When Your Dog . . .

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
I'm just shocked....... and awed.

Isn't this the same number Rumsfield was claiming as the size of the Iraqi army before the last election?
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
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Cheney: Tells CBS there is ``Major progress'' in Iraq. Dems disagree.


The following is a fact sheet from DNC Research on Vice President Cheney?s irrational exuberance on Iraq:


Cheney?s Irrational Exuberance

This weekend marks the third anniversary of start of the war in Iraq. Today, Vice President Cheney appeared on Face The Nation to discuss the war in Iraq, and refused to give straight answers to basic questions about the Iraq war. Instead, he continued the Bush Administration?s commitment to a failed strategy in Iraq.

CHENEY: I don't [agree that Iraq is in a civil war], Bob. I think the assessment that we get from General George Casey who is our man commanding in Iraq, from the Ambassador?from John Abizaid who is the General in charge of Central Command doesn't square with that. [Face The Nation, 3/19/06]

Former Iraqi Interim Prime Minister Said Iraq Was In Civil War. Iyad Allawi former Interim Iraqi Prime Minister and leader of the Iraqi National List, a secular nationalist party made up of Sunnis and Shiites, said that Iraq was already in a civil war. Allawi said, ?It is unfortunate that we are in civil war. We are losing each day as an average 50 to 60 people throughout the country, if not more. If this is not civil war, then God knows what civil war is.? [BBC, 3/19/06]

Experts Say Iraq Has Been In A Civil War Since 2004. ??By the standard that political scientists use, there's been a civil war going on in Iraq since sovereignty was handed over to the interim government in 2004,? said Stanford University's James Fearon?American military analyst Stephen Biddle says U.S. policy-makers make a mistake if they ?miss the nature of the conflict, which in Iraq is already a civil war between rival ethnic and sectarian groups.?? [AP, 3/15/06; Los Angeles Times, 2/25/06; Washington Times, 3/15/06]

CHENEY: Clearly there is an attempt underway by the terrorists, by Zarqawi and others to foment civil war. That's been their strategy all along, but my view would be they?ve reached a stage of desperation from their standpoint. [Face The Nation, 3/19/06]

CIA: Iraq Is Insurgency?s Most Effective Training Camp. A new classified assessment by the Central Intelligence Agency says Iraq may prove to be an even more effective training ground for Islamic extremists than Afghanistan was in Al Qaeda's early days, because it is serving as a real-world laboratory for urban combat. [New York Times, 6/22/05]

CHENEY: The Iraqis met every single political deadline that's been set for them. They haven't missed a single one. [Face The Nation, 3/19/06]

Iraqis Missed Four Deadlines On Creation Of Iraqi Constitution. The Iraqi constitution was finally signed by Shite and Kurdish negotiators on August 28, 2005, after missing four deadlines that had been set for delivery of the document. Sunni negotiators refused to sign the document and pledged to fight against it. Saleh al-Mutlaq, a Sunni negotiator said, ?I think if this constitution passes as it is, it will worsen everything in the country.? [AP, 8/28/05]

CHENEY: On the security front we've seen major progress in terms of training and equipping Iraqi forces?That's the reality. [Face The Nation, 3/19/06]

Iraqi Police Are Infiltrated By Criminals, Religious and Ethnic Militia. ?Religious and ethnic militias and criminal organizations have infiltrated police in some areas, further undermining the fledgling force's effectiveness and credibility. Iraq's Sunni Muslim minority has accused some units of the Shiite Muslim-dominated force of kidnapping, torturing and murdering Sunnis.? Sectarian militias replaced Iraqi government forces in some areas after one of Shiite Islam's holiest shrines was bombed. In other areas, Shiite militiamen or members of Sunni insurgent groups have infiltrated police and military units. [The Philadelphia Inquirer, 3/6/06; Knight Ridder, 2/24/06]

Iraqi Police Hobbled By Corruption. General George Casey said the command has declared 2006 as the "year of the police," a tacit acknowledgment that the more than 80,000-strong Iraqi force has been hobbled by incompetence, corruption, sectarianism and low morale. [AP, 2/8/06]

CHENEY: [Iraqis have] been very successful now in terms of training and equipping over 100 battalions of Iraqi troops and it continues to improve day by day.[Face The Nation, 3/19/06]

We Can?t Even Get Straight Answers About How Many Trained Iraqi Troops There Are. The Bush Administration?s estimates of how many Iraqi troops have been trained continue to change:

February 2004: Rumsfeld says the number of Iraqis serving in the security forces was over 210,000, and that the number may grow to over 226,000 by April. [State Department, 2/24/04]

September 2004: Rumsfeld says the ?latest number, last week was 105,000. Now it looks to be 95,000 ? that is to say that are trained and equipped.? [DOD Briefing, 9/7/04]

