Which CPU to compliment 7800 GTX and 7800GTX SLI ?

[1000]

I'm upgrading at the moment and have decided to get a 7800GTX in my new rig. I MIGHT get a second one depending on how a single card performs over the first few months.

I am also upgrading to an Athlon 64 processor. THe two I am considering are:

1. Athlon 64 3800+ x2 dual cire
2. Athlon 64 4000+ single core

My question is, will either CPU bottleneck a 7800GTX or 7800GTX x2 in SLI ?


1000


1000

 

[demenion]

I would say get a X2 3800+

They are more future proof and most 3800+'s can hit 2.4-2.5 ghz easily.

 

[lopri]

GTX SLI: Definitely will be hindered by either CPU.

GTX Single: Dpends on the games and/or settings. You should consider your monitor's capability and your favorite settings (resolutions, AA/AF, etc.)

Still, I think even 4000+ would bottleneck a GTX in most cases unless you overclock it ever so slightly. (like to 2.6GHz) That seems the case with my 4800+. (O/C'ed to 2.75)

Right now GPU is ahead of CPU when it comes to gaming.

lop

 

[1000]

Do the new Nvidia drivers than are optimised for AMD dual-core change the situation here ?

 

[KoolDrew]

I would say get a X2 3800+

 

[imported_Amuro]

Originally posted by: 1000
Do the new Nvidia drivers than are optimised for AMD dual-core change the situation here ?

Yeah, the new 81.82/81.84 drivers take advantage of dual-core cpus. Also, future games like FEAR, CO2, etc, are all GPU limited.

 

[jiffylube1024]

The 4000+ is overpriced for what you get. The 3800+ is a good deal, but it becomes a great deal if you overclock it. Pick up a Thermalright XP-90, and you should have no problems clocking it to 2.5 Ghz (many people here are getting even more than that out of their chips).

 

[DRavisher]

I think a better question is something like: What CPU do I need to keep a 7800GTX running playable framerates in all current and soon-to-come games. Do you really care if your A64 3200+ is bottlenecking your 7800GTX to 234FPS at 800x600?

Edit: Sorry, don't know the answer to that question. I am not comletely updated on CPU benchmarks these days.

 

[1000]

OK, so if I chose the 3800+ x2 ... do I need RAM that will overclock beyond standard DRR @400mhz, or can I overclock the CPU without pushing the RAM harder ?

 

[forumposter32]

http://firingsquad.com/hardware/athlon_64_geforce_7800_gtx_scaling/page5.asp

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/200508011/athlon_64_x2_3800-07.html#directx_8

The first link shows you CPU scaling with the 7800 GTX.

The second link shows you the X2 3800+ at 136 fps in UT2004 while the 4000+ is at 160 fps. That's quite a difference. With the drop in performance you suffer, you may as well get an X2 4800+. But, it's way too expensive.

I know people hate me for this but you'd save a tremendous amount of money by just buying either a socket 754 3400+ or a 3700+. That way, you can save your money to buy a dual core that's worth it next year (for a lot less). Who wants to pay over $600 US when you can get almost the same performance (in gaming presently anyway) for a lot less (ewiz has the 3700+ for $158 US). See more here...
http://www23.tomshardware.com

\EDIT: I just thought of something peculiar. If the X2 4800+ was $300 US next year (doesn't seem likely, but anyway), the total cost would be $450 US if you spent $150 US this year on a CPU. So, you'd save $150 US overall. But then you'd have to buy another motherboard so you can use that CPU. So, maybe you're better off with a socket 939 3500+ so you can later upgrade to a dual core without spending on another motherboard. However, next year socket M2 will be out. Oh well, it's a tough choice.

 

[mrkun]

If you're really willing to spend the money for a 7800 GTX SLI rig, I would get the 3800 X2 (you are overclocking, right?) and a 7800 GT right now. Then, when the R580 comes out, upgrade to that -- rumor is Q1 '06.

 

[v8envy]

I know people hate me for this but you'd save a tremendous amount of money by just buying either a socket 754 3400+ or a 3700+.

There's a tremendous flaw with that plan. I can't find a good socket 754 motherboard with PCIx, never mind SLI capability.

I'm in the same boat. I see absolutely no reason to pay a $100 premium for socket 939. It's impossible to future-proof a rig. I've done that for years now, and not once was it cost effective to upgrade vs. rip and replace, and re-use the old mofoboard and cpu for a computer for the kids/parents/relatives/myth/doorstop.

Of course if you DO know of a socket754 board that isn't junk, please feel free to educate me. I'd be very appreciative.

 

[haveblue]

I have a 3800+ single core, which is the same as the 4000+ but with 512kb cache.. it doesn't seem to limit my 7800GTX too much.. it would if I had SLI though..

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: v8envy

I know people hate me for this but you'd save a tremendous amount of money by just buying either a socket 754 3400+ or a 3700+.

There's a tremendous flaw with that plan. I can't find a good socket 754 motherboard with PCIx, never mind SLI capability.

I'm in the same boat. I see absolutely no reason to pay a $100 premium for socket 939. It's impossible to future-proof a rig. I've done that for years now, and not once was it cost effective to upgrade vs. rip and replace, and re-use the old mofoboard and cpu for a computer for the kids/parents/relatives/myth/doorstop.

Of course if you DO know of a socket754 board that isn't junk, please feel free to educate me. I'd be very appreciative.

I don't know how good it is but Epox came out with a Socket 754 SLI board a little while ago.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: haveblue
I have a 3800+ single core, which is the same as the 4000+ but with 512kb cache.. it doesn't seem to limit my 7800GTX too much.. it would if I had SLI though..

