where to start for a 100% total noob at laying wire...

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
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5,713
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i just moved into a house over labor day weekend and had my fios installed the following day. it is a 4 level split level house.

the upstairs has basically 4 rooms in an L shape (think L shape on a chess board using 4 squares). the fios router was installed in the room that corresponds to the shorter part of the L shape.

what i would LIKE to do is basically set up a network, of both the internet cable AND the coaxial cable to all of the rooms.

my plan to do this was to somehow run this up to the attic, where i have a switch or router or something (again noob, no clue what i actually need here), then run the wire down the walls to each room, and have a wall jack that has both an ethernet port as well as a coaxial port so i can hook up the fios TV and internet in any room.

additionally, i plan on running one set of coaxial/ethernet cable down to the room that is basically directly below one of the rooms, which is going to make the wires end up in the laundry room. then from there, i can put a jack on the opposite side of the wall where my entertainment center is, where again, i want an ethernet and coaxial jack on there.

ssssssssssoooooooooooooo....

i'm basically asking where do i start as far as all of the equipment i will need. i don't even know exactly what kind of cables to get, if i need a switch up in the attic or a hub (or what the difference between them even is), or if i can just run all of the wires from the fios router that they gave me? i'm not sure what tools i need either, other than a drill and something to make holes in the wall where the jack goes. i don't know what kind of jacks/wires i need, etc.

basically i'm looking to ask if someone can point me in the right direction that will tell a noob what all is needed for this type of project, which in my eyes, seems like a pretty basic project.
 

nickbits

Diamond Member
Mar 10, 2008
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I wouldn't put a switch in an attic. Run all your lines to a closet or something and put it in there.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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I wouldn't put a switch in an attic. Run all your lines to a closet or something and put it in there.

that is definitely very plausible and i already know of a place I could do that.

but is a switch the piece of equipment i will need to pull this off?

again, total noob to this here.

if it is, i'm assuming i would run 1 wire from the FIOS router to the switch, then run a wire to each room from the switch that is on it's own port?
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_switch

Your assumption is correct. 1 cable from router to switch. Each device goes to switch.

ok thanks.

and one of these wires that i want to run to my basement to a wall jack.

then from that jack i am going to want to hook it to another router that i already own, so that i can have my ps3, 360, and possibly wdtv all hard wired.

all that will work just fine if i have it wired the way i just explained?
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
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Put another switch in the basement. switch to switch will work just fine. connect ps3, 360, and wdtv to the switch. voila.

if you put the router in the basement, then you will need additional configuration of that router.

edit: also, if you're already pulling one cable, might as well pull two....just in case you need to trouble shoot connection issues from basement to upper switch.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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Put another switch in the basement. switch to switch will work just fine. connect ps3, 360, and wdtv to the switch. voila.

if you put the router in the basement, then you will need additional configuration of that router.

edit: also, if you're already pulling one cable, might as well pull two....just in case you need to trouble shoot connection issues from basement to upper switch.

i see. i was just thinking router because i already had one, but if it means more configs, then f that!

yea technically i could pull as many as i wanted. maybe i will pull 4 down there and it will have it's own little 4 port panel. or maybe just a small switch that i can hide behind everything so only 1 wire is running from the wall.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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bumping this for a few specific questions I have as I'm going to be starting this project in the near future.

1. For personal home use, would Cat6 really have any benefit over Cat5e? I am in a developed neighborhood that has been around since the 60's with no industrial buildings or anything around.

2. I believe I need a switch that I will hook my FIOS router to, which I will then run wires from the switch to the different rooms. In my main basement area, I am going to have quite a few network devices wired in - 360, ps3, etc. Should I get another switch for down there, or should I use a router, or would a patch panel work for that? I would like to only have 1 wire going into the wall jack.

I believe that is all for now, thanks!
 

frowertr

Golden Member
Apr 17, 2010
1,371
41
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bumping this for a few specific questions I have as I'm going to be starting this project in the near future.

1. For personal home use, would Cat6 really have any benefit over Cat5e? I am in a developed neighborhood that has been around since the 60's with no industrial buildings or anything around.

No, not for home use. Cat5e as it is slightly easier to work with than Cat6 and its cheaper. No reason to upgrade IMO.

2. I believe I need a switch that I will hook my FIOS router to, which I will then run wires from the switch to the different rooms. In my main basement area, I am going to have quite a few network devices wired in - 360, ps3, etc. Should I get another switch for down there, or should I use a router, or would a patch panel work for that? I would like to only have 1 wire going into the wall jack.

So that you don't have to homerun a lot of cabeling back to your main switch at your router, I'd just use a switch in the basement and plug all your basement devices into that. Its the easiest and cheapest way to do it. Just make sure both switches are gigabit and connect them up with 5e cable. This allows you to only have to have one cable running back to your main router/switch.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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No, not for home use. Cat5e as it is slightly easier to work with than Cat6 and its cheaper. No reason to upgrade IMO.



