What's with all these games that require at least a $400 gfx card??

[jthg]

It seems like every game I look at these days require at least something like a 7900 GTX to run decently and a GeForce 8800 GTX to run well. That's a $400 graphics card just to run the game at 25fps and with a good portion of the effects you paid for turned on. (and probably $800 to run well)

I'm personally a fan of laptops - and not those portable desktops - laptops. I bought one with an ATI x1400 256mb thinking that I'd at least be able to play games at the lowest settings. Well, I was completely wrong. I'm into RPGs more than other types of games and the last two major ones to come out, Oblivion and NWN2, destroys my x1400 (according to benchmarks). Completely unplayable. Well you know what Bethesda and Obsidian? I don't @#$%ing care about your graphics engine. I play the game for the game play. Couldn't they just have put in a lower quality engine so that I'd at least be able to play the @#$% game?

How does this make business sense? Why cut off every potentional customer who isn't willing to sink $400 into just a graphics card? (or like me, at least $1000 into a desktop) Did everyone just get richer and I don't know about it? As far as I know, it's not that hard to develop a lower quality engine that can be swapped in for lower specced systems. Why force me to not buy either game when I was really interested in playing them?

 

[bennylong]

Yea, I got into Vanguard Saga of Hero Beta and played it for 2 hours and realized it sucked ass unless I wanted to upgrade to a $2000 computer. Screw that. No wonder WoW is so popular in China, you can play that game on a crappy computer, which most chinese people have.

 

[animalia]

? what games cant you run?

 

[jthg]

Originally posted by: bennylong
Yea, I got into Vanguard Saga of Hero Beta and played it for 2 hours and realized it sucked ass unless I wanted to upgrade to a $2000 computer. Screw that. No wonder WoW is so popular in China, you can play that game on a crappy computer, which most chinese people have.

Heh, exactly. Which is why I've been playing WoW recently. The game has it's problems though and it's getting old real fast, especially since I don't find anything in the Burning Crusade very interesting...

 

[jthg]

Originally posted by: animalia
? what games cant you run?

I listed two of them.

A game that I applaud though, is Half Life 2, which I can run. I don't really find the graphics in Oblivion and NWN 2 much better. Sure Oblivion has fancier shaders, but I don't think they make the game any more immersive than what the Source engine provides.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Bullshit. My 7900GT can play all games perfectly and that cost me $200.

 

[So]

I agree w/ HB. I'm still happy w/ my 6800GT.

 

[doze]

Exactly the reason I'm giving up on pc games. Every game will run right and you don't have to deal with hour long installs and stupid anti copyright procedures.

 

[jthg]

Originally posted by: HamburgerBoy
Bullshit. My 7900GT can play all games perfectly and that cost me $200.

Hm, whats your standard of perfect?

My standard of barely playable is avg. 20 fps, 800x600, 0% quality (whatever that means...)

My standard of OK is 20+ fps, 1280x768 and 50% quality

My standard of perfect is 35fps, 1440x900, and 90% quality

My standard of beyond awsome is 40fps, 1680x1050, and 99% quality

 

[dderidex]

Originally posted by: HamburgerBoy
Bullshit. My 7900GT can play all games perfectly and that cost me $200.

*shrugs*

I know what you are saying. I bought a GeForce 7900GS for $150. Heck, it CAME WITH Half-Life 2: Episode 1, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic, and Hitman: Blood Money. That's, what, $150 in PC games?

Plays every game I want to play, all settings maxed. (Yes, even 'Oblivion').

Dunno what the OP's complaint is.

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

Errr....no, that's not going to happen anytime soon. (That said, I'm running this with a dual-core AMD Opteron 165 @ 2.1ghz in a Shuttle XPC...so my system isn't much bigger than a toaster as it is...it's just more upgradeable.)

 

[jthg]

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

No, that's not what I want. I just want some way, regardless of the quality, for my x1400 to run these games at 20+ fps.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Originally posted by: jthg
Hm, whats your standard of perfect?

My standard of barely playable is avg. 20 fps, 800x600, 0% quality (whatever that means...)

My standard of OK is 20+ fps, 1280x768 and 50% quality

My standard of perfect is 35fps, 1440x900, and 90% quality

My standard of beyond awsome is 40fps, 1680x1050, and 99% quality

I haven't played Oblivion yet, but according to Anandtech it doesn't sound too bad to me. Unless you're a total graphics whore that must have HDR and mega AA, a $200 video card is plenty.

 

[intogamer]

Hey man the more new graphics cards they produce... cheaper the older ones

 

[BillyBatson]

mmy 6600gt still plays games very well! granted a lot of the newer stuff isn't the greatest at my 1680x1050 so i have to turn down other things but i can sitll play them and enjoy them.

i agree though it does suck for the laptop people. when i read the title i was going to come in here and tell you to stop whining and that we pay for new games not old ones but after you mentioend laptops and it wasn't somethign i had heard of i agree, they should provide an option to tone down the graphics, it may suck but at least u will be able to play

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: jthg

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

No, that's not what I want. I just want some way, regardless of the quality, for my x1400 to run these games at 20+ fps.

an x1400 can't run NWN2 at 8x6?