I think all CPUs limit 7800GTX SLI, it's just a matter of degree. I had a 3800+ pushing my 7800GTX SLI until yesterday, it was a very pleasant limitation to have.

(i.e. it performed very well)

BTW- I've got a 4600+ now, and I'm not expecting much for gains except on games nV optomizes the drivers to use the dual core with the SLI.

 

[forumposter32]

Originally posted by: v8envy
Of course if you DO know of a socket754 board that isn't junk, please feel free to educate me. I'd be very appreciative.

Mine is not bad. I tried demos of Far Cry, BF2, Call of Duty2, Serious Sam2, America's Army and I have the full version of UT2004 and UT99. Only thing is, I found a little static in the speakers while playing UT99. Can't explain that yet. And in COD2, I could not put AA on, but that was probably the fault of my card, LOL.

Anyway, I put a Zalman NB47J on the northbridge chipset and disabled PEG Link Mode in BIOS. That might be the only major things I did although I don't have SLI, I want to get a Geforce 8 or ATI equivalent next year. But it does have Firewire and a MIDI game port you can add. I'd like to try it out with my Casio keyboard but I'm too lazy for now.

 

[Polish3d]

Notice the limitation is mainly just w/o AA enabled, I mean who buys a GTX to run 150fps w/ no AA at 1024

 

[1000]

Well, I bit the bullet. I decided that if I was going to upgrade there would be no compromises. I ordered an Athlon 64 4600+ x2. No overclocking, no stress and 2 solid cores to let my 7800gtx breathe when I get it.

Thanks for all the help

1000

 

[forumposter32]

Be sure to read the threads on the gaming problems with dual cores. There are many threads here on that.

 

[Topweasel]

Originally posted by: forumposter32
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/athlon_64_geforce_7800_gtx_scaling/page5.asp

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/200508011/athlon_64_x2_3800-07.html#directx_8

The first link shows you CPU scaling with the 7800 GTX.

The second link shows you the X2 3800+ at 136 fps in UT2004 while the 4000+ is at 160 fps. That's quite a difference. With the drop in performance you suffer, you may as well get an X2 4800+. But, it's way too expensive.

I know people hate me for this but you'd save a tremendous amount of money by just buying either a socket 754 3400+ or a 3700+. That way, you can save your money to buy a dual core that's worth it next year (for a lot less). Who wants to pay over $600 US when you can get almost the same performance (in gaming presently anyway) for a lot less (ewiz has the 3700+ for $158 US). See more here...
http://www23.tomshardware.com

\EDIT: I just thought of something peculiar. If the X2 4800+ was $300 US next year (doesn't seem likely, but anyway), the total cost would be $450 US if you spent $150 US this year on a CPU. So, you'd save $150 US overall. But then you'd have to buy another motherboard so you can use that CPU. So, maybe you're better off with a socket 939 3500+ so you can later upgrade to a dual core without spending on another motherboard. However, next year socket M2 will be out. Oh well, it's a tough choice.

In those bench marks you mention the loss of ~20 FPS on UT4 (a 2.5-3yr game) and in that review you can see it with ET and some other old as game where those losses in FPS where insignificant due to how high the FPS was. In the other more recent benchmarks thir is also almost no difference outside 3Dmark which the difference is about 500 points.
The DC Nvidia drivers can be had in beta form and should be out shortly. I deffinately recomend the 3800+ for a single GTX SLI I would suggest you wait a little bit on the second GTX and pick up a better CPU 4400+ or FX55.

 

[imported_Amuro]

Be sure to download and install the AMD driver for dual-core cpus. It soleves some of the weird performance anomalies. There's also a hotfix from microsfot.

 

[Sentry2]

Just turn off Cool and Quiet... that's all you have to do

 

[forumposter32]

Topweasel, I chose the UT2004 benchmark partly because it uses the CPU heavily compared to the GPU.

You also suggest that the difference percentagewise does not make that much of a difference. I think it does. I would in my opinion because if you look at the benchmarks on CPU scaling with the 3000+, you see it's way behind in some games compared to the other CPUs listed.

Whatever, there are different ways of looking at things but since I built a system this summer for the first time and then replaced many components only 3 months later, I like to look at benchmarks etc with a pessimistic point of view now, not optimistic. That's why I recommend single core and the most powerful ones like the 3700+.

But, that's just my opinion. It's probably the last word for me on that.

 

[imported_Amuro]

Originally posted by: Sentry2
Just turn off Cool and Quiet... that's all you have to do

The driver fixes the cool and quiet issues.

 

[nitromullet]

Honestly, I'm not sure if many of the issues people are having are actually related to dual core or not. I was reading one of the gaming issues with dual core threads because I had a bit of a stability issue with my rig. I stumbled across a post about disabling the Marvel onboard NIC on the Asus K8N-SLI boards, claiming that it solved a lot of issues. Sure enough, as soon as I disabled the Marvel NIC and switched back to the NV NIC the system has been rock stable. Not sure why the Marvel NIC/drivers are crappy enough to make the rig unstable, but it is. ...Just figured I'd mention this because I really fixed the one major disappointment I had with this rig.

Back OT, pretty much any CPU except for an FX-55 or 57 is going to be bottlenecked. The benchmarks make me sick... All these review sites and their $1k+ CPU's... My 4200+ can't touch their 3DMark scores... I barley break 10K with 2 KO's in SLI, although the score has improved (slightly) with the 81.84 Forceware. Games play awesome though, so I don't worry too much about the 3DMock score. I wish I had access to an FX-55 though, just to see if there is any noticable difference between that and the 4200+.