When using FSAA text is all blurry....

[gaterl8r]

Im running Quinqunx with my GF4... and in all my games the text isnt as sharp and its hard on the eyes... and in games like BF1942 demo the text is totally unreadable...
ANy ways to get around this?

 

[Emultra]

Maybe increase the resolution? There could be too rough edges so that it becomes blurry with AA.

 

[Rand]

Quincunx applied a blur filter on top of the AntiAliased scene, thats probably why your finding the text quite blurry.
You can somewhat off-set the blurriness of textures by enabling anisotropic filtering but at quite a performance hit.

Try enabling the typical 2X FSAA. it tends to be much crisper and not nearly as blurry as QuinCunx. It doesnt remove the jaggies quite as well though.

 

[mrman3k]

I always run my Ti4400 with 8X anisto. I do not like Quincunx because it just blurres the image. Instead either use 2X or 4X. If you have a GF4TI, use 4X AA, it is much better.

 

[spanky]

that happens with ym voodoo5 too.

 

[ViRGE]

On a side note, BF1942 has issues with AA anyways. On a GF4 at least, any AA mode will cause blurriness; there's something about the game's engine that doesn't work well with AA.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: Rand
Quincunx applied a blur filter on top of the AntiAliased scene, thats probably why your finding the text quite blurry.
You can somewhat off-set the blurriness of textures by enabling anisotropic filtering but at quite a performance hit.

Try enabling the typical 2X FSAA. it tends to be much crisper and not nearly as blurry as QuinCunx. It doesnt remove the jaggies quite as well though.

Sorry for going slightly offtopic but does anyone know if quincunx fsaa works with the geforce4 mx? There's an option for it in the drivers but quincunx filtering performs and looks similar to 2x fsaa when used with Quake3.

 

[Rand]

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

Originally posted by: Rand
Quincunx applied a blur filter on top of the AntiAliased scene, thats probably why your finding the text quite blurry.
You can somewhat off-set the blurriness of textures by enabling anisotropic filtering but at quite a performance hit.

Try enabling the typical 2X FSAA. it tends to be much crisper and not nearly as blurry as QuinCunx. It doesnt remove the jaggies quite as well though.

Sorry for going slightly offtopic but does anyone know if quincunx fsaa works with the geforce4 mx? There's an option for it in the drivers but quincunx filtering performs and looks similar to 2x fsaa when used with Quake3.

Yes it does, both the GF4 MX and GF4 Ti implement the same Quincunx rendering algorithym, the GF3 uses a slightly different method.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: Rand

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

Originally posted by: Rand
Quincunx applied a blur filter on top of the AntiAliased scene, thats probably why your finding the text quite blurry.
You can somewhat off-set the blurriness of textures by enabling anisotropic filtering but at quite a performance hit.

Try enabling the typical 2X FSAA. it tends to be much crisper and not nearly as blurry as QuinCunx. It doesnt remove the jaggies quite as well though.

Sorry for going slightly offtopic but does anyone know if quincunx fsaa works with the geforce4 mx? There's an option for it in the drivers but quincunx filtering performs and looks similar to 2x fsaa when used with Quake3.

Yes it does, both the GF4 MX and GF4 Ti implement the same Quincunx rendering algorithym, the GF3 uses a slightly different method.

If that's the case then why have an option for 2x fsaa when it looks identical to Quincunx and performs exactly the same as well?

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

Originally posted by: Rand

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

Originally posted by: Rand
Quincunx applied a blur filter on top of the AntiAliased scene, thats probably why your finding the text quite blurry.
You can somewhat off-set the blurriness of textures by enabling anisotropic filtering but at quite a performance hit.

Try enabling the typical 2X FSAA. it tends to be much crisper and not nearly as blurry as QuinCunx. It doesnt remove the jaggies quite as well though.

Sorry for going slightly offtopic but does anyone know if quincunx fsaa works with the geforce4 mx? There's an option for it in the drivers but quincunx filtering performs and looks similar to 2x fsaa when used with Quake3.

Yes it does, both the GF4 MX and GF4 Ti implement the same Quincunx rendering algorithym, the GF3 uses a slightly different method.