 

[Vette73]

My X800 pro plays everything i throw at it at 1280x1024. I don;t use AA or any of that as I see little difference when I am playing fast moving games.

That and gameplay > Graphics

 

[jthg]

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: jthg

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

No, that's not what I want. I just want some way, regardless of the quality, for my x1400 to run these games at 20+ fps.

an x1400 can't run NWN2 at 8x6?

Heh, if only the ATI drivers let you set custom resolutions like the Nvidia drivers.

 

[Whisper]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975
My X800 pro plays everything i throw at it at 1280x1024. I don;t use AA or any of that as I see little difference when I am playing fast moving games.

That and gameplay > Graphics

Same here...my x800xl runs both Oblivion and NWN2 quite well at 1280x1024 (native res on my monitor). I don't set everything to uber-l33t extreme, but it's still in the average to above-average range and looks great.

My laptop's Go 7900GS also does fine, although it struggles a bit with NWN2 in outdoor scenes if I try to run it at the native 1900x1200 in high; so I back it down a few resolution slots, lower the graphics to medium in some areas (i.e. turn off some shadows), and I'm good to go.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: jthg

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: jthg

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

No, that's not what I want. I just want some way, regardless of the quality, for my x1400 to run these games at 20+ fps.

an x1400 can't run NWN2 at 8x6?

Heh, if only the ATI drivers let you set custom resolutions like the Nvidia drivers.

hmmm, that is weaksauce. one good idea for desktops is to upgrade to the last generation's high end. so when the 78/900's were kickin, i upgraded to an X850XT for pretty cheap

 

[BurnItDwn]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this the approximate performance level of the x1400?

Core Clock: 432 MHz
Memory Clock: 396 MHz (792 DDR)
Memory Bandwidth: ~12.6 GB/sec
Shader Operations: 1728 Operations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate: 1728 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate: 1728 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations: 216 MVertices/sec


My X1800xt is several generations old, I bought it over 6 months ago for around $250.
It's got a Fill Rate of around 10000 MTexels/sec and 48GB of memmory bandwidth at stock speeds.

No wonder why your laptop sucks for recent games
My video card (which is probably worth less than $200, yet can handle every game at 1920x1200 with moderate to high settings) is between 3.8 and 5.7 times as fast as your video card. I consider my card to be "midrange" among the pack. It was "high end" when it was new, but the X1900 has come since then, and the X1950, and now the 8800 ...

Now something like the 8800GTS, the ~$400ish vid card, has a fill rate of 24Mtexels/sec and 64GB of memory bandwidth.

For reference purposes, a Geforce 6600GT has more than double the fill rate of yoour card & about 50% more memmory bandwidth. Last time I checked, they were around $100 used.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but it sounds like whatever salesman tried to convince you that an x1400 was in any way shape or form a "good" gaming card pulled a fast one on you.

I am at a loss as to why you aren't able to lower the resolution though. I'd think that it would help your playability a great deal. Oblivion should run decently at 800x600 with low settings on something with those stats.

 

[OVerLoRDI]

What you are saying makes a lot of sense. Why alienate a portion of your audience by making games that are not playable for those who don't have awesome hardware?

Really what needs to happen is PC games need to spend more time getting properly coded. Example: Battlefield 2, Neverwinter Nights 2. It seems to me that games are rushed out the door with the belief that they can be patched later, but in reality games should come shipped in a working state, that will run on an "average machine". (by average I don't mean Intel Extreme)

Games should be optimized to run on the average machine, or like the OP says possibly alternate engines for less capable computers, or more choice in regards to graphic options. One company that is really good about making games run on any machine is definitely Blizzard. Look at Starcraft, Warcraft III and even WoW, some of the most popular games of all time and they run on the average machine.

Note to the op, the latest NWN2 patch helps a lot in regards to performance, also make sure you turn off the water reflections and refractions, they are poorly coded and lag like MAD.

Latest video drivers could help a lot as well.

 

[NaOH]

Wow........you do realize graphics cards in laptops aren't up to par with desktop graphics cards right?

 

[lobbyone]

That is why Dell also sells XPS for gaming purposes.

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: jthg

Originally posted by: Fenixgoon

Originally posted by: jthg

Oh, wait, yes I do - he wants laptops to be as powerful and upgradeable as desktop PCs for the same price.

No, that's not what I want. I just want some way, regardless of the quality, for my x1400 to run these games at 20+ fps.

an x1400 can't run NWN2 at 8x6?

Heh, if only the ATI drivers let you set custom resolutions like the Nvidia drivers.

Ever heard of Omega drivers?

 

[mercanucaribe]

Originally posted by: lobbyone
That is why Dell also sells XPS for gaming purposes.

Dell's XPS laptops are not gaming machine except for the 17" model... Ironically, their Alienware laptops are not gaming laptops except for the 17" model either.