Which flavors of Linux should I install to get practice?

[Arkitech]

I guess Red Hat is a given, I'm thinking I should probably install both server and desktop versions. For the desktop version I plan on going with workstation w/ multi OS and for server I'm assuming the latest version of enterprise is the way to go.

Outside of Red Hat is there another version of Linux I should get familar with? Ubuntu perhaps?

 

[xSauronx]

which certs? you could probably do linux+ with most any distro, for Red Hat certs use centos, as red hat costs moola and CentOS is built off the Red Hat sources; they just remove the copyrights. you can get 5.3 now and run any updates when Cent has them ready, or wait til the 5.4 ISO is released.

are you going to install this on a box or run everything in a vm?

 

[Arkitech]

Originally posted by: xSauronx
which certs? you could probably do linux+ with most any distro, for Red Hat certs use centos, as red hat costs moola and CentOS is built off the Red Hat sources; they just remove the copyrights. you can get 5.3 now and run any updates when Cent has them ready, or wait til the 5.4 ISO is released.

are you going to install this on a box or run everything in a vm?

I'm going to run it on it's own box and connect remotely

thanks for the tip on CentOS, I just downloaded a copy. Ubuntu looks interesting, I'm gonna grab a copy of that as well just to play around with it.

 

[Nothinman]

I would suggest not worrying about the certs unless it's a job requirement or something. Concentrate on actually learning the system, anyone can pass a test.

 

[JD50]

If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

 

[her209]

Originally posted by: JD50
If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

I second this idea. Yep, it works great when you setup a new VM to boot and install from network (NFS/HTTP/FTP) using a kickstart file. All virtual.

 

[Arkitech]

Originally posted by: JD50
If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

ha, sounds cool. Can't wait to get started

any other ideas on projects I can get my feet wet with?

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: Arkitech

Originally posted by: JD50
If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

ha, sounds cool. Can't wait to get started

any other ideas on projects I can get my feet wet with?

how much experience do you have and what have you already done?

theres plenty to learn, Red Hat has a deployment guide on their web site, you can go through that and start doing things in CentOS that are in it. if you have some experience that should give you plenty to do with good enough instructions that you can google whatever you cant figure out.

 

[mcveigh]

Doing gentoo from stage 1 really taught me a lot about Linux basics and why certain programs are needed.
that was about 5-6 years ago. I imagine compiling everything on a quad core would be a lot faster than then

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: Nothinman
I would suggest not worrying about the certs unless it's a job requirement or something. Concentrate on actually learning the system, anyone can pass a test.

Agreed!

If all you want is... general experience... here's what I recommend (and do):

I've been running web sites for years (since '96 and multi-line dialup BBSs prior to the web) - owner/admin/mod - all over the world - BSD, Linux, IIS. They all have their pro n' cons, but you asked about the Big-L...

Running a Linux-powered web site - mail server - writing code - creating and maintaining sql dbs - and so forth, and so on, is an excellent way to get a handle on maintaining server apps. My current server distro of choice is CentOS - so add that to your list. It's very popular, and might afford you a job at a noc, tech support (or whatever), if you become proficient.

[ EDIT - Oops! I just realized CentOS has already been recommended twice. Good choice! ]

The thing is, servers are only half the battle. For the most part, you'll be shelling into a remote machine and working in /home, depending on your creds. Unless you're independently wealthy and are colo'ed, run a dedicated server (managed or unmanaged), et cetera, you'll never be able to get down to brass tacks. VPS is a good alternative, but the site will be running in a VM, and it won't give you the full experience, e.g. hardware indoctrination.

Desktops are a whole different ballgame. You can have all the experience in the world running servers, trying to keep your RAID arrays intact, et cetera and not know jack about how to properly implement Linux on the desktop, configure a high-end video card to work with buggy Flash software, compile drivers for weido WiFi cards, setup your CUPS, and all things specific to desktop boxes and notebooks...

Ubuntu is okay, I guess. I run it on some of my desktop machines - but, I prefer Linux Mint on my portables. Why? Mint is drop-dead gorgeous! The artwork is second to none, and it gives you bragging rights when showing off your laptop/netbook. Ubuntu is hideously ugly, and an embarrassment. I reserve it for machines that nobody will ever see.