So that you don't have to homerun a lot of cabeling back to your main switch at your router, I'd just use a switch in the basement and plug all your basement devices into that. Its the easiest and cheapest way to do it. Just make sure both switches are gigabit and connect them up with 5e cable. This allows you to only have to have one cable running back to your main router/switch.

thanks for the reply.

now let me ask you this...

i have a spare router sitting around that i bought a while back that has 4 ports on it.

would there be any benefit to buying a switch and using that in my basement, vs using the router that i already own?

also curious ... what makes cat5e easier to work with than cat6?
 

imagoon

Diamond Member
Feb 19, 2003
5,199
0
0
thanks for the reply.

now let me ask you this...

i have a spare router sitting around that i bought a while back that has 4 ports on it.

would there be any benefit to buying a switch and using that in my basement, vs using the router that i already own?

also curious ... what makes cat5e easier to work with than cat6?

Turn off DHCP on the router and it should act like a dumb switch.

Cat6 is thicker (thicker gauge wire and often there is a cable guide inside) and twisted tighter. Also any more than 3/8" of straight wires on the terminations would make it fail a CAT6 test.

As for the switching, my person preference was to pull more wires and terminate it all in the basement. It looks neater to me and was minimally more costly. I pulled 4 to my entertainment centers and currently am considering pulling another 2. There is nothing wrong with cramming a switch in the entertainment center though.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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Turn off DHCP on the router and it should act like a dumb switch.

Cat6 is thicker (thicker gauge wire and often there is a cable guide inside) and twisted tighter. Also any more than 3/8" of straight wires on the terminations would make it fail a CAT6 test.

As for the switching, my person preference was to pull more wires and terminate it all in the basement. It looks neater to me and was minimally more costly. I pulled 4 to my entertainment centers and currently am considering pulling another 2. There is nothing wrong with cramming a switch in the entertainment center though.

Yea I may get a 4 keystone jack and run 4 wires to it and just use that instead of connecting them to a router down there. I am going to just order the extra pieces and see how I want to do it.

Another noob question...

Do you all recommend running at least 1 extra wire along with the ones that are going to be live, and not wiring it up, just in case of a failure so you don't have to run another one later?
 

frowertr

Golden Member
Apr 17, 2010
1,371
41
91
Do you all recommend running at least 1 extra wire along with the ones that are going to be live, and not wiring it up, just in case of a failure so you don't have to run another one later?

Honestly, unless you manage to cut a Cat5e cable with a saw or something equally as devastating (which happens all the time with subcontractors cutting blindly into drywall in new construction) you shouldn't ever have a "failure". If you wire the ends up incorrectly you can always snip them off and rewire.

But there is nothing wrong with running a "backup" cable incase you decide to add another piece of hardware down the road. You could just leave it coiled up in the low votage box behind your keystone faceplates.
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
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I'm surprised nobody has addressed how you're going to be able to run the cabling through the finished walls. Don't you have fire breaks in the walls that would keep this from being non-trivial?
 

imagoon

Diamond Member
Feb 19, 2003
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0
0
Yea I may get a 4 keystone jack and run 4 wires to it and just use that instead of connecting them to a router down there. I am going to just order the extra pieces and see how I want to do it.

Another noob question...

Do you all recommend running at least 1 extra wire along with the ones that are going to be live, and not wiring it up, just in case of a failure so you don't have to run another one later?

If one failed, I would attach the new cable to the old and use it as a pull cord to bring a replacement in. On that note, spend the $20 and get pull cords and leave them installed with the wire.
 

imagoon

Diamond Member
Feb 19, 2003
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0
I'm surprised nobody has addressed how you're going to be able to run the cabling through the finished walls. Don't you have fire breaks in the walls that would keep this from being non-trivial?

Not sure about Europe but most single family residence in the US don't have fireblocks. That is more of a mutli-family / commercial / industrial building thing
 

Carson Dyle

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2012
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524
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Not sure about Europe but most single family residence in the US don't have fireblocks. That is more of a mutli-family / commercial / industrial building thing

I'm sure local building codes vary widely, but fire blocking is not at all uncommon in single family homes in the US. Even where the codes don't require it, many builders will add fire blocking to walls.

In any case, he'll know soon enough.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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I'm surprised nobody has addressed how you're going to be able to run the cabling through the finished walls. Don't you have fire breaks in the walls that would keep this from being non-trivial?

I don't know yet as I haven't done it yet. i know i can get it to my basement w/out doing any holes in walls though. its going to go from the corner of a closet into my utility room, and the wall there backs to where my entertainment center is.

i have a stud finder though and read how you can do some patchwork to get around fire breaks if need be. i'm going to be going up in my attic this weekend though to see if i can even just drop things down the wall.
 

frowertr

Golden Member
Apr 17, 2010
1,371
41
91
I'm surprised nobody has addressed how you're going to be able to run the cabling through the finished walls. Don't you have fire breaks in the walls that would keep this from being non-trivial?

