What's worse, murder or gang rape?

[randomrogue]

Met a guy last weekend from Acapulco and he was talking about how his family is dealing with the new level of crime there. It's scary. If you're not aware there was recently a gang rape where 5 men gang raped 6 women for 3 hours while letting a 7th go since she was Mexican.

http://world.time.com/2013/02/08/a-...os-decline-but-what-of-mexicos-other-resorts/

Then I read 2 days ago about a 12 year old who was prepped with sex toys and numbing cream while as many as 10 men were invited to sex parties where she was gang raped.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-21578312

Gang rape is also used as a weapon of war. Sudan had quite a bit of media attention about this and reports are coming out of Syria as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_rape
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ear-of-rape-driving-Syria-refugee-crisis.html

So I ask, which is worse? Are they equal? Should the punishment for both be the same? I personally can't draw a distinction between either and think they're on par and both are absolutely terrible. I'd throw both types of offenders in prison for life.

 

[Jaskalas]

I would classify it as torture. From that frame of reference it's easy to see how it's worse than straight up murder, but the two are often mixed so it's difficult to generalize and claim accuracy.

When both are horrific enough to warrant maximum penalty, is it necessary to compare? I suppose murder at least has manslaughter, accidents and such. Mitigating circumstances. This has none.

 

[jackstar7]

Those acts are horrible. Murder is the worst thing though.

 

[randomrogue]

Those acts are horrible. Murder is the worst thing though.

Is it though? Who's the bigger monster - the guy in Switzerland who shot and killed 2 people today or these guys who gang raped 6 women?

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Is it though? Who's the bigger monster - the guy in Switzerland who shot and killed 2 people today or these guys who gang raped 6 women?

Why do we need to gauge the degree of monstrosity? They're all horrible people and they all should be in prison forever or dead (depending on your stance on the death penalty).

Personally, I think rape / torture is a truly awful thing. But in those situations, the victim has a chance to make a recovery. In murder, there's no opportunity for the victim to move on with their life. And that makes it worse.

 

[Pohemi]

I suppose murder at least has manslaughter, accidents and such. Mitigating circumstances. This has none.

This is my thought as well. Not that there's ever really a "justifiable" reason for murder, in the true sense of the word (not including self-defense or protection of family, etc), but there are circumstances where the line between true murder and incidental killing may get blurred.

There is never, ever, a case where rape (much less repeated gang-rape) is excusable or justifiable. Ever. In my opinion it's basically the most horrific act one human can inflict upon another.

 

[jackstar7]

Is it though? Who's the bigger monster - the guy in Switzerland who shot and killed 2 people today or these guys who gang raped 6 women?

Are you holding a contest?

 

[SMOGZINN]

Is gang rape worse then single rape for the perpetrator?
If you participated in a gang rape are you worse then a normal rapist?

 

[randomrogue]

Are you holding a contest?

Not at all. In my opinion though the bigger monster is the gang rapist.

The maximum sentence for rape in California is 8 years. Thirteen years if the victim was a minor.

Luckily they can get you on more charges than just rape. A few years ago a group of men gang raped a 15 year old in Richmond. One was sentenced last year after pleading guilty to avoid life in prison from all his charges. One this year.

Manuel Ortega, who was an adult at the time of the crime and the most heavily-charged of the six defendants, pleaded guilty to all charges against him on September 6, accepting a 32-year sentence and avoiding possible life in prison. He was convicted of rape in concert, rape by a foreign object in concert, forced oral copulation in concert resulting in great bodily injury, and robbery. Ortega was described by authorities as an initiator in the rape, with witnesses alleging he ripped off the girl's clothes, punched and kicked her in the head, sexually assaulted her and encouraged others to do the same. On October 19, 2012, Ortega was sentenced to 32 years in prison.

On January 11, 2013, Ari Morales was sentenced to 27 years in prison.

 

[skyking]

If we are talking some sort of scale, ending a person's life has to be at the very end of it IMO. The rapists can occupy the space directly below that.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Premeditated murder vs. torture?

