Assuming money is not a *huge* issue, what cpu in the 150-200ish dollar range will OC the highest without super great RAM?
I am looking at core 2s
I am looking at core 2s
E4400 or E4500. High quality JEDEC 1.8V DDR2 667 should be good enough to take a capable chip up to 3.4GHz.
E6750, hands down. It's one of the best price to performance CPU's on the market today. Doesn't sound like you're interested in the Uber-O/C, but something simple, easy, and cool-running that doesn't require exotic heatsinks, or a handful of fans at tornado levels.
Reasonably cheap DDR800 will put you at a 3.2 O/C with everything stock in a matter of minutes. How does that sound? Want to go higher? You'll have to crank your vcore voltage, and that will mean your heatsink, case, and fans better be up to it. Folks are getting O/C's of 3.6-3.8GHz with the cooling solutions mentioned. E4xxx's are old tech IMO - 800fsb, 2mb cache - 130 bucks. Compared to the E6750's 1333fsb, 4mb cache, G0 stepping, at 190 bucks. You did say money wasn't the determining factor? I'm not even digging deeply into your wallet. Enjoy!
Regards,
Denithor
Diamond Member
- Apr 11, 2004
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A-Data 2 x 1GB DDR2-800 for $35 after MIR
Abit IP35-E for $96 (or $84 after MIR at ZZF)
e4500 for $127 shipped
The e4500 will save you $50 versus the e6550 and $70 versus the e6750 and should overclock to about the same point. As pointed out in the recent UT3 benchmark there isn't a huge performance difference between 2MB and 4MB cache. I know I wouldn't pay an extra 40-55% premium in price for a measely 4-8% increase in performance.
Abit IP35-E for $96 (or $84 after MIR at ZZF)
e4500 for $127 shipped
The e4500 will save you $50 versus the e6550 and $70 versus the e6750 and should overclock to about the same point. As pointed out in the recent UT3 benchmark there isn't a huge performance difference between 2MB and 4MB cache. I know I wouldn't pay an extra 40-55% premium in price for a measely 4-8% increase in performance.
Nice article - I really do rely on AnandTech reviews - they're sensible. And I've read that one. We sure came away with different interpretations. Here's what I see:
I see a 27-35% increase in performance between the E4500 and the E6750 - at stock speeds.
I see a chart that says O/C does yield performance increases, but in no way are they linear as one might expect.
I see this statement regarding O/C:
"Over a 66.5% increase in clock frequency, overall performance goes up less than 28%. Things like L2 cache size and microprocessor architecture in particular seem to matter more here than raw clock speed."
What's your point again, Denithor?
If this is your point - that these two chips can O/C to the same levels, maybe you ought to clarify that for the OP - I'd be interested too.
OP's O/C parameter - doesn't want to use "super great ram."
Now maybe you're thinking that the E4500 can O/C to the same speed levels as the E6700? Are you saying you can clock it to 3.6, or 3.7, maybe 3.8ghz on ordinary ram? Check your head.
Or are you saying that you can O/C the E4500 to the same "percentage" levels is the E6750? There, you are correct. But I'm bettin' a nickel that's not what you meant at all. Is it..
Regards,
It's all about multipliers. All Core2 except the extreme have a locked multiplier. In order to OC you do 2 things.
1. Raise Multiplier
2. Raise FSB
e4500 = 11 multiplier
e6750 = 8 muliplier
To get the e4500 to 3.6ghz you need 327FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR654
To get the e6750 to 3.6ghz you need 450FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR900
If you got crap ram, e4500 wins.
Dividers go from 1:1 to increasing the Memory Speed relative to FSB. There's nothing to make memory speed lower than FSB.
Your 680i has the ability to increase memory speed relative to FSB.
I don't think there are any NF4 motherboards that support C2D but I could be wrong.
I don't think there are any NF4 motherboards that support C2D but I could be wrong.
mlhm5
Member
- Oct 28, 2007
- 92
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e2180 can hit 3.4GHz with no problem with ABIT ip35-e MB and others. Cost 89$ and you probably only give up 2% to the 6600.
e2180 stable at 3.5GHz with various MB
OC to a stable 3.4GHz by changing 2 settings
e2180 stable at 3.5GHz with various MB
OC to a stable 3.4GHz by changing 2 settings
@Kiaman -
"To get the e4500 to 3.6ghz you need 327FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR654
To get the e6750 to 3.6ghz you need 450FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR900
If you got crap ram, e4500 wins."
Wins what? Can you get the E4500 to 3.6Ghz without a huge bump to its vcore? And if the answer is "no", aren't you "living on the edge" of stability, necessitating pretty extreme cooling measures in an attempt to keep this O/C stable? That's a <60% overclock to do what my E6750 can do on 1.3650v. Again, if we're talking about "percentage" then the E4500 wins - you bet. I'm pretty sure that's not what the OP was asking, and I'm awfully sure that's not Denithor was saying when he was going on about "same levels of O/C."
Here's a pretty cool thread right here on Anandtech, talking about O/C'ing the E4500...
http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2099932&enterthread=y
And lest folks get the wrong impression, tip of the hat and all manner of props to the Intel boys for putting out a CPU at this price, with an eleven multiplier, and then slapping the M0 stepping on it. But even a cursory glance at Zach's thread will show you that 3.4-3.6ghz O/C's on that chip are gonna require volts somewhere around 1.45-1.6. I think 1.6v is pretty extreme to get a 3.6ghz. Kia, you're right in one sense - that multiplier will certainly allow "crap ram" some headroom, but it takes two to O/C, and you've got to to overvolt the bejezzuz outta that chip to run at speeds the E6750 can do pretty easily. But, hey, they're two different products at two different price points. Just not sure folks ought to be swaggering around, E4500 in hand, proclaiming it a "winner" in some O/C race. It's a good value, that chip, no question. But it's no 6750. In both cases, with these CPU's, you get more than you paid for, and that's the beauty of the C2D right now.