February 2005: Rumsfeld says ??the fact of the matter is that there are 130,200 who have been trained and equipped?That's a fact. And how do I know that? I know it because General Petraeus counts them.? [Fox News, 2/1/05]

June 2005: Rumsfeld says the? fact of the matter is the number's [of trained troops is] 168,000.? [ABC News, 6/26/05]

July 2005: General Casey told told Congress that only three of the approximately 100 Iraqi army battalions are taking on the insurgents by themselves. Three battalions is approximately 700 soldiers. [Associated Press, 7/22/05; Knight Ridder, 11/30/05]

November 2005: President Bush says, ?40 Iraqi battalions are taking the lead in the fight.? He said a battalion is typically comprised of ?between 350 and 800 Iraqi forces,? which would bring the latest estimate of fully trained Iraqi troops to somewhere between 14,000 and 32,000. [Bush Speech in Annapolis, 11/30/05]

December 2005: When asked how many Iraqi troops were now able to stand alone without the backing of U.S. troops, President Bush said there were "about 200,000-plus capable" forces. He continued by saying that ? Now, not all of them are ready to take the fight to the enemy.? [Bush Speech, 12/12/05]

March 2006: President Bush says, ?60 Iraqi battalions are taking the lead in the fight.? He previously said a battalion is typically comprised of ?between 350 and 800 Iraqi forces,? which would bring the latest estimate of fully trained Iraqi troops to somewhere between 21,000 and 48,000. [Bush Speech, 3/13/06]


Instead of American Troops Being Drawn Down, 700 Additional Troops Sent to Iraq. ?Concerned about escalating violence as Iraq struggles to form a new government, the U.S. military has sent several hundred troops with tanks and other armor from Kuwait to the Baghdad area. It is the first time extra troops have been sent since December's parliamentary election, which was followed by a period of political wrangling and a wave of sectarian violence triggered by the bombing of a Shiite shrine on Feb. 22. Moving an Army battalion of about 700 soldiers from Kuwait is part of a broader plan, dubbed "Scales of Justice," that includes the repositioning of several thousand U.S. and Iraqi security forces inside Iraq?[G]eneral [Casey] did not say whether more troop increases might be needed this spring.? [AP, 3/15/06]

 

DealMonkey

Lifer
Nov 25, 2001
13,136
1
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When it comes to Iraq, the entire administration is irrationally exuberant. That goes for their strongest supporters too. You know, the "Where's the good news?" type of clowns you see around here? Problem is, you cannot polish a turd and that's exactly what Iraq has become - a giant steaming turd in the region. Good luck convincing the neighborhood that democracy is the coolest thing ever.

:|
 

RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
5,649
0
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You let anyone and everyone come and train how to fight.....and then you let them walk? I wonder how many US families have been destroyed by insurgents that were actually trained by the US military?

How can anyone consider this a sound policy?
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,845
8,438
136
When it comes to Iraq, the entire administration is irrationally exuberant.
i believe their irrational exuberance comes from the insane profits they're reaping from the "energy industries" part of their investment portfolios.

bush and fiends, errrr, f(r)iends, keeps the pot boiling in the middle east, gives the oil industry billions and billions in subsidies and tax credits and the oil robber barons keep supplies restricted by not re-investing their excess profits into building new infrastructure.

from their point of view, who would want to mess with something that keeps the outrageous amount of $$$ rolling in? things are the way they are because it's more or less the way they want it.

they have refined more than oil. they have been refining blood.

they've perfected the art of refining the blood of those who have been killed or maimed in the middle east into petrodollars.
 

DealMonkey

Lifer
Nov 25, 2001
13,136
1
0
How true, how true. Isn't that Cop 101? Follow the money, right? And imagine this - even if your investments (or deferred salary in Cheney's case) in military contractors and energy companies is locked in a "blind trust," those investments still go up. And after they leave office, they can then reap the benefits of a war economy. And then of course, the whole time you're in office, you can shrug your shoulders and mutter "blind trust" and that supposedly explains everything.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
66,353
14,761
146
I wonder how many US families have been destroyed by insurgents that were actually trained by the US military?

Sounds more and more like Vietnam. We'd train them by day as ARVN, kill them at night as they came back across the wire as NVA or VC...
 

CaptnKirk

Lifer
Jul 25, 2002
10,053
0
71
Originally posted by: BoomerD
I wonder how many US families have been destroyed by insurgents that were actually trained by the US military?

Sounds more and more like Vietnam. We'd train them by day as ARVN, kill them at night as they came back across the wire as NVA or VC...


That's been my position on our 'Training the Iraqi Army and Security Forces' for the last 3 years.
Teach them how to fight us from inside our perimiter so they have experience and knowledge of our tactics.
Just how many 'Insurgent Attacks' have turned out to be inside jobs.
I'd guess over 80%.