I think they're both at the level where the person doing it deserves to have their organs harvested.

 

[Dr. Zaus]

I think they're both at the level where the person doing it deserves to have their organs harvested.

Organ harvesting... I like your position, do you have a news letter I can subscribe to?

 

[lotus503]

I would say murder is worse, but I have never been gang raped

 

[Dr. Zaus]

I would say murder is worse, but I have never been gang raped

But you have been murdered....

 

[lotus503]

But you have been murdered....

Not that either, more wondering if I had been ganged raped I would wish I just was murdered.

If i'm dead I don't care about much after that.

 

[Mursilis]

Not at all. In my opinion though the bigger monster is the gang rapist.

The maximum sentence for rape in California is 8 years. Thirteen years if the victim was a minor.

Luckily they can get you on more charges than just rape. A few years ago a group of men gang raped a 15 year old in Richmond. One was sentenced last year after pleading guilty to avoid life in prison from all his charges. One this year.

I'm disgusted to read in that wiki article you linked about the rape that two dozen people witnessed the assault take place, and did nothing. Lots of people recorded it though, on cell phone cameras!

 

[randomrogue]

I'm disgusted to read in that wiki article you linked about the rape that two dozen people witnessed the assault take place, and did nothing. Lots of people recorded it though, on cell phone cameras!

Testimony suggested that the crime was even more brutal than was previously known, as assailants allegedly raped, punched, stomped and urinated upon the nearly unconscious girl over the course of two hours in front of numerous onlookers.

https://www.baycitizen.org/news/crime/hearing-reveals-horrific-details-crime/

 

[Charles Kozierok]

Pretty awful stuff.

All I know is that I have no interest in going to Mexico any time in the near future. There are lots of places in that part of the world that seem at least as nice and a lot safer.

 

[irishScott]

I'm in the camp that says gang rape is the worse crime. Murder is quick, and what is considered murder under the law may not be morally wrong in context.

Rape of any variety is torture. It is a sustained activity that has no purpose but to inflict continuous pain and injury. Moreover it requires the perpetrator to be sexually aroused by inflicting severe physical and emotional trauma on others.

Between the two, gang-rape requires the more twisted mentality. I'd say the men who gang-raped that Indian woman to death far exceed the Sandy Hook killer in terms of pure evil.

 

[Dr. Zaus]

So pro-death-penalty folks: we're agreed that gang-rape should be death-penalty optional?

 

[jackstar7]

I'm in the camp that says gang rape is the worse crime. Murder is quick, and what is considered murder under the law may not be morally wrong in context.

Rape of any variety is torture. It is a sustained activity that has no purpose but to inflict continuous pain and injury. Moreover it requires the perpetrator to be sexually aroused by inflicting severe physical and emotional trauma on others.

Between the two, gang-rape requires the more twisted mentality. I'd say the men who gang-raped that Indian woman to death far exceed the Sandy Hook killer in terms of pure evil.

"Murder is quick"? How do you reach that conclusion?

 

[Dr. Zaus]

"Murder is quick"? How do you reach that conclusion?

Seriously, murder takes the rest of your life.

 

[randomrogue]

Well in that case one of the attackers ripped out 95% of her intestines with a rusted tire iron and his bare hands after raping her twice.

These crimes are so horrific that they defy explanation.

 

[irishScott]

"Murder is quick"? How do you reach that conclusion?

Murder is the act of premeditated killing. Torture is the act of inflicting prolonged suffering. Granted you can torture someone then murder them at the end, but they're two distinct acts.

 

[werepossum]

Why do we need to gauge the degree of monstrosity? They're all horrible people and they all should be in prison forever or dead (depending on your stance on the death penalty).

Personally, I think rape / torture is a truly awful thing. But in those situations, the victim has a chance to make a recovery. In murder, there's no opportunity for the victim to move on with their life. And that makes it worse.

I agree with this.