If that's the case then why have an option for 2x fsaa when it looks identical to Quincunx and performs exactly the same as well?

Because it doesn't look the same. Quincunx is slightly more draining, and causes more blurriness than 2x FSAA.

 

[Rand]

If that's the case then why have an option for 2x fsaa when it looks identical to Quincunx and performs exactly the same as well?

Quincunx is slightly slower then reg 2X MSAA, and tends to be significantly blurrier.
On the other hand it's marginally better at dealing with jaggies, and doesnt suffer quite as much from alpha textures.

Personally I despise Quincunx, even the latest implementation I find to be so blurry that it just destroys texture quality. Anisotropic filtering can clear up the blurriness but that comes at an additional performance hit and can't counteract the loss of texture accuracy caused by Quincunx.

Quincunx seems to be one of those methods that you either love or hate. Some people swear by it, others consider it worse then no AA.

 

[AdvancedRobotics]

The reason for the bluriness is because anti-aliasing is based on the final 2d image rather than the 3d space. Closer images seem fine, while images further away show more signs of bluriness. As for the text, I believe it is caused when the images are being blended together. There is no way to get rid of these side-effects if AA, but you can always run at a higher resolution, which eliminates the stupid jaggies, but doesn't incur the same side-effects of AA.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: Rand

If that's the case then why have an option for 2x fsaa when it looks identical to Quincunx and performs exactly the same as well?

Quincunx is slightly slower then reg 2X MSAA, and tends to be significantly blurrier.
On the other hand it's marginally better at dealing with jaggies, and doesnt suffer quite as much from alpha textures.

Personally I despise Quincunx, even the latest implementation I find to be so blurry that it just destroys texture quality. Anisotropic filtering can clear up the blurriness but that comes at an additional performance hit and can't counteract the loss of texture accuracy caused by Quincunx.

Quincunx seems to be one of those methods that you either love or hate. Some people swear by it, others consider it worse then no AA.

That's the whole point, with the GF4 MX440 there is no difference between 2x or Quincunx, they look identical and perform exactly the same at ALL resolutions. I've done screenshot comparisons using Quake3 and there is no difference in image quality. I'll have to do more testing with other games and when I get my replacement Ti4600 (overclocked it just abit too much but if anyone asks it just failed) I'll be in a better position to compare screenshots.

 

[nemesismk2]

Originally posted by: Asuka
The reason for the bluriness is because anti-aliasing is based on the final 2d image rather than the 3d space. Closer images seem fine, while images further away show more signs of bluriness. As for the text, I believe it is caused when the images are being blended together. There is no way to get rid of these side-effects if AA, but you can always run at a higher resolution, which eliminates the stupid jaggies, but doesn't incur the same side-effects of AA.

I think along those lines too, it's always better to use a higher resolution than fsaa.

 

[ViRGE]

Originally posted by: nemesismk2

I think along those lines too, it's always better to use a higher resolution than fsaa.

Not nessisarily. At higher resolutions, there's still the issue of solid boundries between say the ground and the sky, as the video card makes no attempt to mix the 2(although the eye does somewhat). Now, with a proper AA routine(We're going to use SuperSampling in this case), the image is also rendered has a higher resolution, but the pixels are blended back down to fit the screen, meaning there are no true solid edges. As a side effect, SS cleans up the scene slightly too, as it's shrinking a high quality imagine, meaning you're technically dropping data, instead of reusing data, such as expanding an image, or in MultiSampling. SS is very bandwidth intensive though, which is why is was dropped in favor of MS, which tends to blur text slightly. That said, if MS is done correctly, you won't notice any sort of text bluring; I've used GF3's and GF4's with games such as Tribes1/2, UT, etc, which all have text that is just as sharp with or without FSAA. Now, in games like BF1942 where MS isn't done correctly(either due to how the engine works, or a driver deficency), it can result in text blurring. Realisticly, as long as the game doesn't have a problem with MS, I find that it's worth the effort to use FSAA.

 

[MithShrike]

OK, for all of you who don't know the GeForce 2 and GeForce 4 MX's use supersampling AA. This makes a major performance hit for those with little memory... OK peace.