Aesthetics aside, I wouldn't recommend either one as 'learning tools' (in the narrow sense). Ubuntu purposely makes certain things harder than necessary, so grandpa (or whomever) can't mess it up - and ridiculously easy in other areas (so any idiot can use it). IMHO, you're not going to learn much from Ubuntu. Linux Mint is a polished turd -- it's Ubuntu with lipstick. Mint makes up for some of the inadequacies in Ubuntu (and it's a joy to use) but not sufficiently problematic to exercise the brain.

Really, I would suggest installing (and uninstalling) multiple distros. That's what I do. It's a hobby of sorts. After a while, you'll start seeing where they cross-over... and that's where the general knowledge will come from, e.g. knowing how to do anything in any distro -- not just becoming experienced with Ubuntu, but not knowing grunt about OpenSuSE or Fedora. Installing a distro and sticking with it (exclusively) through thick n' thin is the way petty biases are formed. It becomes the ol' Chevy vs Ford argument (or Pepsi vs Coke) except with distros, you know?

I recommend going to DistroWatch and downloading (and installing) the Top-10 distros. Spend about a week with each one, and in a few months you'll have a good idea about how Linux on the desktop works.

I prefer a 12-month data spam: http://distrowatch.com/index.php?dataspan=52

Finally, once you're a know-it-all... branch out into the fringe distros. Linux Puppy, Gentoo, FreeBSD, Solaris. They all have their place(s) too, but they aren't mainstream enough to waste a lot of time on. Sure, they're interesting (and favored for some specific purposes) but they will serve to distract you from your stated goal (as I understand it).

Have fun!

 

[Arkitech]

Anyone know where I can get a dvd iso of centos 5.2? I've been trying to install 5.3 (livecd version for the past 3 days with no luck). So far could'nt get much help from the CentOS boards either.

edit: forget that request, just found it. I was looking in the wrong directory earlier

 

[konakona]

Originally posted by: JD50
If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

I am a huge noob here, but I would like to do this myself as well. As the first step, I am going to download the ISO for CentOS tomorrow. Where do I go from there?

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: konakona

Originally posted by: JD50
If you really want to use a separate box, You should run vmware server or virtualbox on it with multiple centos vms. That will be the easiest way to learn and you'll learn something about virtualization, which is also a good skill.

For example, you could have one VM that's a web server, then you can have a "good" vm and a "bad" vm. Configure the webserver so that you can connect to it from the good vm, but the bad vm is denied access. You can do a ton of stuff like that, vmware is incredibly useful for learning.

I am a huge noob here, but I would like to do this myself as well. As the first step, I am going to download the ISO for CentOS tomorrow. Where do I go from there?

that pretty much depends on your level of experience and what hardware you have to use. do you mean you want to know how to set up a virtual machine or how to configure various VMs for learning purposes?

 

[konakona]

Well, I fiddled with ubuntu on a couple of my computers, have used some redhat at school for classes. I am pretty familiar with vbox using the windows client, but not sure what vmware server is, never used vmware before. Is that a specific version of vmware? Is JD50 suggesting that OP (and me, for that matter) should install centos as a base OS on that separate box, then run the virtualization client on it, or just use whatever base OS to run virtual centOS clients? Again, excuse my ignorance. When I did toy around ubuntu it was strictly for desktop use.

 

[xSauronx]

Originally posted by: konakona
Well, I fiddled with ubuntu on a couple of my computers, have used some redhat at school for classes. I am pretty familiar with vbox using the windows client, but not sure what vmware server is, never used vmware before. Is that a specific version of vmware? Is JD50 suggesting that OP (and me, for that matter) should install centos as a base OS on that separate box, then run the virtualization client on it, or just use whatever base OS to run virtual centOS clients? Again, excuse my ignorance. When I did toy around ubuntu it was strictly for desktop use.

Im not really sure what kind of experience you *want* on top of all this, but here goes

You can install CentOS as your base os (called the "Host" when dealing with virtual machines) and configure Xen or something (you need to look into that, should have a few options like Xen, KVM i think, and vmware server, maybe more)

Since you dont have much linux experience by the sound of it, you need to start googling how to configure CentOS as a VM Host, then go from there.

Or you can install VMWare Server (VMWare is a well-known VM software company) which is free, in windows or linux, and use that to install operating systems from an ISO. Windows and Linux shouldnt be a problem.

Be it windows or linux as the host, you can then install and (if you have a decent rig) run multiple VMs at once. So you can install CentOS with a basic install and get that like you want it, shut it down, and copy that image so that you can configure one instance of it as a Web Host, or as file servers, DNS, whatever you want to play with.