1. Cut access hole/outlet box in dry wall between studs at the location you want your jack(s).
2. Proceed to attic and drill hole in header between the two studs you cut your access hole/outlet box.
3. Send wire snake down from attic to access hole/outlet box.
4. Go back to ground level and connect Cat5e to wire snake.
5. Go back to attic and pull wire snake/wire up through wall into attic.
6. Repeat the same process in another location to where you are terminating all your cable runs.
7. Win!

You are right. For a "100% total noob" this can be a difficult task not to mention there are some basic tools that are needed (i.e. wiresnake, drill, drill bits, drywall hand saw, etc...) Secondly, we also assume there is no insulation laid in the interior walls that will make the process magnitudes more difficult. My father's contractor put insulation in his interior walls, and while it vastly helps with soundproofing, it is a royal PITA to deal with when doing wire runs.

Secondly, we also assume there is attic space to work with. If not, then it may or man not be more difficult dealing with basement level work.

I've never run into any firewalls here in Florida. It's just standard 16" width vertical stud spacing. We also don't have basements here so just about everything is done in the attics unless we are talking about multiple story homes.
 
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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
5,713
126
1. Cut access hole/outlet box in dry wall between studs at the location you want your jack(s).
2. Proceed to attic and drill hole in header between the two studs you cut your access hole/outlet box.
3. Send wire snake down from attic to access hole/outlet box.
4. Go back to ground level and connect Cat5e to wire snake.
5. Go back to attic and pull wire snake/wire up through wall into attic.
6. Repeat the same process in another location to where you are terminating all your cable runs.
7. Win!

You are right. For a "100% total noob" this can be a difficult task not to mention there are some basic tools that are needed (i.e. wiresnake, drill, drill bits, drywall hand saw, etc...) Secondly, we also assume there is no insulation laid in the interior walls that will make the process magnitudes more difficult. My father's contractor put insulation in his interior walls, and while it vastly helps with soundproofing, it is a royal PITA to deal with when doing wire runs.

Secondly, we also assume there is attic space to work with. If not, then it may or man not be more difficult dealing with basement level work.

I've never run into any firewalls here in Florida. It's just standard 16" width vertical stud spacing. We also don't have basements here so just about everything is done in the attics unless we are talking about multiple story homes.

I do have attic space so that should be okay. Additionally I'm not 100% sure or not about the insulation, which again, is going to be something I'm going to have to check before I start doing all of this.

I do have all of the tools necessary so far other than some drill bits and the dry wall saw, but I'm waiting to make sure I can actually do this before I go out and get every last piece of equipment I need. I will know after this weekend whether I will be proceeding or not though.

I also have a friend who is going to probably help me out who has done all of this before himself, and works installing this type of stuff too.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
Keep in mind that wired connections for end users are going the way of the serial/parallel connections.

802.11ac is being fast tracked and even laptops are losing their ethernet.

With a proposed 2Gbps throughput right off the bat, it's insane. Sure people can argue 'they have 40GBps connections for wired!', no client machine should ever need that bandwidth and no one is talking about removing physical connections from the main pipes.

Rewiring existing construction is usually a nightmare. I'd focus on the key room(s) you absolutely need a physical connection and call it a day.
 

imagoon

Diamond Member
Feb 19, 2003
5,199
0
0
Keep in mind that wired connections for end users are going the way of the serial/parallel connections.

802.11ac is being fast tracked and even laptops are losing their ethernet.

With a proposed 2Gbps throughput right off the bat, it's insane. Sure people can argue 'they have 40GBps connections for wired!', no client machine should ever need that bandwidth and no one is talking about removing physical connections from the main pipes.

Rewiring existing construction is usually a nightmare. I'd focus on the key room(s) you absolutely need a physical connection and call it a day.

God I hope not. [removing the ethernet port] If it ends up anything like the 2.4ghz spectrum as a shared medium where in some cases 90% error frames are "ok" <shudder>

Granted this is 5ghz so the overlap should be lower.

Then again I guess from the "consumer" market this might not matter. I just haven't seen a wireless solution that is as stable as cable yet.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,967
19
81
God I hope not. [removing the ethernet port] If it ends up anything like the 2.4ghz spectrum as a shared medium where in some cases 90% error frames are "ok" <shudder>

Granted this is 5ghz so the overlap should be lower.

Then again I guess from the "consumer" market this might not matter. I just haven't seen a wireless solution that is as stable as cable yet.

It's an enterprise solution. There is too much to go into with laymen here, but all the whitepapers are easily obtainable.

CPU speeds and the like are allowing more and more 'common patterns' to be sent instead of bit by bit basically.