coup. It was incited by the President and his cronies, and it was based on nothing but debunked bullshit.

The July riots were in response to centuries of verified injustice. Lots of people have died and lost property, but the causation cannot be debunked, because it is painfully obvious.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
20,920
5,543
136
This week's "riot" was a premeditated coup. It was incited by the President and his cronies, and it was based on nothing but debunked bullshit.

The July riots were in response to centuries of verified injustice. Lots of people have died and lost property, but the causation cannot be debunked, because it is painfully obvious.
I'm actually interested in what the general population of AT thinks about this. If we end up with a bunch of political declarations it will get moved to P&N.
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,828
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Are we sure the mods won't just stand aside and let the P&N rabble invade OT?
What if they (we) take hostages?

Anyone caught participating in this riot will be identified and prosecuted.

I'm just the media reporting on it though.... >_>
 
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pete6032

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2010
7,664
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July was more disruptive to my personal life and work situation, stores all around me were being broken into and looted and lots of the stores near me were closed down for multiple weeks. The night that looters started breaking into stores the next block over, it got a little too personal for my tastes. Lots of broken glass and graffiti everywhere on mornings after. But January was more disruptive to our national pride.
 
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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
We should leave it here so maybe there can be a rational discussion on the topic.

Both riots are bad for different reasons. The January insurrection is the worst of the two, but the rationalizations and lack of accountability for the riots in July partially set the stage for the riots in January...with Trump at the heart of both. I don’t see it as an either or but rather a continuous escalation.

So, insurrection is far far worst than rioting, but had there been zero tolerance accountability for the rioting, I don’t think things would have escalated to an insurrection.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
23,003
21,127
136
The Trump riots are far far worse. The nurturing of the mindset, buying into conspiracy theories and just insane lie after lie after lie, that brought the assault on the capitol, has been purposely sown and fermented by the president and his entire political movement and these people will expect nothing less from politics going forward. The looting last summer was primarily non-political opportunists and anarchists simply hijacking a legitimate social movement for their own gain. Also the violence was not encouraged by major Democratic politicians or their ambassadors in the slightest whereas Trump and his henchmen like Giuliani and others did it directly. Far far worse. It's an authoritarian fascist movement encouraged from the very top - they just happen to be very disorganized - just like Trump they suck at actually running things, just good at riling up idiocy. But the potential is there for far far worse if they get better leaders.
 
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shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
80,287
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Let see, just from one city alone (Minneapolis) has about 1,500 buildings burned and/or destroyed from the riots during the summer. Not including other cities.


Minneapolis, St. Paul businesses face rising costs to demolish buildings damaged in riots - Minneapolis / St. Paul Business Journal (bizjournals.com)



So much for "but...but..but...insurance will take care of it". Uh huh.

And before some of you put your own words as mine, wrong is wrong, it does not matter who does it.
There is ample evidence the people causing violence were not part of the BLM movement. They jumped in the crowds without asking and then started fires and broke into buildings.


EDIT:


BY CONTRAST

the people storming the capital were waving trump flags and singing trump chants and took pictures of themselves inside the capital and STATED their political positions constantly during the ordeal and bragged about starting a revolution.
 
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Nov 8, 2012
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There is ample evidence the people causing violence were not part of the BLM movement. They jumped in the crowds without asking and then started fires and broke into buildings.

It isn't difficult to condemn something after the fact and say "They weren't with us".

Who is being seen as part of the riot at the capital? Is it just the < 100 or so that went inside, broke windows, raided offices, etc?

Or is it ALL of them that participated in anyway? Exactly.


If you are a mob of people and SOME people are actively doing things like throwing bottles of piss, bricks, and rocks at police officers - and you allow them to jump back into the crowd and blend back in, you're the problem. You're the contributor. You are the reason that person won't be caught and arrested. Once something turns from peaceful protest to a riot - thats it. It's 100% over. Any participants are now a part of a riot and a contribution to the problem.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
23,003
21,127
136
So, insurrection is far far worst than rioting, but had there been zero tolerance accountability for the rioting, I don’t think things would have escalated to an insurrection.

There were plenty of videos of cops hurting and tear gassing protestors last summer. They just didn't make it onto right wing media which only made it look like a one way street, and made it look like every major city was burning for months and months, which is where these insurrectionists get their info from. These lunatics in the capitol would have done the exact same thing, George Floyd protests or not, because nothing would have changed if Trump lost the election, he started saying last spring if he lost the election it had to be fraud. He's been planning this sentiment for a while.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,125
30,076
146
"Rioting" for Injustice and Civil Rights vs "the right" to have your fever dream fantasies recognized as reality and to legitimize the overthrow of the world-wide pillar of democracy (as ironic as that can sound at times, it remains fundamentally true...from the common perspective of pretty much all other nations).

Tough call there, shooter.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
There were plenty of videos of cops hurting and tear gassing protestors last summer. They just didn't make it onto right wing media which only made it look like a one way street, and made it look like every major city was burning for months and months, which is where these insurrectionists get their info from. These lunatics in the capitol would have done the exact same thing, George Floyd protests or not, because nothing would have changed if Trump lost the election, he started saying last spring if he lost the election it had to be fraud. He's been planning this sentiment for a while.
I am not debating that. Zero tolerance means zero tolerance. That means if a police officer incited the violence, zero tolerance. If it’s a politician, zero tolerance. If it’s a member of BLM, zero tolerance. It’s insurrection if you attack the Capital Building or a federal courthouse, as both are symbols of a functioning democracy. The problem is that everyone is viewing the escalation from their respective social media bubbles. It’s been a year of social unrest fueled by Balkanization of our electorate. I would counter that had Trump somehow managed to win, we would be seeing similar unrest, just manifested differently.
 
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ondma

Platinum Member
Mar 18, 2018
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I am in my 70s, and have seen plenty of riots and peaceful demonstrations (60's race riots and peaceful demonstrations, Vietnam protests, Rodney King, last summer's protests, etc.). I agree bad things happened in those instances, and rioting and destruction are always tragic and deplorable.

However, in all those years, I have never seen anything even barely approaching the invasion of our nation's Capitol building, and duly elected lawmakers forced to hide in their offices and under desks. Never have I seen a sitting President overtly try to overthrow a proven legitimate election, like some third world dictator, by spreading outright lies over and over again, and those lies being supported by a large number of prominent politicians. In terms of property destruction, the earlier riots may have caused more physical damage, but nothing has even approached the horribleness of the attack on democracy we have seen since the Presidential election, culminating in the storming of the Capitol.