Again, do some research. Theres already a *lot* of information on these topics out on the web, and since you dont know much about it all and want to learn, you need to do a bit of reading to get up to speed, I expect.

 

[Kadarin]

For XenServer, you would essentially dedicate a box to it and have Xen as your host OS, and you would create VMs for whatever operating system that you can RDP or SSH to from another host.

http://www.citrix.com/lang/Eng....asp?ntref=hp_promo_2a

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: Nothinman
I would suggest not worrying about the certs unless it's a job requirement or something. Concentrate on actually learning the system, anyone can pass a test.

Catch is, how are you going to convince an employer you know what you're doing with out industry standard certifications and degrees? Saying you fiddled with setting up multiple VMs of CentOS and compiled Gentoo from scratch doesn't quite have the same wait as saying you have an RHCA or RHCE.

The Red Hat certs are very much respected, with LPI's LPIC line probably second. CompTIA's Linux+ is a mixed bag, and I don't think Canonical's UCP cert has gained much traction though. LPI, CompTIA, and Canonical's test are all written, I believe, no hands on section. The Red Hat tests are both written and hands on.

There are good study guides for all these programs though, which in additional to helping you prepare for the tests, also teach a lot about the OS.

 

[Nothinman]

Catch is, how are you going to convince an employer you know what you're doing with out industry standard certifications and degrees? Saying you fiddled with setting up multiple VMs of CentOS and compiled Gentoo from scratch doesn't quite have the same wait as saying you have an RHCA or RHCE.

Well, the OP doesn't say that he's doing it in order to look for a job. Certs will make getting an interview easier, but if all you did was concentrate on passing the tests you'll look like an idiot in that interview. And nothing will be real experience. I have no Linux certs and I consistently get emails from head hunters about Linux admin jobs.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: Nothinman

Catch is, how are you going to convince an employer you know what you're doing with out industry standard certifications and degrees? Saying you fiddled with setting up multiple VMs of CentOS and compiled Gentoo from scratch doesn't quite have the same wait as saying you have an RHCA or RHCE.

Well, the OP doesn't say that he's doing it in order to look for a job. Certs will make getting an interview easier, but if all you did was concentrate on passing the tests you'll look like an idiot in that interview. And nothing will be real experience. I have no Linux certs and I consistently get emails from head hunters about Linux admin jobs.

I would imagine, based on your knowledgable posts, that you have quite a bit of experience in the IT field though That being said, I agree with your point; however, for someone who has not made a name for his/herself in the industry, a cert can be a good starting place. With that in mind, I will also say that if you are only getting certs just to have them, you are selling yourself and others short and missing the point.

-Kevin

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: Nothinman

Catch is, how are you going to convince an employer you know what you're doing with out industry standard certifications and degrees? Saying you fiddled with setting up multiple VMs of CentOS and compiled Gentoo from scratch doesn't quite have the same wait as saying you have an RHCA or RHCE.

Well, the OP doesn't say that he's doing it in order to look for a job. Certs will make getting an interview easier, but if all you did was concentrate on passing the tests you'll look like an idiot in that interview. And nothing will be real experience. I have no Linux certs and I consistently get emails from head hunters about Linux admin jobs.

Once you've gotten your foot in the door of a firm and have worked in a linux admin position, you gain invaluable experience. And there's no substitute for real experience, you and I can agree 100% of that.

I'm looking at the OPs position from the perspective of someone who wants to work in the field and earn a living with it. Since its likely that your resume will first be seen by an HR type who will know very little about computing or *nix, having the degrees and certs will make those key words stand out.

Getting every linux cert under the sun is likely a waste of time, but getting a few shows that your motivated, can learn to achieve a goal, makes your resume stand out, etc.

I still maintain that certs, Linux, Microsoft, Novell, etc, are all good to have for this purpose.

 

[iGas]

If you want to learn.

For RPM base, try CentOS as suggested, Mandriva, OpenSUSE, or RedHat.

Mint, Ubuntu, and Debian (the granddady of source packages) for DEB base.

If you must be different then try Arch for Pacman, Vector for TLZ, or Gentoo for SRC. (I have tried all 3 several times over the years, and IMHO they all are time consuming to setup/config/and add programs, but are great as learning tools, and are not for the faint of heart).

I you are looking at security or learning something that is Unix base, then OpenBSD & NetBSD will fill that niche.

Or, roll your own Linux from scratch if you really want to learn.

<--- former network security coder that have to rolled our own firewall/mesh routing network/round robin database storage (back end & front end).