Regards,
"To get the e4500 to 3.6ghz you need 327FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR654
To get the e6750 to 3.6ghz you need 450FSB which at 1:1 comes to DDR900
If you got crap ram, e4500 wins."
Wins what? Can you get the E4500 to 3.6Ghz without a huge bump to its vcore? And if the answer is "no", aren't you "living on the edge" of stability, necessitating pretty extreme cooling measures in an attempt to keep this O/C stable? That's a <60% overclock to do what my E6750 can do on 1.3650v. Again, if we're talking about "percentage" then the E4500 wins - you bet. I'm pretty sure that's not what the OP was asking, and I'm awfully sure that's not Denithor was saying when he was going on about "same levels of O/C."
Here's a pretty cool thread right here on Anandtech, talking about O/C'ing the E4500...
http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2099932&enterthread=y
And lest folks get the wrong impression, tip of the hat and all manner of props to the Intel boys for putting out a CPU at this price, with an eleven multiplier, and then slapping the M0 stepping on it. But even a cursory glance at Zach's thread will show you that 3.4-3.6ghz O/C's on that chip are gonna require volts somewhere around 1.45-1.6. I think 1.6v is pretty extreme to get a 3.6ghz. Kia, you're right in one sense - that multiplier will certainly allow "crap ram" some headroom, but it takes two to O/C, and you've got to to overvolt the bejezzuz outta that chip to run at speeds the E6750 can do pretty easily. But, hey, they're two different products at two different price points. Just not sure folks ought to be swaggering around, E4500 in hand, proclaiming it a "winner" in some O/C race. It's a good value, that chip, no question. But it's no 6750. In both cases, with these CPU's, you get more than you paid for, and that's the beauty of the C2D right now.
Regards,
You are wrong about the dividers. I KNOW that motherboards can divide the FSB speed to get lower mem speeds.
VirtualLarry
No Lifer
- Aug 25, 2001
- 56,574
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Two things you both have in common - neither one of you posted anything that anyone could use.
If you KNOW of a mobo then list it or post a godam link to it on the web.
If you THINK someone is wrong then post some godam proof...calling people a liar does no one any good as it is your posted word against their's...and if that is all you are going to bother posting to accomplish then why bother?
Not a mistake at all, C2D unlike AMD64 is not sensitive to memory dividers, performance impact is minimal.
Well, according to AT articles, A64 does not have any intrinsic penalty from using a divider, because all memory speeds are a factor of the HT link speed (i.e. even default memory speed is achieved using a "divider").AT articles also confirm that the Core2 architecture benefits more from higher memory bandwidth than the A64 architecture (i.e. is more sensitive to memory speed).
Denithor
Diamond Member
- Apr 11, 2004
- 6,298
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I think the question was more aimed at the fact that none of the modern Intel chipsets have dividers below a 1:1 ratio so your memory has to be able to handle 2 x fsb speeds or it is your limiting factor in overclocking.
For the e21x0 and e4x00 series this is not an issue, with their base fsb at 200 even basic DDR2-667 will give a 66% OC at 1:1 and DDR2-800 will allow you to double cpu speed (if your cooling and cpu are up to the task).
The e6x00 and q6x00 series with their base 266 fsb can reach a 25%/50% OC with DDR2-667 and 800 respectively (still very little need for DDR2-1066 rated memory).
The e6x50 series and the new Penryn chips with the base 333 fsb get a 20% boost from DDR2-800 memory (most of which will clock significantly higher but not guaranteed). These chips are where DDR2-1066 (or even DDR3) memory begins to make more sense (DDR2-1066 will allow up to a 60% OC for fsb 333 processors at 1:1 before it has to be clocked faster than rated speed). Of course, most of these chips can't handle anywhere close to a 66% speed increase (4.26GHz for e6550, 4.8GHz for e6750) unless you also have extreme cooling installed and the chip can take the frequency so overclocked DDR2-800 will probably suffice for most ordinary cpu overclocking.
For the e21x0 and e4x00 series this is not an issue, with their base fsb at 200 even basic DDR2-667 will give a 66% OC at 1:1 and DDR2-800 will allow you to double cpu speed (if your cooling and cpu are up to the task).
The e6x00 and q6x00 series with their base 266 fsb can reach a 25%/50% OC with DDR2-667 and 800 respectively (still very little need for DDR2-1066 rated memory).
The e6x50 series and the new Penryn chips with the base 333 fsb get a 20% boost from DDR2-800 memory (most of which will clock significantly higher but not guaranteed). These chips are where DDR2-1066 (or even DDR3) memory begins to make more sense (DDR2-1066 will allow up to a 60% OC for fsb 333 processors at 1:1 before it has to be clocked faster than rated speed). Of course, most of these chips can't handle anywhere close to a 66% speed increase (4.26GHz for e6550, 4.8GHz for e6750) unless you also have extreme cooling installed and the chip can take the frequency so overclocked DDR2-800 will probably suffice for most ordinary cpu overclocking.
Zap
Elite Member
- Oct 13, 1999
- 22,377
- 7
- 81
I think that fact escapes some...
The Nvidia 6xx series chipsets allow asynchronous RAM operation. Indeed with the 650i SLI board I had, I could arbitrarily set RAM to whatever MHz I want. But yeah, all of the recent Intel chipset boards I've owned (P35, P965, 945G) have 1:1 as the lowest divider.
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